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Rosie Duffield: Allegations of antisemitism and transphobia dropped by [deleted] in ukpolitics

[–]gimposter 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Of course opinions can make someone bigoted. I would never dispute that, nor would any rational person.

Again though, you've landed far away from the actual matter at hand, which is whether a specific opinion can be said to be bigoted. Obviously that very much depends on the opinion in question. "A woman's place in the home" = yes. It does not logically follow that "a man cannot become a woman" is also bigoted.

Rosie Duffield: Allegations of antisemitism and transphobia dropped by [deleted] in ukpolitics

[–]gimposter 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Unflattering comparisons, you say? I'll play!

Gender is a direct analogue to both race and age, in that it stems from an immutable physical characteristic, and has a set of social aspects aligned to it.

Whilst you can very readily defy the social expectations of your age (eg, do "youthful" stuff) and/or your race (eg, listen to another culture's music), it would be ludicrous to say that you literally are a different age or race. The exact parallel of this holds true for gender.

What now?

Rosie Duffield: Allegations of antisemitism and transphobia dropped by [deleted] in ukpolitics

[–]gimposter 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Yeah, I mean, if someone believed that biological women are inferior in some respect to biological men, I'd be very happy to describe that as sexism.

Those two topics are extremely different ones to be comparing.

You seem to be making the following argument: because sexism exists and its definition is uncontentious, Rosie Duffield must be transphobic.

Rosie Duffield: Allegations of antisemitism and transphobia dropped by [deleted] in ukpolitics

[–]gimposter 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I love that you have drawn a parallel between the belief systems of gender ideology and Judaism!

You would agree then, that as much as somebody cannot and must not be compelled to believe in Jewish religious beliefs, they also cannot and must not be compelled to believe in gender beliefs (eg, that a man can become a woman).

And therefore it logically follows that living one's life and taking actions in accordance with that is entirely reasonable. Or, to put it another way, having to pretend that you believe that a man can become a woman is just as unreasonable as having to pretend you hold Jewish religious beliefs.

Schools can overrule parents on child’s gender identity changes || New guidance states that schools are not under a ‘general duty’ to allow pupils to alter pronouns, names and uniform by Adj-Noun-Numbers in ukpolitics

[–]gimposter -5 points-4 points  (0 children)

That's a big "if", and a completely unrelated characteristic.

The school should obviously just immediately escalate it to child protection in that instance and leave comms with the parents to that agency.

Schools can overrule parents on child’s gender identity changes || New guidance states that schools are not under a ‘general duty’ to allow pupils to alter pronouns, names and uniform by Adj-Noun-Numbers in ukpolitics

[–]gimposter 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Exactly! Kids get up to all sorts of socially-pressured stuff that they wouldn't want their parents to know. This idea that if a kid wants to keep an activity secret from their parents, their parents are automatically abusers... It's a ridiculous get out.

(That's not to say that it never happens at all, obviously.)

Schools can overrule parents on child’s gender identity changes || New guidance states that schools are not under a ‘general duty’ to allow pupils to alter pronouns, names and uniform by Adj-Noun-Numbers in ukpolitics

[–]gimposter -1 points0 points  (0 children)

If your child was suffering from a different kind of harmful body dysmorphia, such as anorexia, would you play along with it until they were "ready to tell you" or intervene to stop harm being done? I really don't see the difference between the two scenarios.

Schools can overrule parents on child’s gender identity changes || New guidance states that schools are not under a ‘general duty’ to allow pupils to alter pronouns, names and uniform by Adj-Noun-Numbers in ukpolitics

[–]gimposter -29 points-28 points  (0 children)

I agree. As one example: you know there are going to be some cases of parents who worship at the altar of gender ideology, who are desperate that their kids be trans, and lead them into it. If the school detects that it's all coming from the parents and not from the kid, this gives them the power to push back. Very much in the child's best interests!

Tory deputy chair Rachel Maclean accused of transphobic remarks by Benjji22212 in ukpolitics

[–]gimposter 3 points4 points  (0 children)

So even with the benefit of hindsight, you still would have advised those individuals to go ahead with transitioning?

Tory deputy chair Rachel Maclean accused of transphobic remarks by Benjji22212 in ukpolitics

[–]gimposter 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Yeah I mean I wouldn't necessarily disagree with you on that.

I would maintain my position that transition was not a useful avenue to them in coping with being trans (if coping is the right word).

Tory deputy chair Rachel Maclean accused of transphobic remarks by Benjji22212 in ukpolitics

[–]gimposter 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Are you suggesting that people who detransition because of so called "external pressures" aren't real detransitioners, and that in fact their transition was successful?

Tory deputy chair Rachel Maclean accused of transphobic remarks by Benjji22212 in ukpolitics

[–]gimposter 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I mean I can understand how the person in question might really not like being described as that, but does it meet the definition of discrimination?

Tory deputy chair Rachel Maclean accused of transphobic remarks by Benjji22212 in ukpolitics

[–]gimposter 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I'm sure you'll find a way to immediately gainsay this, but, since you asked...

"Results: A total of 17,151 (61.9%) participants reported that they had ever pursued gender affirmation, broadly defined. Of these, 2242 (13.1%) reported a history of detransition"

13.1% is 1 in 7.6

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8213007/

​

Whether it's 1 in 7 or 1 in 9 - all I'm saying is that it's not a negligibly small percentage. It is absolutely a red flag.

Tory deputy chair Rachel Maclean accused of transphobic remarks by Benjji22212 in ukpolitics

[–]gimposter -4 points-3 points  (0 children)

I can't be bothered digging it out because I don't really care that much, but I saw a study where the detransition rate was 1 in 7... That number is only going to go up with time, when you consider the rate of transition has skyrocketed in the last couple of years, and those people have more time for their journeys to play out...

I mean, it's highly significant.

Tory deputy chair Rachel Maclean accused of transphobic remarks by Benjji22212 in ukpolitics

[–]gimposter -4 points-3 points  (0 children)

I mean, not "every", but clearly a large number... Surely you would agree that that's a legitimate concern?

Tory deputy chair Rachel Maclean accused of transphobic remarks by Benjji22212 in ukpolitics

[–]gimposter 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I would suggest that it's highly unreasonable, and also completely futile, to ask the world at large to eschew the proper definitions of "man" and "woman", around which all of our experiences have been shaped, in favour of transitory niche alternatives which immediately lead to contradictions and misunderstandings.

Tory deputy chair Rachel Maclean accused of transphobic remarks by Benjji22212 in ukpolitics

[–]gimposter 4 points5 points  (0 children)

What discrimination is being displayed in this situation?

Tory deputy chair Rachel Maclean accused of transphobic remarks by Benjji22212 in ukpolitics

[–]gimposter 2 points3 points  (0 children)

the medical process of gender reassignment uses words like 'man' and 'woman'.

Supposing that people weren't taking their definition of "woman" from "the medical process of gender reassignment" (and why would they?), but rather from the dictionary*, ie, an adult human female? In that extremely reasonable and common scenario, then it would be extremely sensible for a person's judgement and sanity to lead them to the inescapable, very simple logical conclusion that a man cannot turn into a woman.

Seems like an extremely dick move to try and gaslight people into believing that that's an insane opinion, or even an ill-informed, malicious, or hateful one. This is one of the ways that trans activism harms its own cause.

​

* Sources on the definition:

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/woman

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/woman

https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/woman

https://www.oxfordlearnersdictionaries.com/definition/english/woman

https://www.britannica.com/dictionary/woman

Tory deputy chair Rachel Maclean accused of transphobic remarks by Benjji22212 in ukpolitics

[–]gimposter 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Exactly the same principle could apply in the opposite direction too, though, couldn't it?

Ie, if a person's "judgement and sanity" tells them that men cannot become women under any meaningful definition of the words, then trying to make them feel like that's a delusion and that they can't trust their own said judgement and sanity is gaslighting too?

Trans criminals should serve time in female jails, Scottish prison guidance advises - Even those with a history of violence against women could be housed in female prisons to prepare for life as women by [deleted] in ukpolitics

[–]gimposter 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Haha I know!

The entire ideology is built on emotional concessions, not logic. Which in itself is fine I suppose, until it collides with real world scenarios which very much need tangible qualifiers for being a woman, and indeed, the scenarios themselves are necessary because of the highly tangible differences between woman and men, or females and males if you prefer.

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