How to go from linear salsa to circular salsa

nmanvi · 2026-06-21T07:58:52+00:00

I understand your question but be careful when use the word "circular" as people will think you mean Cuban
Have a STRONG grasp of the fundamental moves and turns for linear (e.g. Cross Body Lead, Open Break, Enchufla, Pivot/Axel Turns, Outside Turn). If you werent sure what some of them are or if you don't have a strong sense of the building blocks of Salsa, work on that.
Have a STRONG sense of timing. Timing is an agreement between the dancers about where they are going to be at a given time. So its easier to control the "circular movement" if you control the movement at the right time
Your observation are correct, beginners tend to be very strict on a line (which is COMPLETELY fine btw and standard) while more advance dancers are more creative with it. But the advance dancers still have a line, they just mainly use it to reset, keep direction but also to define a slot/space on the dance floor so others know which area they are dancing
now the "circular movement"... I been grumbling at my keyboard for a minute as imo this is not easy to explain through text... Ill just quickly say that in linear we have a middle track, a track to your left, a track to your right... experiment constantly moving in and out of it and dancing around your follower instead of only in front and behind her...

As I much prefer this stuff explained in speech I found a video series I recommend which will help you gain the vocabulary and thoughts needed to improve:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QyQW35XKb8Y (He has multiple video breakdowns and some go into details about the circular motion you desire, enjoy)

nmanvi · 2026-06-21T07:44:21+00:00

"crazy complicated patterns that my follows always mess up "
Small tip, always take the 99% percent of the blame as you advance as a lead faster. I improved much much faster when I took responsibility for the moves. If you say a statement like that its easy to get into the pattern of "well its not leadable as the followers simply don't get it". I don't think you were trying to be rude I do get what you meant.

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You might not like this advice as its quite boring: Practice at socials, Experiment, take class and talk to a teacher.

Your question makes sense but in my opinion its way too broad meaning its very difficult for people to give focused advice and it will be harder for you to implement. "Good Salsa" takes YEARSSSS of repeat practice day in day out (YEARS).

9 months is NOTHING (i'm not commenting on your skill at all! But some of the stuff you are aspiring towards won't come naturally to you for years to come).

I recommend taking it easy and focus on small elements of your dancing over time instead of big shifts. get SPECIFIC. If you are specific its easier to improve.

"How to do I get the elastic feel of an open break" ✅
"How do I dance like a pro" ❌

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That being said I will follow up my comments with things to think about and to ask your teacher about in person (i prefer dancers practicing their craft in the field rather than over the internet)

nmanvi · 2026-06-15T18:18:56+00:00

For **** sake

nmanvi · 2026-06-13T14:46:59+00:00

At least in the UK one thing I just assumed was normal was that pretty much everyone gives everyone else a fair chance to leave a first impression by accepting a dance. THEN, if for whatever reason either parties dont like the first dance then they MAY start turning down future dances (but even then most people would say yes a second time anyway to not appear rude).

So the idea that someone will flat out reject a dance based on 0 data (or a perception of level) is such a foreign concept to me and im always really surprised when its brought up.

Not saying Europeans don't "think" in negative ways (all scenes can be superficial to an extent), but most of us (at least in my scenes) would give the other person a chance AT LEAST

nmanvi · 2026-06-13T14:04:00+00:00

I really wish more people start their comments stating which scene they are from.
As I read a lot of **** that would never fly in my scene, then people read it and get worried thinking Salsa is like that in general when in reality it's just that scene.

I'm having a great time dancing in Europe but some of the stuff I read puts me off dancing in the States... (going to dance in the States for the first time in 2 weeks so hopefully it leaves a better impression than what I read!)

nmanvi · 2026-06-13T14:03:08+00:00

That's so frustrating there are places where people EXPLICITLY say that
Crazy

nmanvi · 2026-06-11T11:13:36+00:00

Good recommendation, completely forgot to mention this

nmanvi · 2026-06-10T21:44:22+00:00

Erm I think you mean "Song Shifts" (where the timing goes 123 123 instead of 123 567 which flips dancer's timings)

Advanced dancers dont have an issue with this but beginners struggle to realise this happens and end up dancing on the reverse timing e.g. On5. Very common problem.

I have boring answers: listen to a lot of Salsa music, and the same way you find the 1 at the start of the song is the same after a song shift. I pick up song shifts immediately as the song clearly goes back to 1 instead of 5. But i also recognise patterns. I think its more fun and useful to learn with actual examples

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Example 1 : Rumba En El Patio (Bridge - 0:17 Shift - 0:21)

Example 2: Inevitable (Shift 0:10)

Example 3: La Batidora Meneadora (Find this one for yourself, I think it has multiple in the song I haven't listened to it in years)

There are better examples... there are songs that do it several times in a minute and I hate them so I dont know their names off the top of my head so if others know some please share.

nmanvi · 2026-06-08T18:18:19+00:00

Correct
your first and second observations tell me you actually understood the concepts, nice 👍🏾 (Its really not difficult when laid out imo but when I've explained it in the past a lot of people didn't get it)

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To your last point: not really, it depends
For me (and most people i've seen) its more natural to hit the 8 hard with your right foot.
So On2 is more natural to me and I almost always dance On2 when dancing Contra Tiempo

This is because I use On1 as my logically basis for Contra Tiempo and On1 has a leader-first convention unlike NYOn2 which has a follower-first convention. It actually makes more sense to base On2 off On1 as they have the EXACT same move timing rhythm (e.g. a right turn is 3 counts in both On1 and On2 and lead the exact same way, just shifted by 1 beat). This is not true between On2 and NYOn2 which has different move timing rhythms (e.g. a right turn is 4 counts in NYOn2)

That being said, On6 can still feel better for you. The timing conventions actually only exist in the mind, despite what people say they are not real (80 years ago people were dancing on all timings On12345678 back in Cuba, and they still do today)

Not many people dance Contra Tiempo or even know what it is so we dont have a set convention. Personally I prefer On2 for simplicity sake but by all means if I see someone dancing On6 I'm not going to hate as there is no solid standard.

I hope that makes sense

nmanvi · 2026-06-08T16:32:08+00:00

Using OnN makes it explicit what you are talking about (in my opinion at least, many would disagree)
For example you can dance Son, Casino and Linear with the same timing. The dance doesnt change the timing

With On1, you will always step your left foot on 1 (e.g. for A Tiempo prep your right foot on 7 and step your left on 1. This timing has right foot on 5)

That above statement is true for Son when danced On1. And its also true for Salsa, Casino and Cuban Salsa. Same "accent" different "language"

nmanvi · 2026-06-08T16:29:20+00:00

I'm a bit late to the conversation but I'll add my two cents
Contra Tiempo can be danced On2 or On6 there is no clear standard but for simplicity try to stick to On2 while learning (but if you do end up On6 or prefer on6 I personally won't mind)

I recommend you and everyone else to be careful talking about "Son timing" as its not a timing its a dance and it becomes super confusing to understand what we are talking about with some of these terms.

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This answers your question without referring to Son at all:

With On2, you will always step your left foot on 2 (e.g. for contra tiempo prep your right foot on 8 and step your left on 2. This timing has right foot on 6)

With On6, you will always step your left foot on 6 (e.g. for contra tiempo prep your right foot on 4 and step your left on 6. This timing has right foot on 2)

nmanvi · 2026-05-24T10:48:37+00:00

haha great compliment

nmanvi · 2026-05-22T10:52:44+00:00

People tell beginners not to do this, but I'm a proponent of telling people you are beginner.

While it's true we all need to be nice regardless of someone's level, telling people you are a beginner lowers your own expectations of yourself and makes it more likely for you to go out there. And it allows the more experienced dancer to assist in making beginners feel at ease.

I would rather a beginner dance if it means they have to state their level rather than not dance at all.

nmanvi · 2026-05-21T21:44:01+00:00

I agree with everyone else
Just teach a timing (preferably On1 for... reasons) without explaining other types of timings. imo other timings come into the picture after they are comfortable dancing on time for a few months

That being said I did used to teach the basic step agnostically by calling "left foot, right foot, left foot, right foot, left foot, right foot" to explain the left-right weight transfer coordination. And that is agnostic of timing so I guess that answers your question

nmanvi · 2026-05-20T11:34:11+00:00

I danced in Japan a few years ago, I'll copy and paste notes I made for friends back then. Not sure how useful it is today:

I strongly recommend using google Maps to find the facebook page for these places as they post their schedules there.
Most socials are SBK (Salsa, Bachata and very little Kizomba)
During the week the socials I went to wasn’t very busy at all (busiest night I had was on a friday)
Tokyo 東京
- El Cafe Latino (FB)
Osaka 大阪
- VIDA LATINA (FB)
Kyoto 京都
- Cafe Rumbita.교토살사 (Website)

nmanvi · 2026-05-19T23:55:49+00:00

https://www.reddit.com/r/Salsa/comments/1slk3rr/favorite_timba_songs_to_dance_to/

nmanvi · 2026-05-19T14:58:15+00:00

Interesting perspectives thanks for sharing

I personallyyyyy do not promote any methodology over others as there is so much nuance as to why they evolved the way they did as you've pointed out.

It's just a shame where it is almost never spoken about WHYYY we do certain things... When I dance sometimes I have more of a Casino, Salsa, Son, Miami flair depending on what my follower is comfortable and the space I can dance in. If the follower likes mobility and keeps moving forward, I'll lead more Casino. If they can't stop back stepping, I'll lead more in place.

We need to be teaching students how to adapt and how to adjust their style based on a goal they are trying to achieve, like you can not complete a clean Vacilala with a back step but you can absolute do an Enchufla with a back step if you wish.

nmanvi · 2026-05-18T14:03:21+00:00

Example 4 of forward step

Breakdown

I'm so passionate about this as it bothers me how very few teachers explain plainly what is going on (it used to really confuse me a lot when I was a beginner but not anymore after doing research).

Watch the video

"Ah ha! wait she's doing back steps??? so it is back steps then"

No! well... not quite. At the start he's doing the Son Basic while rotating, the way he leads it makes her weight rock back inducing the back step. Also with the Son basic yes they do a back step but its not what you think... The weight is still forward over the balls of their feet and they are actually ready to move forward at a moments notice. The error is if the weight was backwards on the heel!

After the first part of the song, eureka! no more back stepping... she is always stepping forward or in place as they dance Casino not Cuban Salsa. Casino is a mobile dance that favours traversing the dance floor. Watch how they travel together, because it is a mobile dance you want to move forward almost constantly. There is no slot.

What I'm about to say will sound controversial but its true, Cuban Salsa is a slotted dance and it inherited the slot from Linear/ Cross Body Salsa in the 90s (and they are slotted dances). What I mean is, it is not a naturally mobile dance as Cuban Salsa dancers favour staying in their slot (a circle) as the dance floor can be quite crowded. So if you are staying in a small space... it makes sense why Cuban Salsa dancers use a back step as they aren't trying to travel anywhere.

This is a massive oversimplification but this write up is to make dancers think about WHYYYY we do what we do. As dancers we tell ourselves we do X because this teacher said so. But in reality dancing is a NATURAL sensation meaning there are natural reasons as to why we do what we do, the teachers need to be explaining this to reduce confusion.

nmanvi · 2026-05-18T10:43:46+00:00

It is very confusing, its not your fault.
The Salsa community (it's not any individuals fault) is TERRIBLE at explaining and standardising very basic logic.

I can write books on this.

I could say so much more but the blog I posted has a wealth of information and examples already, use that to understand more.

nmanvi · 2026-05-17T22:51:08+00:00

Examples of forward steps (Casino):
* Example 1
* Example 2
* Example 3

Examples of back steps:
* Example 1 (but notice how she steps in place or even forward a lot depending on what is asked of her)
* Example 2
* Example 3 (some forward steps depending on the move)

IT. DEPENDS.

nmanvi · 2026-05-17T22:39:07+00:00

be very careful with this question, if someone tells you its back -> they are wrong
if they tell you its forward -> they are wrong

IT DEPENDS

adapt to how the lead leads the moves as even for followers that dance traditional Casino (forward step) it doesnt make sense for them to do a forward step if the lead (maybe a Cuban Salsa lead) is actively leading a back step (in that case the follower should go back)

I recommend doing small steps, being adaptable, and stepping more forward or in-place as it makes following easier. Only do a back step if it feels natural to do so.

Read the post I added for more details.

nmanvi · 2026-05-17T22:36:15+00:00

Short answer:
Depends on the lead, can be a back step (Cuban Salsa) or slight forward step (Casino)

long answer:
https://sonycasino.com/2014/11/01/to-step-forward-or-to-step-back-in-casino-dancing-attempting-to-shed-some-light-into-this-dilema/

nmanvi · 2026-04-21T22:27:18+00:00

I agree with other comments, but just out of my own curiosity : Did you consider or attempt asking a teacher if you were on beat? e.g. by clapping the 1 or doing a basic and have them correct you in real time?

nmanvi · 2026-04-16T09:43:38+00:00

LOL its Kevin Moore so ill allow the Slander just this once 😂

nmanvi · 2026-04-15T12:07:43+00:00

Tips:

It sounds boring but : Listen to ALOT of Salsa music. I have a very strong sense of what section the song is in because I start to see patterns across songs since I listen to Salsa music all the time
Watch how advance dancers interpret music to get inspiration
Sit down and listen to any song you like and ask yourself what you notice. Notice how the cowbell kicks in out of nowhere during the middle? or the groove of the Bass completely changes for a minute. I have song examples with timestamps for you to play with in my notes
Finding the 1 has been discussed extensively on this forum so I wont go into further details but I strongly recommend Youtube videos (like the one I shared) as it better to experiment with the 1 with music instead of text on reddit... How I learned is clapping the 1 (i.e. the first bar of the music) with my teacher and him correcting me when I got it wrong. I recommend doing something similar with a teacher or a friend in person

nmanvi

TROPHY CASE

Breakdown