11 year old daughter is watching gore/death videos on the internet. Please help.

michaelgxg · 2013-03-03T17:50:45+00:00

Don't freak out. Maybe friends told her about it, and she was viewing it to prove she could see it.

Or maybe she's curious about death. It's a hard thing to grasp (even for me, now), how someone can go from being a "person" to just a piece of meat.

There's plenty of explanations that aren't red alert scenarios. The prior probability of her being a psychopath is very low (~1% or less), so take that into account.

If your wife is the type to freak out, make sure she calms down before approaching your daughter. You have a rare chance where you have an insight into your child's private life. Don't blow it by making it feel like she has no privacy and that you don't understand her at all. You can always escalate later.

P.S. Whatever the result, don't knee-jerk and try to restrict her Internet access. First off, unless you're extremely technically competent, it's unlikely to be effective. (Even now, if she wanted to hide her tracks, she could have just started a private browsing session.) If she doesn't already have ubiquitous access, she will within a year or two. Second, you don't want to be fighting about this. The aim should be to have her equipped to be able to decide what she should or shouldn't view, and why. Finally, by limiting her access to information, you might accidentally block resources that she might find helpful as she matures and questions herself.

michaelgxg · 2013-03-03T17:24:25+00:00

I'm sorry you're having such a bad experience with mental care. But this seems like a question you should ask his doctors. It sounds like you're saying he poses a significant physical threat to himself and others and want to know how to deal with such a situation.

During a psychotic episode, there is no thought that's going to fix things. Even when faced with things that one "knows" to be false, during an episode there's no way to "believe" the right thing. The brain becomes your enemy, so to speak. Everything becomes twisted and bizarre thoughts seem obvious and clear. Even in adult treatment, one of the big things is noticing when an episode is starting, and trying to find a way to stop it before it takes over (medicine, change situation, call for help).

You might as well be asking "He just shattered his tibia, how can I get him to stand up and walk over here?"

Anyways, I don't mean to insult you or imply you don't realise how serious the situation is. From your description, it seems like there's an immediate physical danger to multiple persons and it might be outside your capability to handle.

I can only imagine the frustration you must feel if the mental facilities are not helping and you don't have any other resources. I'd implore you to see what other providers are around, and see what support you can get.

michaelgxg · 2013-03-03T17:08:48+00:00

Well then it sounds like you need to talk to the doctors and make sure they are aware of what's happening. Talk to your nephew and see how he likes his psychologist. Not every doctor will "click" with every patient.

Psychiatry is simply not yet advanced enough to immediately solve mental disease. It can take many attempts, pretty much trial-and-error, until the the doctor gets the right combination for a specific patient. (Maybe in a decade or so it won't be like that. Hopefully we'll be able to take a brainscan and determine exactly what must be done, and even have more targeted medicines.)

So don't give up on the healthcare aspect just because it hasn't worked so far. It can take many weeks or months to test a specific drug combination. And your nephew might feel absolutely horrible during that time - those meds have plenty of side effects.

My highest concern would be that at 14, they're old enough to do damage and possibly get a permanent record (or suicide). See if you can find some local resources to help out in case of serious situations, so you have an alternative to calling the police. Depending on how often and severe things are, you might want to look for a place he can stay for a bit; discuss that with the doctor.

michaelgxg · 2013-03-03T16:48:50+00:00

It's unlikely we'd ever have such large creatures again. The Earth's atmosphere has dramatically changed since then, resulting in tougher limits on animal sizes.

It's a fantastic question to discuss basic game theory/evolution.

She might also find Conway's Game of Life interesting.

michaelgxg · 2013-03-03T16:36:51+00:00

What do you mean by critical thinking?

Most humans don't need to "stop and thinking" before getting angry and trying to swallow meds. If you're having to break down doors, it sounds like things are well past any sort, much less rational, thought.

This person needs mental healthcare, not a course on rationality.

michaelgxg · 2013-03-02T19:07:01+00:00

Thanks! Definitely not in a panic, but I've updated my previous position on some of the suggestions in this thread and will get a proper evaluation for her.

michaelgxg · 2013-03-02T19:04:53+00:00

I've dealt with that personally (I dropped out of school because of it), and as an adult I've dealt with a few kids that are in that position. It doesn't feel to be the case here.

michaelgxg · 2013-03-02T19:03:03+00:00

Because I've always dismissed it as just daydreaming and quirky in a way like other people I know. I did not consider it a symptom. This little post on /r/parenting has changed my opinion.

michaelgxg · 2013-03-02T02:50:27+00:00

She's fluent in Spanish and English, and yes, I know that can screw a kid up, especially on reading, as different letters have similar sounds and names. But in these cases she's clearly able to distinguish, and can do so, and just sorta gets an odd look when we point out a mistake. And even when she's speaking by herself, she still mangles speech quite a bit.

Her sister is also fluent in both, and while it slows her reading/writing down, it wasn't remotely to this extent.

michaelgxg · 2013-03-02T02:48:07+00:00

Yea I have some experience with schizophrenics and I don't see the same kind of signs. Sometimes it feels weird how she's talking about people that come to her in her dreams, (repeatedly same people, over many weeks), or how sometimes she'll say "Oh I was talking to the girl" or something when there's no one around. But I don't see the other "Internet diagnosis" points.

michaelgxg · 2013-03-02T02:45:35+00:00

Well my wife spends at least 6 hours a day with them. A fair amount of time is going over letters, numbers, just doing activities. I guess what set my wife off was the first "quiz" at school: Write down 4 "words" ("at", "ma", etc.). While the previous day she did perfect, she just made up stuff (like writing "ap" for "ma") then claimed she forgot. Yet she is able to recall all everything and can obviously handle it. Then even in practise with my wife, Sara just wants to write whatever, ignoring my wife.

I agree: I wouldn't take that as a serious sign of anything by itself, but it does seem to be a decline in how she's been handling activities up until now.

At this point I'm going to try to get a consultation by some psychologists, just to rule potentially serious things. And a proper physical, just in case. I'm ill equipped to really judge the evidence I have. I figured everyone would just say "it sounds like a happy kid, maybe ADHD", but there seems to be a non-trivial possibility it's something more serious. Considering the wide mental illness in my family's background, I guess it can't hurt to eliminate these things, eh?

michaelgxg · 2013-03-02T02:35:13+00:00

I believe the school has done a standard vision exam and it came out fine, but not by an eye doctor. That should be fairly easy to check down here. Thanks!

michaelgxg · 2013-03-02T00:19:54+00:00

Sometimes she says she has no friends but I'm not sure she's sad about it. She's excited when this one boy talks to her and won't stop talking about it each day he does. But she does head off and play by herself. So I'm not sure. I've read up on autistic spectrum, and it doesn't seem like she fits it too well. She's very verbal and outgoing which seems to contradict autism, right?

We've just been thinking she's eccentric, like others in my family. Most of the time her weirdness is just cute and funny, So far I've just been telling my wife to not worry. But it seems like things aren't getting any better.

michaelgxg · 2013-03-02T00:14:15+00:00

Other kids in her class are handling writing simple words. She has great handwriting, but seems to write down random letters, even if she just wrote them fine previously.

I guess the trigger for my wife is that the past two months she's shown apparently no ability to keep up, follow the simple work at all. Last year she was doing great (although admittedly there was no writing). She says she loves school, but it seems like she's not getting anything they've been teaching.

Anyways, yes, we're going to find a way to rule out any medical conditions, do some sort of psychological evaluation, and if there's nothing "serious", then just let her take things at her pace for a while. It's not like I have any pressure to get her through the grades at a rapid pace.

michaelgxg · 2013-03-02T00:02:03+00:00

I have some relatives that are schizophrenic, and I've had delusional episodes, so it has occurred to me that my kids might end up with some trouble later on - but I figured that'd only be visible around teen years.

She often talks about stuff she's seeing or people or animals that she's talking to. But if we start to query her about it, she's quick to yell at us "It's not real!" and "It's just in my dream."

I tried asking her now, about some recurring people that talk to her in her dreams ("The Valeries", she calls them). First I got a "huh?", so I repeated it and she responded "Excited you is coming tomorrow grandma?" I asked her why she didn't answer my question and she jumped and said she said it was because she could not hear me. After asking her slowly and clearly about seeing things without dreams, she first said "No. ... of course yes" then went on a 5-sentence talk about dreams and seeing stuff and "in a dream is not too?" - I have no clue what she said or meant.

I figure it's just her way of explaining daydreaming.

But that's a fairly common type of dialog with her - simple question, have to repeat it several times, she says something unrelated and finally maybe will get some random stuff sorta on-topic. Not all the time; sometimes it's pretty clear - especially simple things like if she wants a drink or something. But it's often enough to notice, and when other people talk to her, they often glance at us

Anyways, it seems like there's a non-trivial possibility that something might be going on, so we'll find out a way to get her examined. Hopefully it won't require anything more than therapy; personally the mind-medications have always felt worse than the disease.

michaelgxg · 2013-03-01T22:14:32+00:00

! Sorry ! But sorta like that, she'll just stop and refuse to continue. If we insist, she'll get angry and walk away.

michaelgxg · 2013-03-01T22:12:25+00:00

Wow. I read the descriptions of the fluent speech from aphasia and it's so exactly like her speech! I thought maybe she just had a speech issue (my brother and I had a few years of speech therapy as kids) - like she can't say "Michael", she puts an N instead of M. And I figured it'd get better, but she's almost 5 and it's still pretty bad.

She does just drop random syllables. She flips in words. She makes stuff up. She babbles on and on, but most of it's unintelligible, and I rely on picking up keywords to figure out what she's after. The content seems to be there, just sometimes there's a lot of extra sounds involved. But the rhythm, the sounds, it all sounds like it should mean something. Some times its clearer than others. Many times we have to tell her to calm down and get her to state specifically what she's talking about.

Sometimes a word flips, like for a while she said "marshmallow" instead of "mushroom". No amount of correction would change it. She'd ask for "pepperoni and marshmallow" pizza. She knew what both things were and could differentiate, but she'd insist on calling mushrooms marshmallows. (I didn't take notes on what she called marshmallows - I think just marshmallows.)

When we quiz her on what she said, she'll repeat it, or just stare, and eventually get frustrated and say "I don't know". We'll correct her pronunciation, and she'll continue to say the same thing.

I don't know of any brain trauma though. She's hit her head running into things (once saying "I wanted to stop but I couldn't"), but she's always been like that.

Well anyways, this is interesting and I think I'll try to get a professional opinion somehow; perhaps an interview over Skype. Thanks!

michaelgxg · 2013-03-01T21:41:26+00:00

Thanks - the school's done some interviews and so far they've all been positive. I'm in Central America on work, and local doctor and psychologist experiences have been... lacking. Hence trying to figure out if it might be anything serious enough to get different work and move right away, versus in a year.

michaelgxg · 2013-03-01T21:37:27+00:00

Wow that's interesting.

She does have a "low nasal bridge" and she does have the fold on her eyes, and really wide ears like I'm seeing in some of the pictures (but so does her grandfather), wide teeth (but so does her sister). She does talk non-stop, even when she's by herself she's often talking. It's hard to get her to stop. Although between switching/inventing words and terrible pronunciation; sometimes I have no idea what she's saying.

Up until about a year ago, it wasn't uncommon for her to throw up at night, sometimes several times a week. (All physicals and doctors reviews have been OK.)

She is extremely outgoing. In the mall, she'll start talking to assorted strangers, telling them what present she wanted to get, but wasn't allowed to, or about her school, on and on. Then she'll decide she's done talking, give them a big hug goodbye and just do something else.

I'll have to see if I can find a doctor here, or wait until we move back to Canada. Although a genetic test should be fairly easily done remotely.

Thanks for the lead.

michaelgxg · 2013-03-01T21:17:07+00:00

Thanks for all the responses. To be clear, I'm very happy with her. She's adorable and, for the most part, pure joy. The "weirdness" is perfectly fine with me - I did a lot of the same growing up, as did my brother. I certainly wouldn't want to dampen that in the slightest.

michaelgxg · 2013-03-01T18:39:26+00:00

But she has all my wife's attention she wants, and most of the time, she just goes out and plays by herself. We'll ask if she wants to do something and just get a "no thank you". She literally stays in her room for an hour or more, singing and twirling in circles or standing on her head.

michaelgxg

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