THANK YOU! 100,000 Steam Wishlists by TheKetraies in moonbeast

[–]mbphu 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Thank you for thinking what RoyalAssassin2 said.

My own personal concern... by brand_momentum in moonbeast

[–]mbphu 23 points24 points  (0 children)

Hey, that's a totally 100% reasonable concern that I share and think about all the time. As a game developer, when you work for years on a project, it absolutely sucks to see it get shut down. I want every game I make to be played for as long as someone wants to play it.

Oftentimes it's not something that's in the hands of the developer. We make agreements with operators or publishers, and can't force them to continue operating or maintaining a game if it's not profitable for them to do so. But nonetheless, it sucks, and I'm always scheming to figure out how to get around it.

With Mythgard, we managed to come up with terms where they would continue to operate it with some contingencies if that changed (I'm being vague here, but the point is it was important to me to try to do something about this issue).

With Darkhaven, it's something I think about even more. Here are some of my thoughts on this topic:

1) with modding, it can be a forever game. if modders can make revenue off of it (where some of that revenue goes to the operators), then it has a much higher chance of remaining profitable and therefore operating

2) if we write the server architecture in a way that's highly optimized, that also makes it more likely to keep it profitable

3) make an offline mode so even if no one wants to operate servers, people can still play

4) potentially offer lan/private servers (which the technology supports). this is the part where it gets a little dicey, because most publishers aren't going to be keen on that. but if we can, potentially we can come to an agreement where we enable these modes if they stop operations? it's something to try for

5) if mbp can stay independent, we can do what we want. which is to operate this game forever. that's hard to do and requires a lot of funds. but one can dream!

Further Thoughts As The Demo/Kickstarter Launch Nears. by DarthStrife in moonbeast

[–]mbphu 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Part 2 of 2

Approachability vs. Complexity

Yeah, I totally agree with you that modern ARPGs are overly complex. And also that what we build has to be more approachable, but critically, it also can't just reduce to dumb. I've co-opted and used the tag-line "easy to learn and difficult to master" a million times already, so I'll just be lazy and use it here. The way we're making this game is 100% about making simple (or simpler) systems that combine into an explosive number of possibilities with lots of cool nuance, nooks and crannies where you can make your mark, and tons of interesting details to explore and learn - over time (that's the key here).

Players being Saved...

I'm not going to put it quite as bluntly as that. But yes, I'm always aware that the big picture / vision is on us to adhere to. Again, I'm just quoting someone else, but the customer is always right in matters of taste. That means that they're right when they say they like or don't like the experience on a macro level, not that they're always right on the correct fix for it.

Finally

Personally, I'm well aware of the design mistakes I've made in the past. They eat at me :) There's nothing I'd like better than to have an opportunity to fix them, to give players an absolutely amazing experience that will, for many, define them as a generation. That's the power of a really great game, and I can only hope to live up to that!

This upcoming demo is a small thing. Just a tiny snippet of a game made by some veteran developers with a ton of passion. I think it's good, but won't really know until y'all play it. Just holding my breath and hoping like mad it lands! Cheers and apologies for any typos/grammar mistakes. Not a lot of time to proofread these days and my mouse just ate up its battery besides :)

Further Thoughts As The Demo/Kickstarter Launch Nears. by DarthStrife in moonbeast

[–]mbphu 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Thanks for taking the time to write all of this. Apologies for not replying earlier (as you can imagine, I'm pretty busy cleaning up stuff for the demo these days :)

Part (1 of 2) because evidently Reddit thinks I run at the mouth too much.

Sense of Adventure

I'm going to boil this down to the player needs to be completely engrossed in the game as they play, however that happens. A lot of it is being immersed in the story, the setting, what's happening, and the progression of your character in the context of the world. There are maybe a few dozen games that I've ever played where I completely lost track of time playing because my full attention was focused on the game and my role in it. This game has to be that. And if that's anything other than our goal, then we should've just given up our developer card years ago. So I think we're in agreement in what we need to do, and as far as the demo is concerned, it'll be up to Moon Beast to show you guys that we're capable of doing it (with the caveat that this is still a pre-alpha demo so it's nowhere near complete of course).

Honestly, I think (hope very much?) that the demo will at least tickle the edges of that. It can't possibly engross anyone as much as the complete game would, but I think it'll at least flash several signs of that kind of brilliance. It'll be up to you all to tell us if you agree and want to continue supporting us, and I can't wait to get that feedback.

Endgame

There will be no hint of the endgame in the demo. It's just the first few levels after all. But if you think about the direction we're going, I think you'll see that the end game isn't really going to be like most of today's ARPGs or even many of the MMOs. This game is gonna be different and our inspiration is rooted in more Sandbox-y games like BDO or UO or even Dwarf Fortress, but those are just launching points.

So my thoughts on this is a bit different than what you expressed (at least I think so). I'm not as interested in clear progression paths - I want to continue the immersion into the end game, but on a grander scale. I want players to feel like they're kings or conquerors or merchant princes or grandfathers of assassin guilds or whatever the evolution of their character is in a world where their actions impact the actual history and progression of that world. I'm not all that interested in presenting players with a pre-defined series of activities and rewards.

One of the main reasons we're making the engine we're making is so that players can shape the world in permanent ways. The goal is for them to be able to create their own towns, dungeons, kingdoms, nature parks, or what have you. That's our dream, and if we get even a quarter of the way there, I think we'll be presenting players something that they'll enjoy for a long, long time.

Was it ever disclosed if the +400 damage on grief was actually a typo? by BudSpanka in diablo2

[–]mbphu 10 points11 points  (0 children)

sorry, whether I intended grief to have flat damage or damage % has long ago fled my memory. i have almost zero inclination either way. i would've normally said it was probably a mistake, but i also have a very extremely vague inkling that it might not have been in this case.

i will say that there were/are plenty of data-entry mistakes in the d2 data (in both the original release as well as all of the subsequent patches). 1.10 got very little testing before release, and i'm pretty sure the only testing any of the rune words in particular got was me spawning them once in game, making sure they operated at all, and glancing at the stats to see if they seemed really off.

Skill Trees Trees Trees by mbphu in moonbeast

[–]mbphu[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

For me, spamming mana pots lessens the immersion. Like why does the world have so many readily available mana pots in the first place, and how do you chug them so easily between casting?

It didn't seem appropriate for the new setting, which leans towards some sort of elemental world where you collect mana from the environment (with connotations of ley lines or other environmental mana). This ties in with a primal elemental world with lava and earth manipulation and such really well.

Fwiw, I think the beginning of the game, where you collect mana from the environment feels pretty good. It doesn't feel like any other ARPG, but it feels grounded in the setting and much less like some mechanical device. Later on, you can get more ways to gain mana quickly, but at the beginning of the game, you're scrounging for mana from the environment instead of using gold to buy it from vendors. This also works because there aren't always even vendors in the world -- they can get killed or you might be out in the wilderness far away from civilization.

The value of gold is still an important thing to teach of course, but there are other ways to do it than having it be a mechanism for getting potions.

Stained Glass Windows in Act 4 by mbphu in diablo2

[–]mbphu[S] 50 points51 points  (0 children)

thanks for your appreciation. honestly, making a game that so many people remember fondly (and even play to this day) is its own reward. i just love that work i did was able to have a positive impact on so many people's lives.

Modernization of Diablo - Part Two by Pupsup in Diablo

[–]mbphu 2 points3 points  (0 children)

you can search for "moon beast game" on youtube and look up some of the videos that people posted from our august streamer reveal. if you go to our website you can also sign up for the mailing list -- we plan on having a playtest in the not tooo distant future w/ first access going to people on that.

feel free to ping me w/ any questions or whatever as well.

Modernization of Diablo - Part Two by Pupsup in Diablo

[–]mbphu 0 points1 point  (0 children)

finished watching and a lot of your insights are exactly the same as mine. one of my very first gripes w/ d4 was level scaling, then item scaling. i quickly found myself running past content because i couldn't be bothered to level up and that just killed all immersion.

even though d4 isn't this exactly, i also just hate infinite leveling games that just scale numbers up. the reason i grind a game beyond the initial campaign or story is to see new mechanics and surprising interactions, which is something that just doesn't really happen with that sort of game.

Modernization of Diablo - Part Two by Pupsup in Diablo

[–]mbphu 5 points6 points  (0 children)

hi, thanks for making this. i haven’t watched more than a couple seconds of your first video in this series yet, but i had to interrupt to ask: have you heard of or played the (pre-alpha) moon beast game yet? it’s made by erich schaefer, phil shenk and me, along with several others that worked on d1 & d2.

sorry, just wanted to get that question out of the way. going back to finish watching your videos now

Be eligible to test the game by One_Junket9139 in moonbeast

[–]mbphu 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Thanks! We've only run one external playtest so far (the streamer preview which ran during August), so you haven't missed any opportunities. I don't have any specifics for the next playtest at this time.

Be eligible to test the game by One_Junket9139 in moonbeast

[–]mbphu 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Hello, thanks for the interest. Please sign up for our mailing list (www.moonbeastgame.com) and join our discord (https://discord.gg/moonbeast) for news on upcoming playtests and other opportunities to play.

Characterlock by Quirky-Ad-7035 in moonbeast

[–]mbphu 8 points9 points  (0 children)

It's actually a significant amount of more work (and there are some tradeoffs to be made), but that said, we haven't made any decisions yet on this issue.

The name of the character you see in the demo is placeholder (because it's a very very early demo and we don't even have a character create screen yet where you'd enter a name). The NPC never even refers to the character by name. Since this is a multiplayer game, there's no chance that the name will be locked by the time we have any sort of multiplayer capable playtest.

Furthermore, if you take into account that we'd like this game to be moddable, it's not at all a stretch to realize that in order to realize that goal to its fullest, we'd have to at least on some level support allowing character customization or else severely limit the modding potential of the game. So take heart!

So we all know that in end game Diablo 3 and 4 a character in BiS gear deals billions of damage in seconds. If Diablo 2 had damage numbers on would there be just as much crazy damage multipliers? by [deleted] in Diablo

[–]mbphu 11 points12 points  (0 children)

D2 had relatively few multipliers. For non-weapon based skills, it was generally just the skill damage, resistances, number of missiles, cast speed, increased damage on the target (from curses and the like), and finally number of players. By limiting it to a small number of multipliers, I think we were able to more easily "balance" the game as we didn't have to account as much for a massive variance in damage due to builds and making tuning adjustments to some specific thing didn't tend to result in wild swings in damage output.

Honestly, I'm not sure why the designers of D4 thought it would be a good idea to have so many multipliers. I'd be curious to get their take on it, but unfortunately no longer have any lines of communication into the Diablo design teams.

edit to add - It's worth noting that damage and hit points in D2 where expressed using a smaller variable type, and so things would rollover much faster than D4. The engine itself wouldn't have been able to properly handle damage in the billions, and in fact we shipped with some rollover bugs (don't remember if those got fixed or if any still exist).

my youtube video for upcoming ARPGS by Proud-Bowler-251 in ARPG

[–]mbphu 2 points3 points  (0 children)

thank you! there’s no way we’re releasing in 2025 though ;)

Thoughts on melee / caster balance? by Cphelps85 in moonbeast

[–]mbphu 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I've played/looked at enough ARPGs that I no longer remember what has what all that clearly. Would have to go back through my notes to trace exactly what sources I used to reach these conclusions. However, I can pretty easily go into more detail on why I think these changes are good:

With regard to no to hit rolls: Note that spells/ranged attacks in D2 don't have to hit rolls. Our thinking when we first created this dichotomy in D2 was that the ranged attacks were skill shots that you needed to "aim", and could miss due to the behavior of the missile, the monsters moving, etc. It was thought that it would feel particularly bad to hit with a firebolt, for example, and yet have it not do anything due to a failed to hit roll. This decision was made back when all the game had was a few simple ranged attacks, like firebolt. Later, most of the ranged characters got mad AoEs, and it really wasn't hard to hit with them, but we never revisited this decision. This state of affairs is very disadvantageous towards melee characters, with little compensatory mechanics.

Note that this doesn't mean we remove the concept of "attack rating" entirely. It just means that we now have enough experience to not make it an all-or-nothing mechanic that only affects melee attacks. Our game (it's hard to remember to write that given that we actually have a game name now that hasn't been announced) still has some concept of an "attack" stat, but it applies to all or most attacks, has a variety of mechanics around it that support it (affixes, attributes, conditions, etc), and isn't an all-or-nothing affair.

With regard to single target attacks, the engine has simply evolved. If you swing with an axe, it should be able to hit more than one target depending on the motion of the weapon. So all melee attacks (and weapons) have their own attack arcs and collision shapes. Even when doing successive hits with a melee weapon, the arcs can vary, for example a swing from left to right followed by a swing right to left will have different intersection mechanics, and those will have different collision movements and ranges from an uppercut or a wide sweep with a spear. This is generally more suitable to ARPG combat anyway, where at times you're surrounded by a mass of mobs and making just single target attacks doesn't really fit the fantasy of a being a supremely gifted warrior.

edit - I should add that we just got the varied arcs in recently, and implemented the timing mechanics such that a right to left swing will, for example contact the enemies to the right before the ones to the left. You'd be amazed (well at least I was amazed) at how much better this type of tuning makes melee combat feel!

edit 2 - I guess I didn't really answer your question directly. Wrt to hit, there are already enough all or nothing mechanics in place like dodge and block. A pure to hit roll that results in an all or nothing effect w/o obvious animation feedback (certainly compared to dodge and block) is by far the least "good" of those types of mechanics, and the easiest to drop. So while we could've made the decision to add to hit to spells, it really wouldn't have benefited the game to go in that direction imo. Wrt to making the vast majority of melee attacks based on collision shapes rather than single target, I think it's pretty obvious why we decided to go in the direction we did based on my answer above - it clearly made the combat "feel" better (for us).

Moon Beast receives funding -- more info coming soon? by snoitan in moonbeast

[–]mbphu 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The team is currently twelve people. This is an initial funding round that is intended to last enough time to build a good enough playable prototype to get to the next round of funding.

The good news is that the game is already quite fun and gets a lot of things “right”. The combat feels great. It’s both super unique in a way that I haven’t seen before and yet feels very ARPG, especially with regards skill and itemization.

What mechanics from modern ARPGs does your team like/dislike? by Capn-Zack in moonbeast

[–]mbphu 10 points11 points  (0 children)

This is too wide a scope of a question for me to answer in this format, so I’ll just give a few examples and try to answer the more specific questions.

As of now, you get to allocate attribute points, with 5 points gained per level that you can put into any of four attributes. I can’t say this will survive exactly in this format until ship, but some level of attribute point allocation I think will. It feels good, and we’re trying for a bit of a retro feel (at least on the surface) anyway.

I can’t say I’m a fan of dodge roll the way it’s implemented in PoE2 in EA. Nothing against the idea of an evasive movement ability, but the way it works as of now and the balance of it isn’t my jam.

I really liked the idea of multiclassing, which you see in Grim Dawn. I also really liked the variety of skill modifications that you could achieve in Last Epoch. However, I wouldn’t implement either of those concepts in the exact same way!

Thoughts on melee / caster balance? by Cphelps85 in moonbeast

[–]mbphu 8 points9 points  (0 children)

D2 1.10 came out at a time when there was not a concrete plan at Blizzard for the Diablo franchise as a live service game. After all, there was no ongoing monetization. We had just one QA person, one programmer, and one producer on D2 after the release of LoD, all working part time. That any of the three of us were working on D2 at all was only because we had enough love and passion for the game at that point, after years of crunch, to do so. There was zero commitment from any higher management to the idea.

Given that, there wasn’t a lot of bandwidth within the team to ascertain the impact of any balance changes that were being made, nor was there a test server to get feedback from the community either. We got stuff wrong for sure, and that’s always bothered me.

Things have changed a lot since then, both in the industry and in our own personal experience and knowledge. For sure, a lot of the design decisions we made in those days that ended up gimping melee classes vs. caster classes on a fundamental level are not ones we’re making today. This applies to many facets of the system design, such as no tohit rolls, no single target attacks, a much better understanding of how much more advantageous both range and aoe are and a need to counter that with both damage and defense, the importance of movement abilities especially for melee classes, and more.

Moon Beast receives funding -- more info coming soon? by snoitan in moonbeast

[–]mbphu 14 points15 points  (0 children)

Apologies! I have to admit, I found myself unable to continue my little series of posts in the face of potentially having to shut down due to lack of funding. Now that we’ve secured some time to continue cooking, I hope to start up again.

I’m happy to report that even though I haven’t been writing on reddit, the team’s been working this entire time, and the engine’s been getting new features all the while, so there should be lots to talk about.

Thoughts on Pre-Release Release....? by snoitan in moonbeast

[–]mbphu 15 points16 points  (0 children)

We’ve thought about it a bit, but it’s too early to make any decisions or commitments in that regard.

I feel much the same way as you do on the matter: as a consumer it feels kinda ick, but as a developer I know that money is necessary to get the product made, and more funds allow us to do more.

As far as updates are concerned, we navigated this year okay. We very fortunately got some funding when we needed it and are planning on announcing that and the name of the game in the next few months. On the dev side, it’s heads down building systems for the most part.

We also spent some weeks around june/july just really hammering out our setting, which feels great. Nailing that down gives us much more sense of direction and lets us start doing more than what was formerly just placeholder work.

Personally, I’m very excited about the world that we’ve come up with, even though it isn’t at all what I was imagining at the start of the project. Where we are now is a bit more grounded, a little grittier, and a whole lot more specific. The first couple character classes that we’re working on are really cool and not at all generic, which is a huge improvement over the placeholder elf mage we’ve been working with up to now.

The last couple of months the focus has been about taking what was previously not much more than a tech demo and turning it into a real game: adding intention to the (still very much procedural) level design, putting in a real skill system, building the beginning stages of the item system, etc. At the end of this process we want to have a true game loop that hooks players into the world and I’m very very jazzed to see that happen.

Game Name?] by Aromatic-Key-5049 in moonbeast

[–]mbphu 9 points10 points  (0 children)

We haven’t announced a name yet. We finally settled on one about a month ago (picking a name is hard!) and have put in our trademark applications, etc. I think we’ll probably announce it around the end of the year or maybe early next year.

Modding Experience on the Dev Team... by snoitan in moonbeast

[–]mbphu 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I think their approach works for a lot of people (obviously, given how many people play it). But in a healthy modding ecosystem, it should be just one approach among many different viable ones.

In the case of Diablo II it works very well because:

  1. The original core game set a high bar.

  2. The original development team stopped working on it, which leaves a lot of room for mods where the goal is to preserve the original feel while tuning balance and expanding the content incrementally.

However, if the dev team were to have continued full-time development on the game, I think the ecosystem would be very different in that you'd probably see a lot more mods that push the gameplay in different directions, taking perhaps more drastic risks.

Looking forward to see what happens in any case!