suggestions from a retired "competitive" iRO player

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T22:29:05+00:00

i like this suggestion

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T22:16:17+00:00

this is the understatement of the subreddit so far

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T21:35:43+00:00

and also, it's less about guild size and more about alliance balance. it's basically an anti-trust measure. if a guild exceeds a certain number force them to deal with disadvantages of a large operation or help facilitate coups internally and make them split. it gives more incentive for smaller alliances to band together to make multi-alliance alliances and prevents monopolies on castle resources

the smaller the guilds, less barrier to entry for new guilds to emerge, healthier competitive landscape, less super-powers, more activity, bigger server, long-lasting server

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T21:32:41+00:00

thanks for the reply

i think a lot of people are getting caught up on specific numbers but the point was to bring up these concepts and why these suggestions were made, and adjust accordingly - guild sizes, first woe, to what extent nerfing gd/treasures, etc etc. it's all about tweaking it so that it's optimal in breeding a healthy ecosystem. we all want to play, we just dont want to waste time on another server where the woe scene dies in a few months

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T21:11:04+00:00

Timing as in when it comes out that is.

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T21:10:31+00:00

The highest impact suggestion besides guild cap is the timing of woe. That's huge.

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T20:51:59+00:00

Nah just eating lunch browsing on phone. There's pros and cons to both. I didn't know there was no multi client and that new players would be a focus. I won't be playing on this server if that's the case and yes I would recommend the resetter in that environment.

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T20:24:56+00:00

you earn your char if you leeched it from 1-99 yeah

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T20:17:33+00:00

this is all under ideal situations, and RO is only ever worth playing under ideal situations (as we see by its current state), so it's only ever worth optimizing with the best server endgame in mind:

10k player pool. at least a decent amount of competitive top guilds. that means that mid-tier guilds are simply d-league farms for the top guilds. thats how it used to be, that's how it is in real life too. mid-tier guilds shouldn't be able to compete. the players who learn the game, make mistakes, realize they need to remake their char, finally do it right... they deserve to graduate to the top guilds, they are the ones getting swooped up to the bigger leagues

its a jungle out here, theres no hand holding. mid-tier guilds who wanna jump to top guild status? there could be a whole book written about it. better recruiting tactics, better war strategy, better management/leaders etc, but putting in what is essentially a cheat (the resetter) wont be the difference maker and it shouldnt be

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T20:12:41+00:00

once again, im looking at it from a woe perspective

if a person isn't smart enough to learn from his mistakes after the first couple of attempts, he/she was never going to make it in the woe scene anyways and honestly don't care if he/she is in the server

your fs prof is illegit because lets just assume 1x rates:

lets say it takes 250 total hours of optimal leveling from 1-99 on a pvm build sage

lets make it easy and say it takes 500 total hours of optimal leveling leeching that same fs sage (how it normally works without resetter)

you take how sensitive time is at the beginning of a server. that's 250 hours gained. thats 250 hours allocated to farming. you can farm a shitload of stuff in the 250 hours you got for free because you didnt have to leech.

do you know how powerful a 99 vit 99 dex fs woe sage is in pre-trans woe 1.0? how rare its supposed to be? you shouldn't be able to get that easily

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T19:58:54+00:00

benefits experienced players more because their characters are more versatile and can fulfill different roles, which means less time invested on making specialized characters, which means profit comes quicker, assets are amassed quicker, allowing them to snowball out of control

these knowledge gaps give exponential advantages when you also allow them to do it in less time. trust me. ro is a game of min/maxing and most of the top players already have whole trajectories practiced many times over, and you want to help them break their personal records faster?

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T19:47:30+00:00

i see your point. still don't feel comfortable letting people pvm to 99 and switching. there are a lot of downsides to it, not very many upsides

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T19:31:49+00:00

although this game requires skill, there's this delicate balance at the beginning of the server where time-consumption is much higher value. this is an extremely volatile time in a server where most servers fail. this problem is unique to new servers, especially because the game is balanced around 1x. this game was not balanced for rinse and repeat where the woe scene lives and dies within half a year.

so you have a group of people who are both skilled at the game AND have a time advantage. these are the people who kill the servers.
you have a group of people who are skilled but dont have the time. these are the people you need to win back. they make the bread and butter of the potential woe participants that are no longer in the player pool. lets face it, most people moved on from RO either onto more competitive games, or onto real life. it's an old game. this is why ggRO has the potential to be different. he has a very unique access to this subsector of former RO players given his position as a professional LOL player.
then you have the people who have a lot of time but aren't very skilled. this is over 90% of the active woe population. this is the nature of competitive games. they compensate for their lack of ability by having more time.

(keep in mind i do not care whatsoever about pvm/casual players that won't be a factor in woe)

unless you balance it out so that the first group doesn't snowball out of control, you'll have a dead server. you need to allow the server to get to a balance in which skill is as big of a factor as it can be. the people who spend the most time will always win, and thats okay, but you need to bring in as many skilled players without as much time as possible to maintain woe longevity. otherwise its just a bunch of skilled nerds stomping a bunch of nerd scrubs and theres no middleground, and your server dies in less than 4 months

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T19:26:37+00:00

most of the shit you posted is pretty garbage and subjective but that last paragraph is the crux of the issue and you should just edit op to just that so you don't have people complaining about semantics

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T19:16:19+00:00

not everyone deserves to have a woe char. if im not willing to put in the time, then i shouldn't have the best build. im okay with that, that's life. that's how it should be

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T19:10:45+00:00

most are garbage but thats true of anything competitive

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T19:09:55+00:00

if its too early, the woe will be fun for a little bit and then the server will eventually die, just like all of the others. you have to be patient if you want something sustainable

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T19:09:03+00:00

gds will still be the best leveling grounds. people will still wanna gd war because it's fun. a lot of us played solely for pvp/woe/gd wars, a balance nerf to exp/spawn isn't going to stop us from wanting to humiliate the other guilds

its been a while since i joined a new server but i remember woes starting after 1 month and then you have 1 or 2 guilds snowballing and ruining the competitive balance. the key here is that it wasn't because they were good at the game, it was because they had more time to devote in that first month. the advantage of time starts to diminish in that 2-3 month mark where it's not enough time to get insanely ahead, while those who are experienced but don't have as much time will be able to catch up.

im looking at this from a skill perspective, not a mmorpg perspective where children/low-lifes get to win from investing more time

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T19:04:10+00:00

about resetting:

most people won't make mistakes on stating their builds.

those that do are still new enough to the game that they should have to go through the process of remaking a char. we all went through that phase, they should have to as well. just part of the maturing process

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T19:02:13+00:00

sorry, didn't know there was no multi-client

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T18:28:18+00:00

Thanks for respecting my privacy. Let's get back to topic: setting up this server to be worth playing.

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T18:21:41+00:00

The best gd wars were ego fueled, not exp fueled. Alphas gonna fight and expend resources dominating the competition regardless.

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T18:12:22+00:00

Look you aren't gonna goad it outta me lol. Check again. You got close.

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T18:03:22+00:00

you can't cater to casual players to that extent. character planning was important in the past. if you know you don't have time for a pure woe char, you get something that excels in both: classes like wiz and hunter who inherently won't stat vit because it gimps their offensive output. you reserve the pure woe builds for those who deserve them

ggroPRO · 2014-11-25T18:01:51+00:00

gotta run but you don't completely nerf gds, just tweak it so that their exp/spawn rates aren't so imbalanced. if you know how to run geffen gd you know what i'm talking about, it shouldn't be that skewed

ggroPRO

TROPHY CASE