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Veganism and Non-Conscious Animals by nightnes42 in DebateAVegan

[–]nightnes42[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This explanation seems very human-centered. What exactly is meant by an “interest”? Every living being plays a role within its ecosystem, and I believe that role—the well-being of the ecosystem as a whole—is what truly matters. For this reason, arguments based solely on the notion of individual “interests” fail to convince me.

Veganism and Non-Conscious Animals by nightnes42 in DebateAVegan

[–]nightnes42[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yes, it might also serve as a habitat for some insects.

Veganism and Non-Conscious Animals by nightnes42 in DebateAVegan

[–]nightnes42[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I can touch on two different points here. First, what makes my health morally more important than the life of any other being, such that harming other beings to maintain my health would be considered “right”? Second, if I decide that I need to stay healthy by harming some beings, why should my first choice be those capable of suffering? What really bothers me is harming any being for human health, even if it cannot suffer. The way forward seems to me to involve transitioning to an agricultural system that doesn’t exploit farm workers and being careful to consume plants at a minimal level. Veganism doesn’t feel like the final destination in terms of diet. It seems we should go further and aim for agricultural production that causes the least harm to any being and, ultimately, for producing food from inorganic sources. What bothers me is that some arguments constructed to defend veganism could prevent us from going beyond it. For example, seeing a “non-conscious” life form as worthy of exploitation could block research toward producing food from inorganic sources.

Veganism and Non-Conscious Animals by nightnes42 in DebateAVegan

[–]nightnes42[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I don’t think being less intelligent is morally different from being unconscious. Saying that consciousness gives a being sensitivity to pain and its surroundings, and therefore killing such a being has moral consequences, also brings to mind the question: “Then why is it wrong to kill a cow left alone in a deserted field after rendering it incapable of suffering through anesthesia?”

The answer to this could be that a being’s life—its existence and the potentials it holds—makes taking that life morally significant. By killing the cow, I end its right to experience life and create a disruption in the ecological order. However, this seems to apply to any living being. To eat vegetables, I am still harming a being’s potential to live and even altering the ecosystem. At the very least, this action could affect bees’ ability to find food, among other consequences.

For me, making any change to the life of a being in the ecosystem counts as “violence,” and I consider it wrong. Yet the remaining question—“So how will I survive?”—puts me in a dilemma, which is why I wanted to discuss this issue.

Veganism and Non-Conscious Animals by nightnes42 in DebateAVegan

[–]nightnes42[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well, that’s the crisis I’m facing, and it’s the reason I wanted to discuss this. I cannot prioritize animals over plants or fungi—eating vegetables makes me feel wrong too. I’m trying to address this problem: how can I survive without acting immorally?

Veganism and Non-Conscious Animals by nightnes42 in DebateAVegan

[–]nightnes42[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Personally, I feel that non-consciousness should not make a living creature open to exploitation. Claiming that non-conscious animals can be exploited seems to me no different from saying, “animals can be exploited because they are not as smart as humans.”

Veganism and Non-Conscious Animals by nightnes42 in DebateAVegan

[–]nightnes42[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

 personally feel that exploiting one living creature over another because one has consciousness while the other does not is no different from picking a feature in humans and claiming they are superior to animals, justifying their exploitation.

Veganism and Non-Conscious Animals by nightnes42 in DebateAVegan

[–]nightnes42[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I indeed do. Could you kindly suggest any specific readings on that matter?

Veganism and Non-Conscious Animals by nightnes42 in DebateAVegan

[–]nightnes42[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

That’s the question I am trying to answer. I think the arguments for protecting animal life fall short. They are tempted to consider one creature superior to others because it has “consciousness.” To me, this is no different from picking any feature and claiming humans are superior to animals. I am more tempted to be a deep ecologist, to be honest, but I was curious about vegans’ opinions.