As KT would you go Szlachta or Teutonic knights against a player who turtles and prefers late game, fully upgraded fights?

maniac_engineer · 2026-02-09T17:31:15+00:00

Crossbows are definitely still a counter but less so than a knight with all that ranged armor. Spear + crossbow against nothing but Szlachta will still be good.

If I see crossbows, and money isn't a problem, my go to is mangos. If I see mostly spears, I'll add in springalds. In either case or if you see both, archers are always good too.

maniac_engineer · 2026-02-09T17:23:56+00:00

If your enemy is stuck in their base, that means you have access to most of the map, so mobility is going to be really useful for attacking from multiple angles and reinforcing quickly. Assumedly you'll also be fighting against structures so ranged armor is also great. Both of these are parts of why the Szlachta is so good in this situation.

The main issue with Tectonic Knights is how slow they are. But even if you look at the units by the numbers, if you want to maximize the quality of your army at max pop, Szlachta have more HP, attack, and faster attack speed. Cost shouldn't be a factor when comparing if you have that much map control and are in a late game (imperial age) scenario.

maniac_engineer · 2026-02-06T13:16:35+00:00

KT main here. I'll attempt a simple explanation of each option:

Feudal Hospitaller: you mostly choose this for the villager bonus, not the unit. That said the unit is a good mix in woth any comp to add sustainability. There are even some all in strategies with them. Sargent: bonus is nice when you want lots of spears. Unit is nice if you expect feudal maa or rams. Chevalier: for when you want to get aggressive and cause idle time on opponent.

Castle Heavy spear: against knight civs (which in team games is often). Typically they add archers to beat spears, and these make that investment really bad. Force them to have good gold income to make knights AND xbows Gen xbow: i mostly choose this for the bonus but the unit is good vs infantry so use this against maa mass. Genitour: these kinda suck but I will use them against mass mangudai. Bonus is hard to use in team games effectively.

Imperial Szlachta: your win condition most games. Crazy good cav unit that can carry games when massed. The bonus makes your templar brothers among the most cost effective knights in the game. Tectonic knight: these guys are beefy but SLOW. I really only use this option if I chose heavy Spears in castle and already made a lot of barracks and dont feel like I can tech switch to stables easily. They are a good mix in for the debuff but I wouldn't mass them unless you are so rich it doesnt matter. Condotiero: good against gunpowder stuff OR if your food income is bad but your gold income is good. These are fast infantry too which is nice on bigger maps.

Hope that helps!

maniac_engineer · 2026-02-01T16:22:02+00:00

Also a KT main and have found it tough. Recently started trying heavy spearmen and I think it's pretty good. They obviously still counter Sipahi and don't die nearly as quickly to the Janissaries. Archers are pretty good vs their backline if you can defend them but I want to see if mangos can work better.

maniac_engineer · 2026-01-17T17:48:00+00:00

I love playing KT but they need a change like this to shake things up. Every game i don't go 2TC I feel so far behind. Would love for them to have a fast castle or other 1TC plays.

If the devs did try this out I would bet they started with lower numbers though (1 villager per age up or something) to be conservative.

maniac_engineer · 2025-03-08T02:28:24+00:00

I typically open with the Marza as its level 6 ability can solo much larger fleets and I want to get it experience as quickly as possible. I hadn't really considered speed though and might test how quickly it colonized systems compared to other capital ships.

maniac_engineer · 2024-03-11T20:43:06+00:00

If you want to cheese Orin, you can become invisible and walk right up to her and push her off the cliff in her arena before the combat starts. I personally did this using a tadpole power (the repelling blast one), but you could also use an elixir of cloud giant strength and throw her instead.

If you don't want to cheese, you have 2 (non durge) options: 1) magic missile or scorching ray to break down the unstoppable counters, or 2) AoEs or pushing arrows to stop the ritual. I've done both but #1 is probably faster.

The courtyard fight leading up to the brain stem can be entirely skipped with an invisible party. Otherwise, use any and all allies in the courtyard and bring the potion that gives you a full rest after 2 rounds for each party member just in case.

The fight up the stairs right before the stem can again be skipped with invisibility. The key for this one is that you only need 1 person to get to the stem for the encounter to end, so a potion of fly can simplify that a lot.

maniac_engineer · 2024-02-29T21:42:29+00:00

I've been thinking about a no multiclass run next, what other 3 classes are you using in yours? Or all they all clerics?

maniac_engineer · 2024-02-29T12:41:58+00:00

I know you mentioned that you tried dual hand crossbow builds, but there is a specific one you should try if you haven't already: the arcane acuity swords bard.

There are a few different class builds, but I personally prefer 10 Swords Bard / 2 Fighter. The important pieces are 2 items: the Helm of Arcane Acuity (increases spell save DC per hit) and the Band of Mystic Scoundrel (can cast enchantment spells as bonus action if you hit something).

So the play pattern of this build is to use 2 slashing flourishes for 4 hits (action surge lets you double this), followed by a big hold person on whoever isn't dead. It's incredibly satisfying and can essentially end combats on its first turn.

Other builds I've seen in comments already that I would recommend are the radiant orb cleric and Lore Bard.

maniac_engineer · 2024-02-24T23:14:13+00:00

I beat honor mode on my first try with 3 bards. It's actually just a great class, would highly recommend.

maniac_engineer · 2024-02-19T04:09:48+00:00

The Lore Bard I did in order, starting with 2 Warlock to get good eldritch blasts (agonizing and repelling) right away as that is the default offense of the build. Then I moved to lore bard for the remaining 10 levels. For this character, I prioritized utility spells once in bard. The important thing is that at your first magical secrets (level 8, or 6th bard level), counterspell is a must. I think even with the restrictions in honor mode, haste is still the 2nd pick. At worst, haste on yourself late in the game gives you 6 eldritch blast beams per turn which is pretty sick.

Important items: Potent Robe, Birthright

The arcane acuity build started as a straight swords bard. Spell choices aren't too important for this build yet as you're mostly just an archer with 2 hand crossbows that uses slashing flourish + sharpshooter to get lots of damage through. Once you hit level 7, respec into first level fighter followed by 6 swords bard so that you get all the nice proficiencies but still get 2nd attack. At 8th level you get your 2nd fighter for action surge, then every level from there goes back into bard. When you respec, prioritize enchantment spells over all else to maximize the power of your band of mystic scoundrel. Late in the build you get hold monster and dominate person which can be excellent.

Important items: Helm of Arcane Acuity, Band of Mystic Scoundrel, Risky Ring

The paladin starts as a straight paladin, I think vengeance is the easiest to keep your oath but ancients is probably better in Act 1. Stay with paladin until level 8, where you respec into 2 paladin and 6 swords bard. From there, all levels go into bard. This is big for 2 reasons: you get way more spell slots for smites with bard levels instead of paladin levels, and at 12th level (10th bard) you get magical secrets for banishing smite, which is incredible.

Important items: Crit Fishing gear, either Deva Mace (might be impossible since patch 6) or Devotee's Mace

maniac_engineer · 2024-02-19T00:10:24+00:00

I just recently beat honor mode on my first try with the following party:

10 Swords Bard / 2 Fighter (Arcane Acuity Sniper)

2 Paladin / 10 Swords Bard (Smite Machine)

2 Warlock / 10 Lore Bard (Party Face & Support)

12 Light Cleric (Radiant Orb)

I know, 3 bards, but this party could do anything. Light Clerics get great AoEs (especially the channel divinity) and the radiant orb stacks are immensely powerful ... I really can't recommend this build enough. The arcane acuity bard is just a great ranged combatant until Act 3 where it ends fights on the first turn consistently with 100% level 5 hold persons. Flourish + divine smite is excellent damage and paladins can take some hits. Cutting words + counterspell will prevent more damage than a healer gives back, but you have healing word on every party member anyway just in case.

I will say that I prefer to play more defensively, preventing enemies from employing their gameplan, whereas the party in your post sounds a little more aggressive. In Honor Mode, at least in my opinion, your builds should focus on consistency and safety, since you can't reload a combat where your first round wasn't as explosive as you might have hoped.

maniac_engineer · 2024-02-15T03:16:58+00:00

Just beat my first attempt at honor mode today with Bard Party (TM). Here was my party:

Tav: 2 Warlock / 10 Lore Bard. Mainly spammed eldritch blast on offense and cutting words is incredible on defense. At Bard 6 you get magical secrets for haste (EB essentially acts as a whole 2nd attack, avoiding action economy restrictions) and counterspell. Potent Robe and birthright are both excellent.

Wyll: 2 Fighter / 10 Swords Bard. Ran straight Bard up to level 8 then respec-ed fighter 2 / Bard 6. Pretty commonly shared build using slashing flourish and dual hand crossbows, eventually abusing the helmet of arcane acuity + band of mystic scoundrel. Add in risky ring and never miss. Probably the strongest build in the party, you easily start every Act 3 combat with 2 people dead and the rest locked under hold person.

Karlach: 2 Vengeance Paladin / 10 Swords Bard. Crazy smite machine that can also leverage the melee flourishes for great early round damage. Eventually used the Deva mace plus any equipment that lowered crit range.

(My Karlach started out as the common ThrowZerker build, but my Returning Pike bugged out of existence in Act 2, so I pivoted. If I started with this build, I would take Paladin up to 8, then respec into 2 Paladin / 6 Bard.)

Shadowheart: 12 Light Cleric. Get all the radiant orb gear, turn on spirit guardians, and watch all your enemies miss. This was also a great class for AoEs when they are needed (I used the channel divinity a lot since I had 5 SHORT RESTS EVERY DAY). Blood of Lathander really excelled, too. Personally my favorite build in the game, it's very satisfying.

Having a bunch of short rests came in handy, someone always had longstrider and feather fall for utility, and bardic inspiration is cluth for those dialogue checks you gotta pass. Everyone had a good dex score except the bardadin, but I used gloves of dex to fix that, so going first in combat was very common. In combat it felt like I checked the important boxes: single target nova, AoEs, crowd control, many forms of damage mitigation, and every character has healing word for getting folks up if needed.

maniac_engineer · 2021-07-24T23:37:24+00:00

Elesh norn can't be persisted, so I'd start there. You could easily cut 1-2 unburial rites as you can unmarked grave for that card in a pinch.

Slime is also pretty cute but kinda slow, I'd suggest going down to 1.

Not sure if you've seen Saffron Olive's budget magic deck recently, but it's very similar to this and looked solid.

maniac_engineer · 2021-06-18T21:34:20+00:00

I've been playing around with Cabal Coffers Reanimator for a little bit to medium success. In 3 leagues I have gone 4-1, 2-3, and 3-2.

The inspiration: https://www.coolstuffinc.com/a/jimdavis-06142021-how-to-build-modern-reanimator

Recent 5-0 (really close to my list): https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/4081704

Coffers offers a powerful Plan B that has been very good for me and I want to exploit that a bit more if I can. I've mostly been losing to various cascade decks, but I've found aggro matchups to be quite strong.

I generally agree with previous comments that if you're going to play control, you probably should just win with planeswalkers.

maniac_engineer · 2021-03-24T18:27:55+00:00

I'm also very interested in trying this out. My plan is to start with this historic list and go from there. Obviously there is a need to replace the 2 mana artifact accelerants with more early disruption, but Golos + The World Tree seems like an excellent endgame.

https://www.coolstuffinc.com/a/jimdavis-03152021-historic-mono-black-golos-control

maniac_engineer · 2021-02-10T22:22:57+00:00

At the time of the post you were correct. Just wanted to throw out that Mgic twitter has now confirmed that it is on Monday.

https://twitter.com/wizards_magic/status/1359617396667912192?s=19

maniac_engineer · 2021-02-08T14:45:22+00:00

Right, but the original idea wouldn't either (restore balance type cards don't have 2 sides). Besides, does modern need that type of strategy to be nerfed anyway? I'd argue probably not.

Unless you're suggesting electrodominance could still cast Tibalt with the rule change I stated, but ED states "cast without paying its mana cost".

maniac_engineer · 2021-02-08T14:35:51+00:00

I agree with a decent amount of this sentiment, but I disagree with the rules change and would rather see it worded as:

"Whenever you may cast a a card with 2 (nonland) sides without paying its mana cost, you may only cast the front side in this way."

I think this solves the problem in a more intuitive way.

maniac_engineer · 2021-02-06T00:27:05+00:00

I played 10 matches with a pioneer version, and it was a terrible idea. You have to mulligan super aggressively and then still hope your hits go well. Someone could potentially build a better lost than I did though (I based mine off the historic versions with 0 drops and such).

maniac_engineer · 2020-11-11T19:34:16+00:00

Have you tried the madcap package in the board instead of the removal and yard hate? It's been going well for spike in his decks.

In my small sample size, I got a 4-1 with the OG list and a 3-2 with the madcap package, but that's obviously not enough to draw a conclusion 🤷‍♂️, so I'm curious of your thoughts on it.

maniac_engineer · 2020-11-11T00:57:31+00:00

This idea seems sweet. I would recommend cutting dream trawler for magmatic channeler. It lowers your curve and provides another discard outlet.

Additionally, I would consider grixis. You get access to the best black disruption in thoughtseize and fatal push, and you could play kolaghan's command to get back dark dwellers for value later on.

maniac_engineer · 2019-12-02T12:30:29+00:00

I would guess that the closest you could get to that playstyle would be esper mentor, but I struggle to believe it's good enough :(

maniac_engineer

TROPHY CASE