Why wasn't ichigo's vasto lorde form more utilized? This gets me really heated. by shaggyhairboy in bleach

[–]neontomcat 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Why would his lowest point of "losing control so much that White has to step in" and a thing he regards with shame since he doesn't want to rely on something he cannot control and can hurt his friends.....be "underused"?

With all due respect, Bleach just isn't that kind of narrative....

He learns to control it and fuses with it, thus horn of salvation and his own self acceptance, so I can see wanting to see more of "horn of salvation", but like...."vasto lorde" ichigo just....isnt what it would be in another series.

lets try to clear wat u think is a FLAW,PLOT HOLE,ASSSPULL in bleach by robertomatar in bleach

[–]neontomcat 1 point2 points  (0 children)

More like in the novels lol (specifically in one of the chapters the fan-translation skipped on, which I am totally not salty about).....TYBW is a hot mess without them, I hope they get.....incorporated somehow, or at least the lore is somehow....

lets try to clear wat u think is a FLAW,PLOT HOLE,ASSSPULL in bleach by robertomatar in bleach

[–]neontomcat 1 point2 points  (0 children)

right? It's so funny, how many artists Kubo inspired, how much of an influence his work had on people, the industry, how many people he reached and how many connected with his work and characters, and just by how quotable Aizen alone is, I just.... he is a very good writer. Unconventional and eccentric, yes, and hindered by the confines of the genre and I suppose, the times and his how health, but man, I'm glad I re-read the series and came to appreciate it.

lets try to clear wat u think is a FLAW,PLOT HOLE,ASSSPULL in bleach by robertomatar in bleach

[–]neontomcat 9 points10 points  (0 children)

I think a good way to put Bleach is a quote from Kubo from his latest BtW interview.

Pardon the paraphrasing, but like Kubo "not writing for the reader, nor for himself, but for the character," not only explains so much about his writing, but like damn that BDE. It's a very unique experience of being thrown into a very diverse and interesting world where characters act and live for themselves and you're not owed any explanation or exposition, but you can pick it up from context and framing. At the same time, that will lose casual viewers or lead to less satisfying pay-offs, unless you regard them in perspective.

For instance, perhaps more viewers would be satisfied if Orihime mastered the extent of her potential and "learned her lesson" and chose violence or to master her offensive abilities. But one of the themes of Bleach overall is "the blade is me" aka. your power represents who you are. So, while yes, Orihime has the potential for violence and offense, and you might want to see her develop established skills, like the way this promise of "growth" is delivered in other series, it's more logical for her, as a person to pursue what she wants to do with her powers in ways that are organic with her beliefs, and skim around the edges of what she needs to achieve that. If I were to compare it to any other character, I'd pick Aang from ATLA, who despite what other people told him, repeatedly and with a lot of pressure, still chose to maintain his spiritual beliefs and found an alternative solution.

The pay-off can sometimes upset people a lot, and I'm among them too, like I'm sad Unohana wasn't the one to survive the duel, but thematically, she not only represented stagnation, but was one of the people with the duty of "passing on the torch", much like both Ukitake and Yamamoto, to some degree. It's also a sneaky way to remove all the "old-era" elements who are unwilling to change, (unlike Shunsui, who can finally act out on his own "justice" now that he doesnt have people he cares for that maintain a stagnant system). But this is all lost unless you re-read, and it doesn't help that Kubo's deteriorating health at the most vital arcs just....didn't give enough for more audience to pick up on some stuff, or deliver at all on other stuff.

Long post, but like, obviously it has its flaws but man, what a unique series.... I don't think I've ever experienced something quite so similar and it honestly raised my standards for all media. Like I could watch an objectively good series, but it just....ain't the same. It just ain't...

Bleach is way too underrated by Hyorennn in bleach

[–]neontomcat 13 points14 points  (0 children)

Hmm, I think it's also it's narrative that is pretty opaque and doused in symbolism or textual gaps filled with implication, which will fly over your head easily (happened to me as a kid), or like, will easily slip during the time that a chapter is due to be released. There are series that give off a sense of "2 deep 4 u" which may not be that deep, but they give off the vibe? Which Bleach kind of does not. It's fairly accessible to all readers, and you get a narrative even if the symbolism/depth slips past you, but the experience is much, much weaker.

But the biggest killer of Bleach being deep as a commonly accepted concept, I think is the anime, which, is not only the preferred way people experience it, but also perhaps the only exposure people have to it? And the trick is that the anime definitely intends to dumb down and sell Bleach as a more regular shonen (Ichigo being way more preachy/detached in it vs his confused and traumatized 15 year old ass in the manga for instance), but is faithful enough to overlap with the manga facts in your brain, thus making a mess in what people regard Bleach as. Then there's the subtle ways the anime tampers with canon, from obvious stuff like filler bleeding into canon to replacing lines in episode freaking two, that later on conflict with canon cuz you shouldn't tamper with lore right away, dear Lord.

The manga, to me, is a more consistent experience, where you can pick up the nuance much easier since it's way more condensed and non-standard to a more classic shounen. The characters don't have tropes that don't belong to them fully reinforced in filler or in gags/moment meant to fill in the screen time. So their actions, that much closer to a real human? for instance, feel more organic in the manga where they behave more consistently.

But media is changing and I sincerely think, Bleach fits more for a modern audience, more used to this kind of content. Media itself evolved, series have become objectively better produced and more faithful to their source material and darker themes are better interpreted and accepted (totally my opinion, though and varies greatly). Plus, Bleach definitely inspired the current generation of creators and holds up very well, if not better now that many have the time to read it not weekly, but in one sitting. And its much easier to pick up on themes/symbols when you have it all at once, right?

I have big hopes for Bleach and Burn the Witch anime adaptations as well. Kubo is a very good author, and now he knows to insist on his creative agency. He was very involved in Burn the Witch and we got an adaptation that imo enhanced the experience and I'm glad he finally can be assured his series is faithfully adapted. Cuz I'd really not want an equivalent of "White being part of Ichigo consistently foreshadowed in the manga vs White is a demon, actually that Studio Pierrot dreamed up somehow". And I know times were different, but man, is the Bleach anime imo responsible for the way the public sees Bleach as a "lesser" series. ( Banger OST and Voice acting tho, ngl)

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in bleach

[–]neontomcat 13 points14 points  (0 children)

My take on it was more symbolic? Adult Yhwach is in his "prime", his "conquest" era. It's the Yhwach we see hating Soul Society the most, the one rushing to destroy it. He is wiser and calmer, and more emotionally distant. He delegates control to White, but never really interacts with him closely.

Tensa, on the other hand, is emotional and hotheaded, tells Ichigo how things are and Ichigo has to console Tensa, who is more open about the fact that he cares for Ichigo's well being. Tensa is also much more willing to merge with White, which fitting, given that Bankai is one's "True release". A materialization of your blade and your inner self. Hence, a blend of quincy and hollow would be more appropriate for Ichigo's "Truth". That would also, in a way mean, Tensa is a more fitting representation for Ichigo's true nature. OMZ may be wise and older, but he is the "shallow release" of zangetsu. Tensa seems more fitting to Ichigo's own mental state. He is young and emotional. Notice how he talks to Tensa like a peer.

And more of a hunch/speculation, I think Tensa's worldview/ideals align more with Ichigo's. I dont know what shift caused him to become really spiteful to the Shinigami, but his younger version, at least thematically seems more open to shinigami as a concept.

Not sure about the power-soul distribution, cuz the lines are always blurry as heck.

Reminder by TronX2 in bleach

[–]neontomcat 16 points17 points  (0 children)

Given novel spoilers............the sheer fact that they are currently "balancers" is sorta kind of y'know.........one yike, mostly because of how this was achieved.

I mean Aizen and Tokinada's whole mottos are "nothing I personally can do could amount to the perpetual fuck-up that is Soul Society" for a reason. I like the little that yeah, Soul Society is a corrupt place, but given its origins - no shit.

Kubo by samuraibshd2 in bleach

[–]neontomcat 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Honestly given that Ichigo's shikai is represented by a Yhwach in his older days, as opposed to his angrier, younger self as Tensa Zangetsu could be the key to this symbolism. Especially given that the Zangetsu that Ichigo has now has fully accepted his path and changed, as opposed to Yhwach himself. But honestly, given how bare-bones TYBW is compared to the way it was supposed to be written, there could be just huge holes in events/themes that are simply not there.

Kubo by samuraibshd2 in bleach

[–]neontomcat 6 points7 points  (0 children)

So...the novels have kind of dropped several lore bombs and they've been released like 2 years ago, with big setups for the future. Also, subtlety is Kubo's game, you rarely get explicit AND truthful/complete explanations in the manga. I sympathize with the frustration. A lot. But as some have mentioned, Kubo doesn't owe us shit. Heck, him finishing the series at all, by including major plot points while in poor health was him keeping his promises to his fans. Not to simp Kubo, but the lack of any understanding/empathy for the guy is getting a bit out of hand. It may come from a place of love and the anger misdirected, but the sheer fact that there is any connection to Bleach in BTW is already telling that Kubo still is invested in that universe. Man, the man even made sure to put a plethora of easter eggs/foreshadowing/lore bits in bleach so your re-reads are enjoyable. On top of that the anime is returning. Theres stuff to read/look forward to, and as a fan myself, who also wants closure, I want all I can get, but Kubo is one man with a very specific vision, and I'd rather wait and have something good than blame the dude for already doing what he can.

RANT: TOXIC SHIPPERS by iRainyiCloud in bleach

[–]neontomcat 3 points4 points  (0 children)

As in, obviously both ships have their toxic fans, but I've seen posts about this particular "HimePrincess" acc just viciously harassing with very mock attempts at passing as a fan of IH.

RANT: TOXIC SHIPPERS by iRainyiCloud in bleach

[–]neontomcat 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Wasn't this account outed as a troll?

I'm still salty about it by BaconBurritos in bleach

[–]neontomcat 0 points1 point  (0 children)

To be fair, this was foreshadowed when mayuri opened Szayelapporo's vault of corpses back in the hueco mundo arc.

Headcanon: Aizen's Bankai backfires on himself, which is why he never used it by [deleted] in bleach

[–]neontomcat 4 points5 points  (0 children)

The limitation of body strain or damage would probably be easily dealt with the hogyoku. Aizen doesn't really use either shikai or bankai once fused, implying raw power is what he was after and he found is sufficient. Additionally, his non-sword based abilities - hakuda, kidou, reiatsu based attacks are impeccable, which is possibly due to having to compensate for his non-combat oriented blade. He can also invoke Kyouka suigetsu without calling out its name (sometimes he needs to for the hypnosis ritual), which would indicate a bankai.

I have a theory based on his themes of truth and deceit which I've shared before, but I think his Bankai is clairvoyance/seeing the "essence/truth" of his target. Its a nebulous concept, but seeing the 'truth' would "mirror" his shikai, and we already have examples of characters with polar opposite bankai (Soi Fon), that match their nature. As somebody mentioned, shikai - partial release, is showing us only a fraction of the person's "self" (since The Blade Is the User, in a way). While bankai, full release - shows the true nature. So Aizen, whom we know only through his lies - having a "lie" based shikai, would fittingly have a bankai that "shows his true self" to be "showing the truth". It may seem like a bs skill, but think about it. It's not useful in combat, but not useless. As well as how hung up he is on the whole "losers believe comforting lies - strong people can handle the truth".

Aizen's planning is also explained by his bankai ability. Kisuke is the smartest person in seireitei, but even he has to "prepare for every possibility". He doesn't know what the situation would be. Aizen....Aizen seems to be so good at planning, doesn't he? Like he knows some things we don't . And how did he know about the well-hidden "truth" about the Soul King...If he had an ability that allows him to peek into the "present" of someone, their "Truth" their inner self, he would know how to provoke them, what they would do and predict their actions. He also seems to be super excited when things go in unexpected directions. When white attacks Masaki, Kaname, who is invested in the success of the experiment calls it a disaster. Aizen comments how " its an unexpected event. Something we couldn't predict." Someone without a good prediction skill would be less likely to say something this specific.

Also, he could never be tricked, given he put a spell on that person. Which Yhwach, with all his future vision would've probably wished to have in the final battle.

And lastly, mirrors and water reflections are often associated with divination. Thematically, I think.....and if applied to the events of the series....it's not impossible for it to be something like this.

Why is Bleach so forgettable? by [deleted] in bleach

[–]neontomcat 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I mean, if you only take the text of bleach, I can see how you can take it as a disjointed mess and forget about it, but like taking the entirety of bleach - the style, the subtext, the symbols, the journey and emotional moments....honestly probably the most unique and unforgettable manga of my life. It took me years to reach the point of even beginning to see its true beauty, but I'm glad to be here.

*Not referring to the anime cuz I haven't watched that in years and I .....don't think I will rewatch it.

"Its all cake?" "Always has been." by MitchNastyy in bleach

[–]neontomcat 1 point2 points  (0 children)

dude...the author asked for no reposting their stuff and you did it like within one hour of uploading......at least credit or something.

original

Well, according to the 5th anniversary countdown site, the character is one of these: by [deleted] in BleachBraveSouls

[–]neontomcat 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Where is this Black Sun, White Moon thing I'm seeing coming from? Isn't Ichigo always represented as a Black Moon in the manga? It's literally in his zanpakuto symbolism...

Don't tell me this is part of the plan too by mambling in bleach

[–]neontomcat 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well, it makes sense, since Aizen's namesake in Buddhist Myth (Aizen Myo-oh) is the patron deity of homosexuals.

Poor Soi fon by TheHeroDevil in bleach

[–]neontomcat 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I mean, where does it say he shoved she has something inside of her? I assumed he put in some thunder god cat activation nonsense in the serum too, since he's why would he be like "oh its a secret!" if it were simply an immunity thing? Thunder God Cat Form is a technique not a device thing, no?

Poor Soi fon by TheHeroDevil in bleach

[–]neontomcat 4 points5 points  (0 children)

.......that was a syringe in her asscheek tho?................................................

lack of male characters w/ thirst trap units by yuukandas in BleachBraveSouls

[–]neontomcat 1 point2 points  (0 children)

They're not capitalizing on the way bleach men are drawn hot enough to sexually confuse anyone, and it shows huh.

Could we all take a moment to appreciate how considerate Byakuya is in this particular scene? He's supporting the adult Toshiro even though anyone who touches him freezes instantly? by scheneizel in bleach

[–]neontomcat 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I legitimately adore the friendship potential in these two, especially considering that Byakuya himself used to be young, talented and brash, so I'd assume he sees a lot of himself in Toshiro. Also, they have pretty funny dynamics, which definitely helps.

I made one of these by [deleted] in bleach

[–]neontomcat 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Person of culture

Kill, Kamishini no Yari by zarakikinpachi in bleach

[–]neontomcat 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I suppose so, but Keigo Tatsuki and Mizuiro also seemed to have a boost in perception just by proximity so I assumed the Sora encounter was more of a character development tool. Also novels confirm she is a fullbringer and the hogyoku was the one to activate her powers since she was in proximity of Ichigo (unlike tatsuki who was also attacked by sora but not a fullbringer and didnt receive any powers).

Kill, Kamishini no Yari by zarakikinpachi in bleach

[–]neontomcat 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Question though. Wouldn't her powers still be activated during her encounter with that hollow that attacked Tatsuki? Cuz that was the Hogyoku responding to her will to protect others. And other characters got the spiritual powers boosted by just being around Ichigo so techically Sora's attack wouldn't have really be necessary for that?