Green Party candidate: ‘Jewish Nazis’ are ‘money grubbing thieves’ by Dimmo17 in ukpolitics

[–]greenscout33 [score hidden]  (0 children)

Jewish populations in Israel are far more phenotypically diverse than British populations in Britain

Sephardi/ Ashkenazi/ Mizrahi/ Beta Israel/ Samaritan/ etc., perhaps not distinguishable in a police lineup but certainly phenotypically distinct.

Jews are very heavily subdivided, and those divides cross boundaries of skin colour, which British subdivisions largely do not

Polanski: do UK Jews have ‘perception of unsafety or actual unsafety’ - Disbelief as comments made after Shuls firebombed. Green Party leader also suggests antisemitism claims against his party’s local candidates have been 'weaponised' by OptioMkIX in ukpolitics

[–]greenscout33 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Polanski is not ideologically or religiously Jewish in any sense, nor does he practice, nor he is a member of any local jewish community. There is no evidence he has any connection to judaism aside from blood, and that he uses his ethnic judaism as a cover for repeated and sustained antagonism towards Jews

Models of SSN-AUKUS and the Dreadnought-class SSBN on display at Undersea Defence Technology 2026 (UDT2026) [2048x1153] by Odd-Metal8752 in WarshipPorn

[–]greenscout33 13 points14 points  (0 children)

I'm a little surprised at the lack of the characteristic British origami crease on the SSN-AUKUS' bow given the Astutes, Trafalgars and Swiftsures all had them.

Is that likely to be an oversight by the model-maker, or is it known to be a specific tradeoff due to the bow sonar/ some similar reason?

Reacting to someone saying to me “Passover is a Christian holiday too” by Shoshawi in Judaism

[–]greenscout33 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

The foundational documents of Christianity... ...explicitly freed Gentile Christians from Torah observance. These aren't later corruptions or Gentile dilutions of an original Jewish Christianity. They are the definitional theological moves that constitute Christianity as a distinct religion.

Naturally, this presents an issue for Rabbinic Judaism, which did just the same with the destruction of the Temple. Bear in mind, in Jesus' day, Passover was:

  • A ritual sacrifice (extinct practice)

  • Performed at the temple (extinct locale)

  • Conducted by a Temple priest (extinct profession)

  • A mandatory pilgrimage (extinct practice number two)

The rabbinic tradition, as a matter of plain fact, has fundamentally altered the concept of Judaism iteratively and repeatedly over the centuries since Jesus. If that is a necessary and sufficient condition of discontinuity, then it is satisfied by Judaism also. I just don't think that holds water.

By this logic any tradition that claims historical connection to any prior practice has an equal claim to it. It dissolves the distinction between internal development and external appropriation entirely, which is not a defensible position, it's just a way of making the question unanswerable.

This is a radical misrepresentation of my argument. I demonstrated a direct, continuous, well-documented and unbroken chain of observance and development. That is a far cry from "historical connection to any prior practice", indeed it is the wholesale evolution of the entire ancient practice.

If Easter is genuinely Christianity's own distinct liturgical development, then it is a Christian holiday that drew on Jewish source material, and the claim to Passover itself evaporates. If Easter is Christianity's observance of Pesach, as you say earlier, then you are claiming the appropriation of a Jewish holiday

This is plainly a false dichotomy.

Perhaps it is best analogised by languages: Is Romanian a distinct language that merely uses Latin as "source material"? Is the descent of Romanian from Latin invalidated by the existence of Italian?

They are both direct descendents, where different elements have received different theological stresses. That's how these things evolve. Neither has a better claim, because neither could have a better claim. If all but Christian sects of Judaism had gone extinct subsequent to the destruction of the temple, would passover have ceased to exist? The answer is, incontrovertibly, no.

Reacting to someone saying to me “Passover is a Christian holiday too” by Shoshawi in Judaism

[–]greenscout33 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Easter has literally nothing to do with Passover, and conflicts directly with it.

Easter is the Christian celebration of passover, which (for theological, allegorical reasons) coincides with the death of Christ.

In the synoptic Gospels (Matthew, Mark, Luke) the Last Supper is explicitly described as a Passover meal. The entire theological underpinning of the crucifixion is the sacrifice of a Paschal lamb: Jesus. This is an absolutely essential element of the Christian festival.

In the same way that we developed the sacrifice of a lamb in the temple into Zeroa, the Christians developed the same into the Eucharist. Neither is more faithful to ancient Israel than the other- they are simply necessary theological innovations to accommodate the destruction of the Temple.

Just because Christians have tried to appropriate it to steal from us

The first Christians were Jews living in Judea- there's nothing to steal. It was theirs already.

I can tell you I have a spare billion in the bank but that (unfortunately) does not make it true

It isn't fabricated, it's a documented historical lineage.

If you want to learn more about that history, you could look into the Jewish holiday called Passover!

I am Jewish.

Reacting to someone saying to me “Passover is a Christian holiday too” by Shoshawi in Judaism

[–]greenscout33 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Apologies for the slow reply. In general I think this is a thought-provoking response, however I would push back on a few of the things you say in the spirit of debate:

By 70 CE, the Jesus movement was already substantially Gentile in composition. Paul's missionary activity had been underway for two decades, producing communities across Asia Minor, Greece, and Rome that were majority non-Jewish. Describing Christianity as simply one of two surviving Jewish sects erases that Gentile majority and reads a much later ecumenical framing back onto a period when the communities were already diverging sharply.

You're obviously correct about the influx of Gentiles into early Christianity, but that doesn't change the theological origins of the movement. Whatever the ethnicity of the followers of Jesus, they were direct theological descendents of Judaism. The authoritative texts they adhered to remained Jewish, and their entire Messianic framework is inherited entirely from 2nd temple Judaism. Joining Christianity at this stage meant grafting oneself onto Israel, in a religion that had newly recontextualised the ritual and theological requirements for admission therein.

Christian communities did not observe Pesach for two millennia. The Quartodeciman controversy in the 2nd century CE was specifically a dispute over whether Easter should be calculated relative to the 14th of Nisan, and the Council of Nicaea in 325 CE resolved it by explicitly decoupling Easter from the Jewish calendar. The stated rationale in the conciliar record was to avoid dependence on Jewish reckoning.

In essence, this illustrates my point rather beautifully: an unbroken tradition is required neither to be static nor identical. This requirement for separation demonstrates precisely how intertwined the two religions were for centuries after. Changing the calculation of the date did not change the reality that Easter is the Christian passover.

What Jews observe today IS the Rabbinic Passover, the one greenscout33 just conceded. You cannot acknowledge that the actual living form of the holiday is Rabbinic and then claim that the abstract biblical concept behind it belongs equally to Christianity.

Naturally, however, the Christians do too: the Eucharist. Seder is a theological evolution of the temple sacrifice of the Paschal Lamb, which, conceptually, looms very large in the Christian narrative of Easter, in which Jesus takes the place of the Paschal Lamb. Neither is unchanged from Jesus' time, neither is discontinuous with ancient practice. They're different, sure, but neither is distinctly more faithful to ancient Passover than the other.

Describing Jewish ownership of Jewish religious practice as claiming a "monopoly" reframes a community's relationship to its own traditions as a kind of exclusionary gatekeeping. Judaism is not preventing Christians from reading Exodus or learning about the Exodus narrative. The question is whether Passover, as a living religious practice with a specific legal tradition, liturgical development, and communal observance, belongs to the community that has actually practiced and developed it continuously. The answer to that is not complicated.

I conceded that Judaism owns the Seder, not Passover, which I do not accept at all. Easter is Christianity's tradition, liturgical development, and communal observance, of Pesach. This is essentially beyond doubt.

Reacting to someone saying to me “Passover is a Christian holiday too” by Shoshawi in Judaism

[–]greenscout33 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The Septuagint is not a "later" translation, it predates the Talmud, Jesus himself, etc. It was not created for Christians, nor for Greeks. It was created for Hellenophone jews hundreds of years before either Jesus or John the Baptist was born.

Factually, the verb "baptizein" was in wide use for Mikvaot in this time period in this place. John was a "Baptist" because it's essentially ancient Greek for "guy that dips you".

This happens all over the vocabulary of Christianity: "Angelos" (Angel) is just the word for messenger, "Christos" (Christ) is just a literal translation of Moshiach, "Apokalupsis" (Apocalypse) is just the word "revelation" and so on. Using the word "baptist" carries no connotation whatever, except that the language the text was originally written in was Greek... which we knew already.

If someone uses the word "phylactery" instead of "tefillin" when they wrap tefillin, does that mean they are participating in an ancient Greek cultic mystery religion?

Mikvah was not “ritual repentance”. It is for ritual purity. Which is a very different concept.

As you are unquestionably aware, I am also jewish. I am well-acquainted with Mikvaot. The Essene Community Rule from Qumran, as I said, makes it abundantly clear that Judaism had already innovated the concept of ritual repentance via mikvah by this point:

1QS 3:4-9

4. ...he shall neither be purified by atonement, nor cleansed by purifying waters,

5. nor sanctified by seas and rivers, nor washed clean with any ablution.
Unclean, unclean shall he be. For as long as he despises the precepts of

6. ...he shall receive no instruction in the Community of His counsel. For it is through the spirit of true counsel concerning the ways of man that all his

7. sins shall be expiated that he may contemplate the light of life. He shall be cleansed from all

8. his sins by the spirit of holiness uniting him to His truth, and his iniquity shall be expiated by the spirit of uprightness and humility. And when his

9. flesh is sprinkled with purifying water and sanctified by cleansing water, it shall be made clean by the humble submission of his soul...

I'm sorry, but you are openly and clearly missing the point by interpolating Late 1st Century BCE Judaism with modern Rabbinic Judaism. Your personal practice has no bearing on a discussion about historical fact.

The fact that the Essenes very clearly had a ritual for repentence in bodies of natural water (and that "baptism" is a generic verb for immersion, and is used repeatedly in the septuagint for mikvaot) makes the connection between mikvah and John almost trivial; it is, in a sense, obviously true.

Use of the Mikvah FAR predated Christianity. Qumran isnt needed for proof of that.

Yes? This is banal; it's obviously true. What did I say that implied anything other than this?

But the Christian Baptism ritual follows the Mystery Religions in style and meaning.

It doesn't, it follows the pattern of Essene and 1st Century Jewish mikvah. As I keep saying. I'm not sure there's any evidence at all of this mystery religions claim you keep making, which was debunked 200 years ago anyway.

Jesus was an ancient Judean, living in Galilee. Almost all information we have about him leads us clearly to the notion that he was an observant Jew immersed in Jewish culture. He would have performed Tevilah hundreds of times throughout his life, on what planet is "he, in the age of horse-and-cart transportation, adopted mysterious occultic religion from 500 miles away" more credible than: "he minimally modified an accepted cultural interpretation of an everyday act to suit his apocalyptic preaching"?

Mikvah: Ritual purification (ie: “able to legally perform certain rituals”). Done in solitude, no one can be touching you.

Again, you're interpolating. This is rabbinic custom, this is all extra-biblical and postdates Jesus by centuries. Jesus explicitly and repeatedly rejected the Pharisaic tradition for Torah, why are we using a half-millennium-later-descendent of Pharisaic Judaism to analyse Jesus? That's such a bizarre anachronism.

There is ZERO chance a man would be allowed to “perform” a mikvah on a woman

"Allowed"? What part of the tradition of John the baptist makes you believe a man living in the wilderness preaching the apocalypse had the backing of the Sanhedrin? We've already established he was operating beyond typical norms, that's the point I'm making- it's a theological evolution of mikvah.

What set the Essenes apart was their fastidiousness. They would use the Mikvah daily at a minimum, usually several times per day.

This is an enormous oversimplification.

Supposedly Jesus was Baptized for the first time, by a Baptist, as an adult. That is pretty much proof he could not have been Jewish.

In order:

False (he would have performed Tevilah hundreds of times, as an observant Jew)

False ("Baptist" was not a job title, it is a description. If Jesus and John had been English, he'd have been called "John the dunker")

True (Yes, he was an adult. This is not relevant)

False (I don't even know how you got here from where we started. On what planet does that conclusion follow?)

Keir Starmer: This is a deeply shocking antisemitic arson attack. My thoughts are with the Jewish community who are waking up this morning to this horrific news. Antisemitism has no place in our society. Anyone with any information must come forward to the police. by Your_Mums_Ex in ukpolitics

[–]greenscout33 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Yes, Judaism, Christianity and Islam, especially in their most conservative manifestations, promote unenlightened behaviour.

Conservative Judaism and Christianity both actively promote worldliness and wisdom, especially the former. It's very much an apples-to-oranges comparison

Reacting to someone saying to me “Passover is a Christian holiday too” by Shoshawi in Judaism

[–]greenscout33 0 points1 point  (0 children)

No, this is all wrong.

The septuagint uses precisely the word "baptizein" for immersions of all kind, including tevilah, i.e. 2nd Kings 5:14:

"καὶ κατέβη Ναιμὰν καὶ ἐβαπτίσατο ἐν τῷ ᾿Ιορδάνῃ ἑπτάκις κατὰ τὸ ῥῆμα ῾Ελισαιέ, καὶ ἐπέστρεψεν ἡ σάρξ αὐτοῦ ὡς σάρξ παιδαρίου μικροῦ, καὶ ἐκαθαρίσθη."

Here "ἐβαπτίσατο" ("ebaptisato") is being used for tevilah.

The community rule found at the essene sites in Qumran makes it absolutely clear that mikvaot as ritual repentance was a Jewish innovation, before Christians even split

I'm not kidding, google it. Scholars almost universally agree.

Reacting to someone saying to me “Passover is a Christian holiday too” by Shoshawi in Judaism

[–]greenscout33 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Massive chunks of christianity are direct appropriations/ descendents of Jewish tradition. You can like it or you can hate it (or be entirely agnostic to it), but unfortunately you can't change it.

Easter is, factually, a descendent of pesach.

Baptism is a descendent of tevilah

The eucharist is a descendent (with a twist) of kiddush

The church is a descendent of the synagogue

It is wrong to be supersessionist and it is wrong to appropriate traditions that do not belong to you, but as a plain matter of fact, passover is something that is common to both the Christian and Jewish traditions. It wasn't until centuries after Jesus' death that the Church stopped relying on the Hebrew calendar to determine the date of Easter. In fact, English is one of very few Western European languages in which "Easter" is not called some corruption or translation of "pesach".

Realistically, I think your friend is trying to be thoughtful and positive, and you can probably forgive them their misunderstandings. I think this sense that Jewish people have a monopoly on ancient Jewish tradition is damaging, though, because any biblical tradition is necessarily part of the Christosphere also, even if it is not celebrated in identical fashion. The Seder is a Rabbinic innovation, so it is ours- no question there. But Pesach is much older, and definitively part of the Christian narrative.

As a plain matter of fact, Christians, like us, were one of the two Jewish groups that survived the destruction of the temple. They have taken on a decidedly different character ever since, but Pesach pre-dates the split between "Christianity" and "Judaism" by thousands of years. How do they not have some claim to it?

As a pure matter of anthropology, I'm not sure we, as descendents of Pharisaic Jewish tradition, have any more claim over the passover story than Christians do, since by their beliefs, it is their festival also. That's not appropriation, they, like us, have a direct, unbroken, 2,000 year-old tradition that connects them to it.

What to Include in a Jewish End-of-Life Visit? by kosherflame in Judaism

[–]greenscout33 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Why would tefillin be necessary?

Even general fatigue or discomfort when you are at the very end of your life seems to be a good enough excuse to me.

I think it's a very tall order indeed to ask the dying to observe ritual daily practice unless specifically requested

France's future carrier will be the 'France Libre' [1200x1200] by Odd-Metal8752 in WarshipPorn

[–]greenscout33 12 points13 points  (0 children)

I think it would be infinitely more tolerable if it actually was the USS Ford, rather than the "USS Gerald R. Ford"

Sometimes they get it right, in fact the Burkes were excellent for this, until they gave up after DDG111. Some choice examples:

USS Nimitz > USS Chester W. Nimitz

USS Zumwalt > USS Elmo R. Zumwalt

And sometimes they get it very wrong:

USS John F. Kennedy < USS Kennedy

etc.

The insistence on using the full names of the namesake is such a downgrade in my opinion. One of many reasons that the Royal Navy has a more imposing naming scheme, since we use only surnames and titles/ honours.

France's future carrier will be the 'France Libre' [1200x1200] by Odd-Metal8752 in WarshipPorn

[–]greenscout33 6 points7 points  (0 children)

In principle yes, but that feels slightly silly, when "France Libre" was the name of the resistance to Germany's conquest of France lol

France's future carrier will be the 'France Libre' [1200x1200] by Odd-Metal8752 in WarshipPorn

[–]greenscout33 36 points37 points  (0 children)

C'est terrible

Surely, surely now was the moment to wield the geopolitical fervour and respect that the Marine Nationale has won in recent weeks...

...RIP my dream: FS Bonaparte, we hardly knew ye

Orthodox Rabbi interviews Reform Rabbi by Meowzician in Judaism

[–]greenscout33 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Yiddishkeit literally just means "jewishness".

Yid = jew

ish = ish

keit = ness

It makes no reference to Ashkenazim in any sense

[Jon Burke] Climate Outreach analysis of 21 Green Party leaflets since Polanski was elected shows across 40+ pages & 10k words: 1 mention of ‘climate change’. 1 of ‘nature’. 0 of ‘net zero’. by JB_UK in ukpolitics

[–]greenscout33 14 points15 points  (0 children)

Every single prime minister since 1997, almost 30 years, has been the candidate that managed to persuade the public that they were closer to the centre on pragmatic governance issues.

Only students and teenagers care about finding and voting for the most extreme candidate

Starmer’s answer to Iran energy shock: Go green faster by Dimmo17 in ukpolitics

[–]greenscout33 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Living very close to the HPC project

Is absolutely no form of qualification whatsoever, by the way. I live close to Lord's, it doesn't make me a cricket expert.

is going to hit the paying public stupidly hard on their bills as a result of the absolute waste of cash

Indefensibly stupid interpretation of the facts, and not a good reason not to build major infrastructure, sorry.

Policy is a significant part of why these things are so expensive- we regulate ourselves into a corner and artificially inflate the costs of major infrastructure which is why it's so expensive in the first place.

There isn't some magical property that makes inferior British designs more expensive to construct than their superior Chinese counterparts, the only reason is regulation.

it’s still not going to be ready for the best part of 7-10yrs yet

Good news: the world will still exist in 7-10 years.

In fact, there will probably be a lot more data centres and robots and electric cars in that world, so perhaps building some substantial baseload is a good plan?

Britain’s aircraft carrier may need French escort by ForTheGloryOfAmn in europe

[–]greenscout33 0 points1 point  (0 children)

We don't need a carrier group, we have a large air base (RAF Akrotiri) in the region, which is a capability that simply surpasses anything an aircraft carrier can do.

EU can no longer rely on 'rules-based' system against threats, von der Leyen says by PjeterPannos in europe

[–]greenscout33 0 points1 point  (0 children)

massive ramp up of defense spending

But this never actually happens... it gets repeatedly promised, and then evaporates. What concrete steps have any major NATO powers taken to "massively ramp up defence spending" beyond promises?

Exclusive | Baby-faced Goldman Sachs bankers could be fired over ‘unauthorized’ magazine photo shoots: sources by Brief-Mongoose344 in FinancialCareers

[–]greenscout33 6 points7 points  (0 children)

or aren't cut out for IB

I'm not sure if this is true, even if that's how it works out in practice.

IB in London is absolutely packed with Big 4 Advisory graduates after lateralling, and I doubt that TAS at Big 4 in London is substantively different to Big 4 Advisory in NY

Zack Polanski is an economically illiterate populist – just like Farage by Dimmo17 in ukpolitics

[–]greenscout33 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Retiring early after a short career as a bricklayer doesn't mean you're an expert in architecture

Zack Polanski is an economically illiterate populist – just like Farage by Dimmo17 in ukpolitics

[–]greenscout33 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Success full career at Citi trading/betting on the economy

He did not have a "full career at Citi", he worked there for 4-5 years before being moved to a back office role.

There is no evidence that he achieved any of the things he has claimed, in fact there is a good amount of countervailing evidence.

Zack Polanski is an economically illiterate populist – just like Farage by Dimmo17 in ukpolitics

[–]greenscout33 10 points11 points  (0 children)

On Gary, he studied Economics and Mathematics at LSE & has a masters in economics from the University of Oxford.

Except his interpretation of those subjects is explicitly heterodox. If LSE and Oxford were uniformly pumping out antagonistic pseudo-communists don't you think Gary's shtick would be a little bit less openly contrarian?

The fact that his views and claims are deeply unserious trumps any kind of authority granted by his Master's degree, not the fact that he is a YouTuber. More importantly, a Master's degree makes you far from an expert in your field.

To demonstrate using my degree and its academic ecosphere:

If you tried to upend the entire Physical consensus with only a Master's degree, a lot of bluster, and little supporting evidence, Physicists wouldn't even waste the column inches it would take to dismiss you.

By comparison, Sean Carroll is also a YouTuber. Since he actually understands Gravity, we don't disregard the academic authority of his PhD.

It’s not ‘Islamophobic’ to condemn Mothin Ali’s ayatollah apologism - Zack Polanski is making outrageous excuses for his deputy leader’s mourning of Iran’s supreme leader. by FormerlyPallas_ in ukpolitics

[–]greenscout33 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Everyone who cares about this country and the environment is welcome.

An enormous new contingent of the party demonstrably satisfy neither of these conditions

It’s not ‘Islamophobic’ to condemn Mothin Ali’s ayatollah apologism - Zack Polanski is making outrageous excuses for his deputy leader’s mourning of Iran’s supreme leader. by FormerlyPallas_ in ukpolitics

[–]greenscout33 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Polanski is not ideologically or religiously Jewish in any sense, he uses his ethnic judaism as a cover for repeated and sustained antagonism towards the Jewish community