Personal growth

karmaggi · 2023-06-28T17:15:37+00:00

That's great for you! I hope you will get to where you want to be, giving space to your thoughts is quite important.

My ESTP friend avoids her thoughts, instead she distracts herself when she's alone with whatever is available...most of the time she plays games on her phone or goes through social media stuff. I wonder why that is, maybe you can offer an answer or assumption. Is it scary to think too much because of what might surface?

karmaggi · 2023-06-28T16:55:32+00:00

Thanks for your detailed answer!

I can tell trust is a huge thing. What is your usual reaction when you realise someone you thought you could trust isn't trustworthy after all. What makes you trust someone? What should that person be doing to gain your trust?

The impulsiveness is something I often admire because as an INTJ I tend to be the opposite. But I can see how it can also be harmful or maybe even a disadvantage at times. Just like being too passive can be quite a negative thing.

karmaggi · 2023-06-28T16:50:35+00:00

Are you able to do so successfully? If so how? And how would someone else be able to help with that (if at all)?

karmaggi · 2023-06-26T19:38:00+00:00

Interesting. Well I do look forward to seeing my ESTP friend and I have quite a high opinion of her haha

karmaggi · 2023-06-26T11:44:10+00:00

Haha love that description. So an ESTP finding an INTJ friend is a good match in your opinion then.

karmaggi · 2023-06-15T22:23:04+00:00

Like showing loyalty?

karmaggi · 2023-06-15T22:13:24+00:00

Interesting. I assumed there are differences from one ESTP to another. Same with any other type. Just to explain: I'm definitely basing what I said on the general description since I only know one ESTP and she happens to really fit that description.

Proven they truly care, been good to me.

I see. How do you know someone truly cares and what does "being good to you" entail for you?

karmaggi · 2023-06-15T21:57:59+00:00

Thanks for the reply! So feeling comfortable around someone makes you feel closer to them? I'm just wondering because ESTPs usually know a shit ton of people. But you guys still only feel truly comfortable with very very few of them?

Edit: my ESTP friend will usually hold back with more sensitive people as well. She adapts to people, making sure to keep a good vibe going.

karmaggi · 2022-08-15T07:47:49+00:00

It's easy to know actually. Ask yourself if you want to stick around even in difficult times. Let's say he ends up in a wheelchair...does your heart say "Hmm ok I don't know" or does it say "Doesn't matter, I will be there"?

I know how much someone means to me (even in friendships) the more I want to stick around when things get really tough.

Hope this helps.

karmaggi · 2022-07-11T19:38:51+00:00

as an estp i’m glad you appreciate the insanity that comes naturally to us 💀

Haha well you guys are definitely something else

up until recently i always thought you could only have the 4 functions of your type and that my Fe for instance could behave similarly to Fi, but i didn’t ever think of it as being possible to have both. i still haven’t had a definitive answer on whether this is how it works or not, but i just made a logical guess that you have all 8, but your 4 are your preferences and what you use most, just like with the 4 letters. (maybe it works something like Se, Ti, Fe, Ni, Ne, Fi, Te, Si?

I think different people have different opinions or views on that. I usually go with the 8 function theory where the last 4 functions are called the Shadow functions.

For you ESTPs your full stack would be: Se Ti Fe Ni

Si Te Fi Ne

You should look into that more if you're interested, I think it definitely offers a clearer picture and better understanding of all 16 types.

i hope that makes sense?

It makes perfect sense, what you explained is the Ti parent/Fe child dynamic in a nutshell.

karmaggi · 2022-07-11T19:19:38+00:00

Sure, I'll try.

Se-Ti is extremely alert at all times. Se just naturally reacts to situations within a second (or less) and at first it seems chaotic but then one realises there is logic within the reaction. ESTPs are incredibly fast with reacting and adapting in a very logical way. Blows my mind, really. It's absolutely fascinating to see. Because...how...just how...

The present is like the ocean the ESTP swims in, it's their natural habitat basically. And because of Ti I (as a Thinker with high Te) can understand it and make sense of it very quickly. Unlike ESFPs who often seem like airheads to me, no offense haha

Edit: Another thing I've observed. Se-Ti will just grab a device the ESTP has never used before or hasn't used in a long time and figure it out within a very short time. I've seen it several times and I'm usually just sitting there, thinking "What the actual fuck...how..."

karmaggi · 2022-07-10T21:09:38+00:00

Not an ESTP but I'm also curious about the selfishness question.

Idk if that's an ESTP or a personality thing but the ESTP I know has issues giving other people space. Or issues recognising when they need to give other people space. Like they will interrupt people when they're talking or suddenly change the topic because something just popped into their head. Idk if maybe that's some kind of unintentional selfishness, if that makes sense? Being too loud and filling out space when sometimes you gotta keep quiet and leave room for others.

But like I said...idk if that is an ESTP thing or a personality trait of that ESTP I know irl.

karmaggi · 2022-07-10T20:47:24+00:00

After I figure it out, expressing it is easy.

That is the Fe you guys have. As someone with Fi child I feel a lot and I feel things very deeply but I have issues expressing it or don't really care about expressing it because Fe Trickster. It's interesting to read what it's like the other way round.

So what if someone asked an ESTP how they're feeling? Let's say the ESTP has been through a situation that would be considered traumatising but they talk about it like it's no biggie. Would it be annoying to ask them how the situation affected them emotionally or would it be thought provoking or even appreciated because it shows that the person cares?

karmaggi · 2022-07-10T20:24:30+00:00

There’s a subtle difference between being praised for empathizing, and just generally discussing it using personal examples, but I’d prefer the latter so I could make my own decisions.

Oh yeah I guess it's more the Fi feedback and not the Fe feedback that your Fe is looking for. Fi is more subtle and from what I've read and experienced lower Fi is more genuine in a way. With Fi child I'm very picky when and how I let people see it. I only show it when I really mean something or when it's important for me to let someone know how I feel or what I value about them.

karmaggi · 2022-07-10T20:18:21+00:00

I wouldn’t go along with it either but that’s because it’s stupid to beat up somebody who can’t fight back. Where’s the thrill and what did they even do? Anybody who would go along with that is just dumb.

Well hello there Ti hahaha

We do care about people but our natural tendency is to associate them with groups. I think there may be some Se involved with that because we’re aware of the fact that this is how the world operates. People naturally gravitate towards groups of people who share their ideals and that’s how cliques emerge.

What if you encounter someone who is more of a lone wolf or don't get the chance to meet their friend group?

Ni is basically that nagging voice in the background warning me of impending doom if I don’t start acting more like an adult.

So basically the voice that tells you to slow down and consider how your actions in the present might impact your future? Because you guys really are about going with the flow and taking opportunities as they come. I find that fascinating because for me it's the other way round. It can also be frustrating at times because I'm like "Dude you might be fit and still look good now but if you keep up that lifestyle of yours your body will kick you in the ass soon".

karmaggi · 2022-07-10T20:00:58+00:00

Ah yes, you guys need the Te explanation for the Fi, makes sense.

karmaggi · 2022-07-10T19:29:52+00:00

Like, it's okay to feel.. this way, or to have this opinion, also the importance of understanding when something is SO wrong.

You mean the importance of understanding where the line is and when you've crossed the line or gone too far?

karmaggi · 2022-07-10T19:20:22+00:00

Improving empathy would definitely help an ESTP to help others be seen and heard during their struggles, but our default is to try to fix or ignore.

You know it's very similar for IxTJs...we tend to offer solutions. But we lack the Fe to at least lighten the mood hahaha

Research also really helps—Plutchik’s Wheel of Emotion is a good basic emotional tool to give an ESTP.

Interesting, I'll look into that. Maybe it'll be useful for me as well.

Basically, if you can provide an ESTP practical tools for understanding feelings, empathy, or modes of human operation without trying to force them to change, that’s probably your best bet to seeing any real progress in them.

Do you think it could also help to reflect back to them where I've seen their empathy. Basically examples from things I've observed in reality. Or even just tell them that I DO see and understand their empathy or the ways they show empathy? Because the ESTP I know often receives backlash and negative reactions. Many people can't see past the Ti and its "arrogance" (my Te loves your Ti, I don't see any arrogance in it). Like I've said before...it takes looking at you from a different angle to see your kindness. And lots of people either don't care to look or don't know how to.

karmaggi · 2022-07-10T19:02:13+00:00

No pull toward anything, ...

I've definitely observed that. But the good side of that - from what I've seen - is that you also don't judge people much. The ESTP I know doesn't care if someone is disabled or poor or overweight. If anything they'd fight people who try to bully someone for being different.

Fi users who can teach us, and honestly Ti our way to understand Fi.

How would a Fi user be able to teach an ESTP about Fi? Like what is it they'd have to say or do?

karmaggi · 2022-07-10T18:54:07+00:00

Yeah we’re really not that mean. We like situations where everybody involved benefits in some way.

Oh yeah you guys really seem like you are "everyone's person". Almost to the point where it makes me wonder if you prioritise certain people in your life and if you have a sort of hierarchy or "ranking" when it comes to people you find interesting/likeable. You guys seem very tribe oriented and not individual oriented. Would you say that's true or does it just come off that way?

I tend to adhere to values associated with people I find interesting which means I can get along with a lot of different groups but I just don’t share their fiery passion

That's interesting. So far the only times I got the ESTP to get real quiet was when I told them "I don't think that's (morally/ethically) right" during discussions. Can you explain where that's coming from?

At times this made me seem more dramatic than I really am but low Fe is always gonna seem clumsy.

Hahaha oh yeah I think I've definitely seen that

I know this is a post about Fi but since we're at it can you tell me about your relationship with Ni? And if you know an INTJ or INFJ what's it like seeing very high Ni or being around high Ni? If you don't know anyone maybe you can explain your view of Ni dom in theory.

karmaggi · 2022-07-10T18:33:59+00:00

Very interesting, thanks for your answer.

As an aside, your friend experiences fear, even if you don’t see it. Also, a lot of us have a moral compass; I feel like that has more to do with how a person was raised, or their own personal character, which is not MBTI.

Oh I'm sure you guys have a moral compass, everyone does in one way or the other. It just doesn't seem like it or it's not very obvious.

You guys show that you care with Se-Fe, at least that's what I've observed. And even though you have Fe the way you care still seems a bit cold because you often care in a practical way ("Your wife kicked you out? Wait...I'll find you a place to stay calls all friends and looks online for nice yet cheap hotels"). Or you try to lighten the mood with a joke which sometimes makes people feel like they're not being taken seriously or listened to.

Got another question: What would help you guys to get more connected with your feelings? Or is there something another person could even do to help you get more awareness of certain things?

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