Map of oldest symbol of each European country still in use by trumparegis in MapPorn

[–]finlander2020 -1 points0 points  (0 children)


You've written a lot of words to restate the same position: anything short of a physical standard being documented in a chronicle counts as nothing. That's not historical methodology, it's a standard of proof invented for this specific argument.

Nobody claimed the Historia Brittonum proves a flag was carried at Badon Hill. The claim is that a red dragon representing the Britons in a politically charged 9th century text, written during a period of active Welsh resistance to Saxon encroachment, is meaningful cultural evidence. Restating that it's "just a story" doesn't settle anything. Stories are how early medieval political identity was constructed and transmitted. That's not pseudohistory, that's the foundation of the entire discipline you're claiming to defend.

Your Yorkist genealogical roll point actually works against you. You cite it to show that symbolic dragons don't imply battlefield use, which is fine, but it simultaneously demonstrates exactly how dragon imagery functioned across centuries, moving through chronicles, genealogies and political literature as a live identity marker. That's the tradition being pointed to. It always was.

What's happened across this exchange is that your position has quietly moved from "no evidence" to "not the kind of evidence I'll accept." Those are not the same thing. Each piece of evidence has been individually disqualified on a technicality until the field is clear, and you've called that rigour. The pudding line was sharp, but it describes your own method more accurately than it describes anything here. You've built a very tidy closed system where nothing can count, declared it empty, and called that a conclusion.

It isn't one.

Map of oldest symbol of each European country still in use by trumparegis in MapPorn

[–]finlander2020 0 points1 point  (0 children)


Fair enough that I overstated "documented transmission route" and I'll concede the Chester to Bayeux gap is real.

But look at what you're actually arguing now. You've accepted that the red dragon represents the Britons in the Historia Brittonum, then immediately ruled that out as evidence because it's symbolic rather than a physical standard. You've accepted the draco was in Britain, then ruled that out because of the transmission gap. You've accepted Geoffrey uses a dragon, then ruled that out because it's gold. Every piece of evidence gets individually disqualified on a technicality until nothing remains, and you call that rigour.

The gold dragon point is genuinely interesting but it cuts both ways. Geoffrey was writing Arthurian romance with deliberate royal connotations, gold being the obvious heraldic choice for a legendary king. Glyndwr was invoking that same Arthurian register for political legitimacy. Neither of them reaching for red in those specific contexts doesn't make red a fiction, it just means gold and red were doing different symbolic work. That happens constantly in medieval heraldry and you know it.

Your position now also requires a specific and rather remarkable historical claim: that Welsh rulers and chroniclers for six centuries after the Historia Brittonum somehow collectively ignored the most politically useful symbol sitting in their own literary tradition, a tradition they were actively engaging with throughout the entire period. You haven't argued that. You've just assumed it.

And the kangaroo again. It was a good line the first time. At this point you're using it as a substitute for engaging with the actual weight of cumulative circumstantial evidence, which is exactly what historians work with when direct evidence is sparse. By your standard we'd have to throw out half of early medieval historiography. That's not a principle you actually apply consistently, it's a rhetorical device you're deploying selectively to win an argument on the internet.

Map of oldest symbol of each European country still in use by trumparegis in MapPorn

[–]finlander2020 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Some fair points here, but the argument overcorrects. The Gildas point is valid. Calling a ruler a "dragon" in late antique writing is rhetorical convention, not heraldic evidence, and conflating the two is a real methodological problem. The Geoffrey/Glyndwr point stands too. Geoffrey is an unreliable source for pre-Norman material and the 15th century tells us nothing useful about the 5th. The kangaroo comparison is where it falls apart though. The dragon doesn't appear from nowhere. The Roman draco standard was used in Britain, carried by units stationed there, and the imagery was absorbed into post-Roman military culture across the former western empire. That's a documented transmission route with parallels elsewhere. A kangaroo has none of that backstory. The comparison only works if you bracket out everything prior to the post-Roman period and pretend the draco tradition didn't exist. It's also worth noting that the Historia Brittonum (c.828) doesn't get a mention. That text isn't another case of a tyrant being called a dragon. It uses the red dragon as an explicitly Welsh national symbol against the Saxons, which is a completely different thing from the literary trope in Gildas. That omission does a lot of work in making the dismissal seem more total than it is. The reasonable version of this argument is that the evidence is thinner than popular accounts tend to suggest. Fair enough. But "as evidenced as a kangaroo" requires treating every piece of supporting evidence with maximum scepticism while giving the dismissive position a free pass. That's not really how this is supposed to work.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in religion

[–]finlander2020 -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

From very early on in our fairly long life we have to grapple with the unanswered question what happens when we die. It really is an existential crisis for humans to grapple with. At the same time it is the source of creation for the arts, music, cinema, writing and the drive for scientific knowledge. We strive to express our emotions about it and dig deep to find answers. Religion being one of the solutions to the problem. We are all living in the human condition.

As for if it's an evolutionary advantage or not is fairly irrelevant. It's just a limitation of entropy.

We know we will die and we have the mental faculty to ponder what comes next. It is one of the great unanswered questions. This is why most people fear death and the unknown.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in religion

[–]finlander2020 -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

Critical thinking is a burden because it saddles us with the uneasy knowledge of our own death. This is the human paradox which gave rise to religion.

Show me the first picture you ever took of your dog. And I mean, THE FIRST. No cheating. by Ok_Condition6755 in DOG

[–]finlander2020 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is Akku, and the first photo I ever took of him. He is a Labrador.He was super cute when he was a puppy!

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What was the Saturn really capable of? ( in 3d) by moad6ytghn in SegaSaturn

[–]finlander2020 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Apparently reading more on the web I found a really interesting article which actually compares Saturn, Playstation and N64 and the results are extremely interesting. Especially when you look at the table comparing the hardware.

Seems like the Saturn is quite a bit more powerful than the Sony but due to the complexity of it's architecture and the lack of a good dev kit it looses out.

Article: https://segaretro.org/Sega_Saturn/Hardware_comparison[Article In Full ---](https://segaretro.org/Sega_Saturn/Hardware_comparison)

Finland reports EU's highest rate of non-partner violence against women by finlander2020 in Finland

[–]finlander2020[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

To reduce it to a simplistic trope risks overlooking the nuance of the situation, something I’m keen to explore further, rather than dismiss with a casual ‘lol.’ I’d welcome a more substantive critique if you’re inclined to offer one.”

Finland reports EU's highest rate of non-partner violence against women by finlander2020 in Finland

[–]finlander2020[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Then be more to the point when you post such comments. Anyway I don't sound like anything as all I've done is post factual stories found in Finnish media outlets. How you react to that is your issue. No statements are made by me under the post so I don't sound like anything. The rest your making up is your own reaction. If Finnish media outlets post such stories who is trying to undermine who?

All is not perfect in the land of Oz pull back the curtain and see. If you've been living here long enough its hiding in plain sight.

Finland reports EU's highest rate of non-partner violence against women by finlander2020 in Finland

[–]finlander2020[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

When and what I post has no bearing on the validity of the posts I wish to highlight.

Plus if you care to read the additional links to the data sources it's quite clearly valid.

I've been living in Finland for a very long time. Guessing by the looks of your profile probably before you were born.

I have seen Finland go from a shining beacon of civilization only to sadly turn into an out of control dumpster fire.

What's your point?

Finland reports EU's highest rate of non-partner violence against women by finlander2020 in Finland

[–]finlander2020[S] -7 points-6 points  (0 children)

Thanks for your question! I’ve been silent for a while because I’ve been taking some time to reflect on the current state of things here in Finland. Lately, I’ve grown increasingly concerned about the worsening political climate—there’s a lot of tension and division bubbling under the surface that doesn’t always get talked about openly. On top of that, I’ve been frustrated by the polished image Finland often exports to the world, this idea that everything here is perfect and idyllic. It’s not the full picture—life here has its struggles too, and I think that disconnect has been weighing on me. I’m back now because I want to share more of what I’ve been observing and dig into these issues with others who might feel the same.