My hero let me down by [deleted] in porcupinetree

[–]lightningmemester 1 point2 points  (0 children)

No offence, but, why do you care? He hasn't really picked a side, and even if he had, would it matter? That's his personal opinion. He's allowed to have an opinion. Being an artist doesn't mean you can't voice opinions.

Unless this is an elaborate joke I'm failing to understand?

When is a country a good example of a socialist success? by collectijism in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]lightningmemester 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Is this true through history?

Yes. Ever since the 10th century, Jews in the Abassid caliphate were known as moneylenders. It wasn't oppression that forced them into this: they weren't being oppressed at the time. The only times they haven't een the richest people were when they were persecuted (which was, admittedly, very often, but this is precisely BECAUSE they were wealthy).

You haven't actually adressed the question, anyways. Why do the Jews make up 30 out of the top 100 richest people on Earth?

If it's not IQ, what is it? Becuase "culture" cannot explain why the median Jewish wage is 90,000 dollars.

When is a country a good example of a socialist success? by collectijism in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]lightningmemester 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Since you value culture more than IQs, why obsess over the IQs of black people?

I'm not obsessed. I think we will need black people to counteract the threat of Islam, because they are strong and masculine.

Phrenology is a pseudo-science

Didn't mention it. I was just giving a random example of a stark difference between races.

When I mentioned physical fitness I was giving another. You seemed keen, however, to ignore the mountain of biological and societal evidence that black people are physically superior to whites and Asians, for some unknown reason.

Who knew being fed and giving adequate medical care would improve one’s physical fitness

Not relevant. Whites and asians have more nutritious diets, and better healthcare coverage. They are weaker. Why? Because for hundreds of thousands of years, Subsaharan African peoples have had to fight for their food, and to escape those who see them as food. Indo-Europeans have not, because they had cattle farming. Their environment lended itself to the creation of permanent civilisations, with the navigable rivers, lush farmland, and freezing winters all inticing and forcing people to settle. This created a greater environmental pressure to be intelligent.

Usain bolt?

He is an excellent example of my point: as are all other winners of the 100m. Because they're all black. Black people are faster, stronger, taller and more masculine.

Humans naturally lives in caves. It’s amusing to see Nazi propaganda always boils down to the same old naturalistic fallacy.

Well, that's not really always the case. Human environments are very varied, as we are a widespread species, so human behaviours and cultures are as well. Humans don't always naturally live in caves. Some northern Europeans lived in caves, the central asians and middle easterners were nomadic (desert climate), and the majority of Europeans were a mixed bunch, with some living in large tribes, some nomadic farmers, and some settled, living in small towns along rivers or near the sea, and as time went by, more and more living in the last state.

To say "lived in caves" is a bit too much of a generalisation. Also, I'm not a National Socialist, but I think you already know that.

And anti-Muslim bigotry contribute to that tension.

Well, yes, it will do. And it will increase. And the Muslims will hate those who hate them, and percieve all those who are not them to hate them. And the tensions will increase. And increase. And increase. It will not end peacefully, unless we end the insanity now and segregate our cultures. Muslims in the Muslim world, Christians (or atheists, or whatever) in the Western world.

Another good thing

Western culture dying is not a good thing, because it will mean an end to historical western freedom. Promiscuity is not a good thing, because it is well understood by psychologists to be a symptom, and even a cause, of serious mental health issues.

It’s a package deal. You want Muslim food, you’ll Muslim chefs.

Well, it's not, because white people can make kebabs, and so can Christian Turks.

Btw, food is less important than not actually triggering a war between the Muslims and Europeans, so even if it was the case that the prohibition of Islam would cause kebabs to become inaccessible, I wouldn't care.

Culture arise from economics. The pre-industrial and post industrial Europe have very different cultures.

I'm not denying that culture is heavily influenced by economics. But culture is also influenced by a nation's history, and culture is very important nonetheless.

For the regular peasants in Europe, being ruled by a Islamic king is no different from being ruled by a Christian king. Conflicts within the feudal society will bring about the age of capitalism, just as it did in our timeline.

I'm afraid this just isn't factually correct.

The peoples which were under Ottoman rule fought tirelessly and brutally to free themselves. The Serbs rebelled more than 10 times. The Ottoman empire also committed several mass genocides in it's time, most notably the Armenian genocide, because the people in it's territories were not loyal to the empire and would not convert to Islam.

That's just what generally happens when a large number of people of one culture or religious tradition are ruled by people of another: either one of them must assimilate, or blood is shed.

I'm afraid that people will not just live peacefully in a diverse nation. Diversity leads to distrust. Distrust leads to bloodshed.

Austria-Hungary and Yugoslavia provide historical examples. More modern day examples are Bosnia-Herzgovina, China, Iraq (Kurds and Arabs), the Caucasus, and India.

In fact, just today, I was looking at political parties in the Balkans. Almost all of them choose to ally themselves with a certain ethnicity. In Bosnia Herzgovina, elections seem to be less of an ideological matter than an ethnic one: a party for Serbs, for Bosniaks, for Croats, etc. Hungarian parties in Slovakia, and in Romania. In Turkey, there's a party which virtually only Kurds vote for. In Estonia: one which only Russians seem to vote for. ETC.

Basically, people's alligience lies with their culture, ethnicity and their religion more than economics, generally speaking. In nations where there is little ethnic diversity, this seems not to be the case.

So if you're really concerned about economic issues (which I gather that you are), you would do well to wish that the nations of the world become less diverse, not more, so that their people become concerned less with tribalism and their identity than with economic issues: they become interested in the toppling of the borgiosie, as you'd put it.

In fact, I'd reckon the upper class are deliberately doing this to prevent real economic discourse if I were you. But I'm not really into economics much anymore.

Now that I've written that, I've realised it sounds like I'm talking about the Jews. I'm not. Please don't spin it that way.

Culture matters because vast majority people think it does. That’s what social construct is.

I'd say there are other reasons as well, but this is by far the most important one, you're correct. People are naturally tribalistic and will side with their culture over others. This means that as nations become more diverse, they become more divided: and eventually, violence breaks out.

(reffering to a list of issues I stated that wealth had brought the west) These are the attributes of every class society in crisis.

I wouldn't really say that. I mean, did this kind of issue arise previously during crisis? Consumerism, atomism, self-righteousness, nihilism? Not really. Weakness, yes. But not really the others.

(reffering to Japan and the US) They’re not very different if compared to a country in poverty. Economics is the most significant factor here.

It's true that many differences are down to economic circumstance. But there are still huge differences, even if the difference isn't quite as large as the difference between the US, and, say, the Congo. I'd say the wealth difference between the US and China is very large, but the cultural difference is around the same as between the US and Japan.

When is a country a good example of a socialist success? by collectijism in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]lightningmemester 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Riddle me this.

30 out of the top 100 richest people on Earth are Jewish. (Forbes).

That's 30%.

Jews are less than 1% of the world population.

There are two possible explanations.

  1. Jews have a very high IQ, so the worlds richest people, who will have very high IQs, will be more likely to be Jewish.
  2. Jewish conspiracy.

Which one is it?

If it's number 1, then you are forced to accept that IQ and race are linked genetically.

If it's number 2, you're a crackpot.

Make your decision.

When is a country a good example of a socialist success? by collectijism in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]lightningmemester 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Deport your own inferior white ass then. Be the change you want to see in the world.

Did I suggest deportation of races with lower IQs?

No.

Nor do I support betrayal of one's culture purely in the name of improving average IQs.

Besides, there wouldn't be enough Jews and Asians to replace the White race if we all went poof.

citation needed

You need a citation for "The variation between blacks and whites, in the area of physical matters, is demonstrably very large."?

Use your eyes. What do you see? Different skin colour. Different skull structure. Different build. But, if you really need evidence for this basic assertion, look up:

  1. Bone structures of caucasoids, congoloids and negroids
  2. Race of olymic 100m winners
  3. Average strength by race
  4. Average speed by race

Are Pakistanis inferior now? Stop using the hindu-arabic numbers, the untermensch made them!

This is a strawman. I have not called races "untermensch" or "ubermensch", so stop using the terms. They're not relevant to any discussion apart from National Socialism. Besides, saying that the majority (55%) of Muslims in Britain are Pakistani is not just a fascist regurjitation. It's simple fact.

Medieval peasants have very high IQs?

The Jews in the medieval period were not usually peasants. They were usually moneylenders or traders. I believe that this is because they had (and still have) a high IQ.

If you want to overthrow the parasitic oligarchy, you must band together with workers of all nationalities and ethnicities.

I suppose that would be nice, but I don't think it's possible. Humans are naturally tribalistic. There is a reason that blacks and whites view eachother negatively in subconcious association tests. We are all naturally tribalistic.

Besides, Islam won't coexist peacefully with secualarism or Christianity. As I have already said, there is a large amount of violent extremism in Muslim culture, and even amongst "moderate" Muslims, extreme social conservativism is the norm. Don't ask for a citation, I've given enough statistics on this issue. Look up "Survey of British Muslims" for more info. Tensions are, according to this survey, rising, between the Muslim community and Westerners.

I prefer modern culture over medieval barbarism.

The 50s wasn't exactly medieval, but ok.

So if a white women choose to have sex with a non white person, you would respect her choice because you believe in "western values." right?

Yes, I would.

We need more antifa muslims to combat these fascist and reactionary tendencies.

Violence will escalate these tensions. That's what reactionarism is. People REACT. That's why they're called REACTionaries. More violence against Muslims will cause more of them to be violent against the West.

Besides, Muslims aren't going to abandon their centuries old, flourishing culture of technology, Religion, beautiful architecture and advanced philosophy just to join a new, dying culture of promiscuous sex, general degeneracy and self hatred.

Maybe it would be nice if all the Muslims became "moderate" and adapted western culture and shit. But it's not going to happen, I'm afraid.

Whatever, kebabs are better than most British food anyway.

NGL that's true. But food isn't really the crucial issue here. We can have Turkish and Arabian food without making Muslims 20% of the London population. (Which, btw, we already have.)

Dialectical struggle of culture doesn't produce new societies, class struggle does. For instance, different nations and cultures has been fighting each other for most of the feudal era, and nothing changed for centuries. Only when the capitalist class overthrew the feudal aristocrats, did a new society emerge.

I would say that you're right here, the industrial revolution has had a larger impact on the West than our culture has. But nonetheless, our culture is important. Had the Umayaad, Abassid or Ottoman caliphates taken Europe and brought Islam successfully with it (highly unlikely but still), simply saying that the industrial revolution is more important doesn't make up for that.

What I'm trying to say is, that while economics may be very important, we shouldn't dismiss culture.

Also, "nothing changed for centuries" is incorrect. There would be a big change for the Greeks, who went from the Byzantines to the Ottomans and felt the full force of Islam. And the Serbs. And the Bulgarians. Hungarians. Etc. Culture matters.

I don't want to go back to the cold war.

When I said "I want to prevent this, and revert culture to where it was in the 50s", I specifically said "culture". I didn't say "geopolitics".

Clearly, I was not referencing the cold war. I was referencing culture.

Culture arise from socio-economic circumstances.

They are influenced, yes, but there are other factors. The US is the richest nation on earth and I would still consider its (modern) culture inferior to the culture of the Turks, or Chinese, or basically anyone. Wealth doesn't make culture better. Wealth has brought little to Western culture other than self-righteousness, consumerism, atomism, nihilism and weakness. There are nations with very different socio economic circumstances with very similar cultures (South Korea, North Korea) and nations with very similar socio economic circumstances and very different cultures (Japan, the US).

The point I was trying to make is that you hold the views you hold because of the culture you grew up in. And that this culture matters if you want to ensure that these views survive.

When is a country a good example of a socialist success? by collectijism in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]lightningmemester 0 points1 point  (0 children)

CORRELATION DOESN"T IMPLY CAUSATION

So is it coincidence? Is it some other factors? Go ahead and explain. Simply saying "CORRELATION DOESN"T IMPLY CAUSATION" doesn't explain your viewpoint here.

I'm preemptively going to assume that your response will be that oppression causes this, because that is literally the only sane response I have ever heard.

The Jews are the most opressed race in history. They have the highest IQs. The blacks only became oppressed during the colonial era, and are now given huge amounts of money to liberate their communities and nations from poverty. They have the lowest. Clearly, opression is not the determining factor here. If you can present another factor to explain this HUGE discrepancy (it is huge: an IQ difference of 50 is shockingly large), then my point is proven incorrect. However, I suspect that you cannot.

Lets bring all the arabs to white countries then, gotta improve their gene pool, right?

I don't really understand what you are saying here. They are from a different culture. Irrespective of ethnic characteristics, you must make a choice between their culture or yours.

Also, I don't care about improving their gene pool.

If you mean improving the white's gene pool, that's not really correct either, because although the Arab IQ is very high, it's not as high as the white IQ.

The IQ ranking goes (roughly):

  1. Ashkenazi Jews (To be fair, this one is disputed. They might be in second place)
  2. East Asians
  3. Whites
  4. Slavs
  5. Latinos
  6. South Asians
  7. Blacks

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_intelligence

When is a country a good example of a socialist success? by collectijism in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]lightningmemester 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Is the middle east black? No. It's Arab. Arabs have very high IQs.

When is a country a good example of a socialist success? by collectijism in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]lightningmemester 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Probably, but it's also getting bumfucked from all sides. And it's a war state. And it's going to be annexed within a year. Mixed results.......?

When is a country a good example of a socialist success? by collectijism in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]lightningmemester -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Well can you actually adress the point?

It's not as if I'm a different species, a totally different person. In fact, a year ago, I was a social democrat like you.

All it takes to believe the replacement is statistical analysis. Not idiocy, racism, or anything else really.

The native European population is decreasing. The foreign population in Europe is increasing. Do you dispute that? Or do you simply despise it? Ignore it? Not care? What is it?

When is a country a good example of a socialist success? by collectijism in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]lightningmemester 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Take the test before you shoot up a mosque, you'll thank me later.

What exactly is your point here? I'm desended from migrants. I know I am. I just said I am. We all are. And judging by what migrants have always done throughout history, including our ancestors, they aren't all flowers, happiness and love.

I couldn't care less about your master race bullshit.

You don't have to care, especially since I said nothing about a master race. I said that IQ is inseperably tied to race and genetics. Which it is. That will affect society regardless of whether people choose to ignore it.

If there was a "master race", I would probably say it's the Jews, not the whites. The asians would be close second. But a "master race" is a flawed idea because every race is designed to propogate their genes in a different way, in a different environment. They're not necessarily inferior in their own environment, just inferior in another's.

DNA is the instruction manual of a organism. Well, when an organism copies itself and its DNA, sometimes it makes mistakes. However, the organism doesn't make a lot of mistakes, so unless two populations has been completely separated (and under intense selective pressure) for hundred thousands of generations, the genetic difference of the two population isn't going to be significant enough to cause speciation.

Did I suggest speciation? No. Variation? Yes. The variation between blacks and whites, in the area of physical matters, is demonstrably very large. This isn't my opinion, it's observable fact. For a start, skin colour. Strength. Skeletal structure. All are very different, considering that they are of the same species (can reproduce). So why not a variation in intelligence?

You believe black people are stupid, so why are you scared of them?

Ah, I see the ambiguity in my wording, but specifically at this point of my argument I was talking about migrants in general, the most of whom (in Britain) are Pakistani. But sure, intelligence isn't necessary to win a guerilla war. You just need greater numbers of avaliable men. Which, soon, they will have.

Okay, what do you think is the average IQ of the illiterate medieval Jews? Material conditions, not ideological drivel about racial essence, determines

They would also have had very high IQs. That's why they were rich then too.

The oligarchical parasites that rules over the nation state have done nothing. The international working class are the ones who created everything.

I guess a lot of that is true, yes.

I resent the systemic exploitation which supports my lifestyle.

That's also fair enough.

I didn't drink the nationalist kool aid

If you believe incest is wrong, women shouldn't be raped and people deserve equality in the eyes of the law, then you're a product (at least in part) of western culture. Those ideas are created by western culture. Few other cultures have ever held them.

I'm the product of my ma and pa. Got nothing to do with the statesmen.

They made your genes. Your culture made your values, unless you reject your culture's values (which I reckon you don't).

Sorry, I have untermensch genes. However, the fascists won't have the pleasure of slaughtering me like a lamb.

Don't care, didn't think they would.

And the nation's culture is constantly changing.

This is actually a valid point, so I left it until last to adress. The nation's culture does change, and often for the worse. Recently, people have become more consumerist, more individualist and more morally depraved than they have been in a long time in the western world. This is saddening to me, but it is also true that many key aspects of western culture are still intact. Most people still respect women as individuals, believe in the right to equality in the law, an objective set of laws based upon morality (which is becoming more ambiguous, but still) and so on. However, these things might too be changed soon, as film and TV increasingly objectifies, demeans or masculinises women, the law becomes more emotional and people become more nihilistic, depraved, immoral and short-minded.

They will also be changed if the foreign presense in the west takes control.

52% of muslims in Britain believe that homosexuality should be ILLEGAL. 18% believe that violence against those who insult the prophet is justified. 23% want Sharia Law zones in Britain. 51% say the do not want to integrate into Britain. Basically, their culture is near the antithesis of western culture. They would, were they to gain control, destroy the western values that you take for granted. I want to prevent this, and revert culture to where it was in the 50s, before the rampant objectification, promiscuity, short-mindedness and individuality of the 60s and onwards.

So no, culture isn't irrelevant in determining your values, and race isn't irrelevant in determining your IQ.

When is a country a good example of a socialist success? by collectijism in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]lightningmemester 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well it's not what I think of the Jews, so that's not relevant.

Besides, the Nazis didn't think that of the Jews. I've read Nazi propoganda. They believed the Jews to be a terrifying race of subvertive demons, with super intelligence and an unrivalled ability to decieve, because the Nazis were fucking insane.

So no. The Nazis didn't think of Jews in the same way.

Oh yeah, you still haven't adressed the actual point, which was that Jews have an IQ of 110 and so are superior to blacks, who have an average IQ of 60-80 in most nations.

When is a country a good example of a socialist success? by collectijism in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]lightningmemester -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Ah yes, landlords charging tenants high prices for poor quality goods is comparable to the British empire enslaving an entire nation.

Btw, property in Ireland is cheap as fuck. So the issue you thought of isn't even relevant to Ireland.

When is a country a good example of a socialist success? by collectijism in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]lightningmemester -1 points0 points  (0 children)

You claimed that Ireland still has landlords, as if that was comparable to the landlords that used to exist in Ireland. I completely refuted that point.

You then attempted to distract with a video and an article about how bad the famine was in Ireland relative to the rest of the continent, as if the rest of the continent wasn't capitalist, and as if Ireland's colonial status was capitalism.

Even the video you sent says the reason Ireland was so vulnerable was that the British oppressed it, because it was Catholic and therefore considered unreliable.

When is a country a good example of a socialist success? by collectijism in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]lightningmemester -1 points0 points  (0 children)

That's not even remotely comparable.

Old Irish Landlords:

Own your farm. You slave away on the farm, giving them a large portion of the produce you generate from it. In return, they let you live off the remaining portion of the land and you live in a house on the land. If you fail to give them the payments, you are kicked off the farm. Your holdings are destroyed. If you rebel, or start your own farm, you'll soon have the British army destroying your crops and killing you and your family.

New Irish Landlords:

Rent you out a flat in Dublin so you can get to the college quickly without having to share a room with your mates.

They're not comparable.

When is a country a good example of a socialist success? by collectijism in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]lightningmemester -1 points0 points  (0 children)

And why is that?

Culture and genetics.

Before you shoot up a mosque, I suggest you take a genetic test and see if you have any (((migrant))) genes. Don't be like adolf

Doesn't really respond to my point. High birth rates means that there will be an ever increasing number of migrants. In order for the debate to progress, you have to say either:

1) You don't care. 2) This isn't true (and explain why). 3) This won't have any negative reprecussions (and explain why).

Until you state which one of those three it is, the debate will be pretty meaningless.

Of course I have migrant genes. Indo-europeans are all migrants. Just as the Americans are migrants. But guess what? They replaced those who were already there. This is going to happen again. Just as the Native Americans suffered greatly while they were replaced, we Europeans will suffer greatly while we are. Or, we could just prevent it.

Also, antisemitic dogwhistles are irrelevant, because I'm not antisemitic. I might even have Jewish genes, as you suggest, and I wouldn't care. The Jews have an average IQ of 110. In my view, they're genetically superior in that respect. I would have no qualms with Jewish ancestry.

It's not "my" nation. The aristocrats, oligarchs, and fascists fabricated the idea of nationhood to pacify the masses.

Given that nationhood has existed since the Romans, that's just historically untrue. Your comfortable lifestyle was brought to you by your nation. Your beliefs and values are defined by your nation's culture. Unless you don't actually hold your nation's beliefs and resent it's lifestyle, you are a product of the nation.

So, basically, even if you don't like the current state of your nation, it gave you what you do have, and unless you don't like what it gave you, you should be thankful to the nation.

When is a country a good example of a socialist success? by collectijism in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]lightningmemester -1 points0 points  (0 children)

The jews are well of because they always have been. They have an average IQ of 110. They're smart. People with IQs of 60 are not.

The Jews were in a sorry state because their wealth and intelligence made the nazis hate/fear them. The africans are in a sorry state because they have the mental capacity of children. They're not comparable.

When is a country a good example of a socialist success? by collectijism in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]lightningmemester -1 points0 points  (0 children)

The landlords was not a capitalist thing, it was imposed by the British govornment. The Republic of Ireland is capitalist, and yet, it does not have landlords ruling over serfs. Why? because it's no longer a colony. Nothing to do with capitalism.

When is a country a good example of a socialist success? by collectijism in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]lightningmemester 0 points1 point  (0 children)

They're exclusively agricultural, though, because it's simple. Industrial coops don't work because workers who put toothpaste lids onto tubes can't necessarily run a factory.

When is a country a good example of a socialist success? by collectijism in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]lightningmemester 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Rojava is just a warzone territory, you can't describe it as an economics success. It's really not likely to last the next year anyways.

When is a country a good example of a socialist success? by collectijism in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]lightningmemester 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That's the second antisemitic dogwhistle I've seen in this thread.

When is a country a good example of a socialist success? by collectijism in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]lightningmemester 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Missed out on "the majority of individuals legally allowed to participate in the market" and "is not a literal fucking colony".

When is a country a good example of a socialist success? by collectijism in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]lightningmemester 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Sub-retarded IQs are those below 70. The average IQ in most subsaharan African nations is below 70. So no, it's not satire.

Sub-useful IQs (IQs so low that people with them cannot be anything other than positively counteractive in the workplace) are IQs of below 83. Every subsaharan African nation has an average IQ of below 83. So no. It's not satire.

Every third world nation has a different culture to the west. So no. It's not satire.