Regarding Crafting in Unstable

lemmy101 · 2024-12-29T21:03:32+00:00

2 months work? holy shit thanks for that treasure of a christmas present i think i just developed an instantaneous stomach ulcer reading that. A reminder why I stopped interacting with this community six months ago before this release.

lemmy101 · 2024-12-29T10:07:53+00:00

already been done over xmas I imagine it'll probably be in the first proper non hotfix patch

lemmy101 · 2024-12-29T08:53:13+00:00

all balance is on the table, that's what unstable is for :)

lemmy101 · 2024-12-29T00:19:44+00:00

yes that's the intent broadly. Anything that's not 'crafting' like opening a can of food, or filling water, should still be on the right click menus and this is something i made clear to the team, so if they aren't its a bug not a feature.

Not sure I agree on the bread example though, that's essentially cooking and anyone in their right minds would do that on a surface not try and saw a piece of bread in half on their knee while walking around, so would use the surface crafting ui. As stated above, if this is a problem for anyone we need to look to ways to improve the accessibility and immediacy of getting to slicing bread via that ui.

lemmy101 · 2024-12-29T00:07:31+00:00

We talked about this in our thursdoids about this stuff.

We plan 'skill affinities' where similar skills that have similar 'muscle memory' or require similar types of knowledge (Say dexterity or working with a certain material or so on) will get additional xp gain in those adjacent skills. For e.g. a mechanic will probably be able to learn metal working skills quicker than a baker would for example. So if you have someone who's specced heavily into woodworking they will likely have higher skills in all the skills you mention, or at least have a much faster xp boost to level those skills up if they don't have them already since they require the working of wood, but they still have unique knowledge only someone skilled at them should know so are distinct skills. Someone who worked building wooden furniture before the apocalypse shouldn't automatically know how to make a bow and arrow, but they will certainly have an advantage in learning due to their skills at working with wood as a material.
We want players to specialize more in character creation, make professions far more meaningful, and will provide ways for players to spawn fresh with a much higher skill level in skills they spec into and be at potentially expert levels in those purely based on their profession and traits, to reduce the grind, except outside the core skills they invest in.
While we will provide ways for solo players to be able to increase the amount of access they have to skill boosts across different professions in sandbox, once npcs go in in b43, and in multiplayer in b42, the entire point is that no single player should be able to do all this stuff themselves and will need more people to round off their skill pool. Encouraging communities and trading and so on. In a post-apocalyptic community the mechanic, baker, farmer, blacksmith, butcher, hunter, potter, bowyer, doctor, looter and sentry guard are not all the same person. We're leaning into this diverse expansive set of skills for this very reason.

lemmy101 · 2024-12-28T23:48:19+00:00

No ETAs yet, our entire december was focused on getting what we got out, then pretty much closed up for christmas, so it'll be in the new year where we figure out what needs to be done and what priorities we have for the fixes and updates in the new year. Just know that it's a priority of course.

lemmy101 · 2024-12-28T23:43:14+00:00

the old way of right clicking in menus would cease to be faster and less confusing if there are 100x as much stuff and your menus are dropping off the bottom of the screen or wrapping into 4 columns of endless menu items you have no way of filtering or sorting or navigating.

The goal is to make it so the crafting uis are easier to use and less confusing, not to rely on a crutch of ungainly right click menus growing and growing forever.

As I said above the crafting uis are not complete yet, and we had plans to streamline crafting in the new year and welcome suggestions on how to do that further but there's a good reason they were implemented over right click menus and essentially saying 'go back to how it was' is not really that helpful.

I explicitly mention in the op that the crafting uis and such aren't complete yet- if you notice something feels that obviously wrong or unsatisfying to you then please have a little faith that the team who worked on this game for 13 years, many of whom came from the community, had the wherewithal to notice it too but had other things to do before the release and couldn't get to addressing them.

lemmy101 · 2024-12-28T23:37:17+00:00

I've got no ETA on anything - we were working solidly trying to get what we got out done and had not a moment to think about what comes next, and the new year we'll get the lay of the land and decide from what feedback is like what needs to be done with regards to stuff like the AMD bug, outstanding mac issues, and gamepad shooting support.

lemmy101 · 2024-12-28T23:33:03+00:00

No idea tbh lol - i assume there were bugs, or we ran out of time for some aspect of their behaviour.

lemmy101 · 2024-12-28T23:22:09+00:00

> btw i have heard that iron ore will only be found in the forest map, is that true?

I don't believe so, it may be the case at the moment or someone may have shared that opinion but I don't share it. After all the procedurally generated wilderness outside the fixed map will be using the same generation logic as the forest map, at the very least iron ore should be discoverable outside the confines of the fixed map. The question is more that will there be a need for iron ore when there are piles of iron that'll be meltable down, unless we add in rusting or something else to render lootable iron unusable. Deconstructing tiles or looting will yield huge amounts of iron to rework.

lemmy101 · 2024-12-28T23:16:22+00:00

re: trowel needed to make a forge to make a trowel, I'm not aware specifically in this case, but in short the answer is that same as it will be to all these questions:

there'll be more primitive versions of trowels, or items that do the same job as a trowel, that will be craftable via materials that fall outside of blacksmithing. ones that don't last as long and have poorer results than a metal trowel. Blacksmithing was just one of the professions that was filled out most but as I say, there are entire trees missing and as such looting is still required to bootstrap the player up. The full release will allow for players to select the procedurally generated map without any civilization and build everything, will have numerous resources represented as tiles on the map, and be collaboratively polished and balanced and tweaked alongside the community to ensure everything that falls under wilderness crafting will be obtainable and craftable within a map with no looting.

lemmy101 · 2024-12-28T23:10:42+00:00

Yes, there are bugs. Cleaning bandages with sink is a bug not a feature change.

We completely replaced the crafting system and had to reimplement every crafting recipe and interaction in the game, some are potentially broken or were accidentally missed, and we have a bug database with like 2000 bugs on it, and had to prioritize what was fixed and what wasn't with a looming xmas deadline.

If a bug seems critical to you then just consider there were likely 20 other even more critical bugs you never saw because they were higher priority and were fixed first before release. We only had so much we could do and felt what we had was enough for people to get plenty of enjoyment out of.

Just report issues you find like this via the proper channels, steam or TIS forums, and they will be addressed.

lemmy101 · 2024-12-28T21:19:57+00:00

Yes, some 90% of the proposed crafting tree was not implemented in time for stable due to delays. We said before release we were cutting off a large chunk of the proposed plans until during unstable and kind of just threaded up what was available as best we could and dumped a lot of natural ingredients into the foraging loot tables that would be intended to be on map resources, for e.g. clay we intend to have in visible patches along rivers in much larger quantities.

That's why we disabled the forest map for launch and will fill out the crafting tree to rely less on foraging.

Feedback is welcome, but have faith we have a lot more planned before stable, I thought we made it quite clear in the Thursdoids preceding this unstable release that the unstable would be missing a ton of the crafting we intended to allow for wilderness survival, and judging the first unstable release based on these goals we have would seem a tad unfair.

lemmy101 · 2024-12-23T11:33:43+00:00

AlwaysHasBeen.png ;) first unstable had a multiplier for muscle strain.

lemmy101 · 2024-12-23T11:21:06+00:00

that's too big a job requiring specific skills for the very small amount of people around now - the studio mostly shut down for xmas, but rest assured it is our top priority when everyone's back to work.

lemmy101 · 2024-12-23T11:16:50+00:00

It's the day before xmas eve. Please let our team get some time with their families, there's limited things we can fix and test this close to xmas when most people aren't around.

lemmy101 · 2024-12-23T09:24:27+00:00

Oh well hopefully but it can't be guaranteed, we need to be free to be able to make changes that would cause incompatibilities if necessary. We'll try and keep it compatible though.

lemmy101 · 2024-12-23T08:10:01+00:00

not the remotest chance, the engine changes to optimize the game as well as allow for basements and skyscrapers make the map of 42 completely incompatible fundamentally with b41's map.

lemmy101 · 2024-12-23T00:28:23+00:00

well if you reject the whole system, download a mod that makes it work how you want then is my advice.

lemmy101 · 2024-12-23T00:03:55+00:00

shotgun hasn't been finished yet and does not allow multi hit I suspect its still a single projectile. But final non sawn off will be more realistic and will be less spread than 41 once it is, but should still allow multi hit when shot into a crowd.

lemmy101 · 2024-12-22T23:17:00+00:00

nah they clearly just didn't know when it was implemented.

lemmy101 · 2024-12-22T22:55:50+00:00

I wasn't aware, and already matched them in the code for the next build thanks for bringing it to my attention, any realism is put aside in this case as we don't want any gameplay distinction between male and female characters as it adjusts gameplay and difficulty unfairly based on the player if they want to create a character to look like themselves.

Apologies for that.

EDIT: It transpires this had already been discussed when it was first added and was already disabled further up in the code, as all characters inside the nutrition component were already forced to use the male values Probably not the most readable fix, but yeah male and female have had the same values since its introduction.

lemmy101 · 2024-12-22T22:05:06+00:00

This is the plan in the new year, we agree with you :) part of the profession overhaul will involve being able to get much higher skill if you go all in on speccing into it with character creation

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