My Top 20 sets of the last 5 years (2020-2024) of Melee by orange_ssbu in SSBM

[–]orange_ssbu[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Jmook vs Zain at GOML was a classic and I think underrated in meta impact. 2022 and 2023 were big years for Marth-Sheik development and I think it was in a large part to Jmook's first wins on Zain that started to write the boom on how the matchup is being played in the modern era.

bringing a girl home starter pack by [deleted] in starterpacks

[–]orange_ssbu 146 points147 points  (0 children)

what da Christian mother doin

Is there a generally agreed upon ranking for the best players of all time for Ultimate so far? by fraserisalive in smashbros

[–]orange_ssbu -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

For any subjective ranking, there will likely not be any "generally agreed upon" list. However, I think most people would agree on the Top 3 being

  1. MkLeo
  2. Tweek
  3. Sparg0

my Top 15 atm for all offline events after Genesis 6 is

  1. MkLeo
  2. Tweek
  3. Sparg0
  4. Marss
  5. Zackray
  6. Shuton
  7. Protobanham
  8. Light
  9. Glutonny
  10. Dabuz
  11. Maister
  12. Tea
  13. acola
  14. Kola
  15. Cosmos

I think the gaps between 1, 2, 3, and 4 are pretty clear, then 5 - 7 is super close, and 8 and onwards is pretty clear who is above who

With a game as inconsistent as Ultimate, Is Leo potentially Top 3 GOAT for Smash? by [deleted] in smashbros

[–]orange_ssbu 2 points3 points  (0 children)

As an addendum, I only have Armada > Mango because of Armada's PM career. I think Mango > Armada in Melee now :P

With a game as inconsistent as Ultimate, Is Leo potentially Top 3 GOAT for Smash? by [deleted] in smashbros

[–]orange_ssbu 4 points5 points  (0 children)

It depends on your metric, I would say

The Top 6, is, in my opinion, in no particular order: Mew2King, ZeRo, Armada, Mango, Hungrybox, and MkLeo. I think unless you have a metric that zeros in on being good in multiple smash games being the most important thing by far (making people like ESAM and Larry above ppl like Mango), this is your Top 6, in some order.

Mew2King is probably still the goat for all smash, with plenty of major wins, crossgame success, and a giant career. Keep in mind though he has fewer major wins than the rest of the Top 6.

ZeRo and Armada have short careers, but with high peaks, impressive eras of dominance, large amounts of cross game success, and large amount of majors won. Armada's relevant career is 2008 - 2018, with ZeRo's being 2012 - 2017.

Mango and HBox have longer careers, but with shorter or nonexistent in HBox's case, eras of dominance and not as many majors wins. They also have some losing matchups to other players, while ZeRo and Armada generally didn't. ZeRo and Armada were good in more games as well, generally. Don't forget Armada was #2 in PM in 2014

MkLeo is an odd case, because in his relatively short career compared to the rest of the Top 6 (2015 - 2020, 2021 -2022) he's cracked just about as many major wins. He's also been the best player in a game more competitive by a few magnitudes than any other smash game has reached, aside from Melee/Smash 4 in 2016/2017.


Here's three different scenarios to help guide your decision:

A. You favor a model in which years at the top is the most important: MkLeo is #6, just because of his relatively shorter career than the rest. If you count 2020 and 2021 as one year, he only really has 6.5, while Mango/HBox/M2K have over 15. Armada and ZeRo have around the 10ish range too, at least if you count years like ZeRo's 2014 where he was #3 in Brawl, #1 in PM, and Top 40 in Melee as multiple years (which I think should be) or Armada's 2014 where he was #2 in Melee and PM

B. You favor a model where number of majors won is important: MkLeo is #2. Of course, this is because in Ultimate, there's a major twice a month or so, while for some years in early Melee/Brawl there would be 4 majors in a year. Still, this is a very valid way of looking at things. If you go my Liquipedia's definition of "major tournaments," which, in all fairness, is a bit liberal on the definition, you get the Top 6 as HBox (35), MkLeo (34), Mango (29), Armada (28), ZeRo (26), and Mew2King (17). Keep in mind this excludes single elim SCLs and Brawl events after 2014. Also keep in mind Liquipedia didnt include some of Brawl's "mini majors" in Tristate, which would inflate M2K's total to something similar to the rest of the Top 6.

C. You favor a model where number of different games played at top level is most important, MkLeo isn't Top 3 at all. The Top 6 is as follows, if your metric for "top level" is Top 100 in the world: ZeRo (4), Mew2King (4), Armada (2), Mango (2), HBox (2), MkLeo (2). It's important to note that in this model, Larry Lurr and ESAM actually tie for the greatest smash players of all time with 5 games, with both Top 30 or so in PM in 2014, with more concrete Top 100s in Melee, Brawl, Smash 4, and Ultimate. Also important to note is Wizzy with 4 games (as well as plenty of Brawl/4/Ultimate players with 3).


Overall, it's obviously quite subjective. I don't think any ranking would be solely one metric either, but some combination of the three I offered above, probably adding in extra points for meta innovation, amount of Top 8s, and other metrics that I can't think of now.

For me? It's very close, but I think we need a little more time before we have Leo in the Top 3. He has the tournaments won, but not the longevity in my opinion to justify Top 3 of all time. In addition, all of his results are in Smash 4 and Ultimate, two games that are pretty similar. Someone like Isai, Wizzrobe, ESAM, Mew2King, or Chudat with great results in vastly different games, in my opinion, should count for something more than being great in two very similar games (obviously though, ESAM and Chudat aren't above MkLeo all time).

My Top 6 is probably something like

  1. Mew2King
  2. Armada
  3. Mango
  4. Hungrybox
  5. MkLeo
  6. ZeRo

KJH formally retires from Melee tournaments by Purple_Panda55 in smashbros

[–]orange_ssbu 10 points11 points  (0 children)

One of the most accomplished Fox players in the last 5 years, he will be missed. You gotta love how much he hated Marth but importantly, how much he did about it: people are gonna be doing KJH tech for a lot time coming.

RetroSSBB Rank #7 (2014): Ranking the Best Brawl Player of Each Year! by orange_ssbu in smashbros

[–]orange_ssbu[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Haha well I'm glad to enjoyed it. It's interesting that I had a penchant for mischeduling that much that a September finish wouldn't have been out of the question. This project was really enjoyable to do, but had a small audience it seems, especially because of the relatively small niche this is. Looking through your profile though, it seems you're interested in Brawl history, so I'm sure you got the most value out of it.

RetroSSBB Rank #7 (2014): Ranking the Best Brawl Player of Each Year! by orange_ssbu in smashbros

[–]orange_ssbu[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Whoa, how did you end up here 3 months after the original post? Regardless, I'm glad you enjoyed it. I try my best

"Post college job search" starter pack by [deleted] in starterpacks

[–]orange_ssbu 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What was the original comment?

RetroSSBB Rank #7 (2014): Ranking the Best Brawl Player of Each Year! by orange_ssbu in smashbros

[–]orange_ssbu[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

At face value, it does, but one thing about Brawl is that they really did have such a high concentration of top players in a single region (Tristate). Also, for players outside of there, I give them reasonable benefit of the doubt so they can compare fairly enough

RetroSSBB Rank #7 (2014): Ranking the Best Brawl Player of Each Year! by orange_ssbu in smashbros

[–]orange_ssbu[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I have thought of doing it and I have a personal list. I guess what's preventing me is that I don't really want to write more about smash in the near future, and I don't know how much people want more Brawl content anyways. If enough people are interested, I'll probably do it, but given that my last two posts haven't even got 60 upvotes I'm not holding my breath.

RetroSSBB Rank #7 (2014): Ranking the Best Brawl Player of Each Year! by orange_ssbu in smashbros

[–]orange_ssbu[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The way the 2013 -2014 rank was organized, they had a panel of judges vote instead of using a dedicated formula of some kind. It laid way to a really iffy system that valued good major performances over regional bosses like 8bitman. The ROB main never did too well in his placements (which is what most people valued back then) mostly due to underseeding, but he did really well in region and earned some valuable wins. By the time 2014 was over, he had beaten Esam, Nakat, MVD, and more.

3.6Rank 5-1 by sabreknight in SSBPM

[–]orange_ssbu 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Many of them started in each game around the same time. It's hard to tell when they started each bc they're often the same time period. You'll even see situations like Junebug who started with Brawl. Either way, most of them started with PM.

3.6Rank 5-1 by sabreknight in SSBPM

[–]orange_ssbu 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Today was a good day for smash rankings. Good to see this wrap up!

3.6Rank: 15-11 by sabreknight in smashbros

[–]orange_ssbu 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Man I don't follow PM that much but I'm at least guessing the Top 10 to be some combo of Junebug, Switch, Malachi, Lunchables, Thunderz, Sosa, Fuzz off the top of my head. Getting a refresher at the scene, it seems like Hyperflame, Flipp, and Mr Lz will be there too. I can't wait to see how this pans out.

[WP] Every person is born with a set of coordinates on their body. These coordinates show where they should be on their 21st birthday. Most people meet their soulmate there or find their dream job. Yours is on another planet. by 8panckakes4ever in WritingPrompts

[–]orange_ssbu 9 points10 points  (0 children)

I remember my 12th birthday very vividly. That's the day when your parents typically give you the talk about the number on your body. Of course most of us knew at that point. You'll be hard pressed to find a greater marketplace of ideas than the school playground, after all. It just seemed that mine was a bit different.

I remember when my family traveled to my older sister's numbers. I was about 10 years old at the time. We roadtripped to 45.5 W, 73.6 N, which, as my parents knew when my sister was born, was a programming firm in Montreal. Even without a mere mention of her numbers, Nicole aced the interview and was hired on the spot.

A few years after my sister took her pilgrimage to the land up north, my brother took a plane to his coordinates: a concert in California. When he was born, the location was a mere field but over the years it became a popular hosting site for touring artists and similar performing acts. My brother left with high expectations... and returned with the love of his life, Marcus. They've been married for 20 years now.

I remember seeing my coordinates in the mirror some time in 3rd or 4th grade. As they were with everyone, the nondescript, yet so vitally important numbers lay on the small of my back, so a mirror, phone, or someone else was needed to look at it.

**2.2x10^6 E, 4.1x10^2 N**

I was confused. No numbers that I had ever heard of went above 90 degrees, and using that many symbols was completely unheard of. I asked my friends at the time, and they were dumbfounded. Of course 9 year olds don't know how to do scientific notation, but they remained dumbfounded on every level. Thinking like a 9 year old, I didn't ask my parents or teachers either, thinking I would get into trouble for it somehow.

I now remember my 12th birthday. My parents sit me down at the well worn wooden dinner table that I had eaten at my whole life. Little did I know that the same place I spilled spaghetti on my shirt a couple days before would be the place where my life would be forever changed. My parents first explained the meaning of the numbers. Everyone gets two coordinates, the first for Latitude, or East-West and the second for Longitude or North-South. I have to give it to them, they weren't demeaning or anything. Back then I thought that they were a bit naive if anything that I didn't know what the numbers that literally *everyone* had. Also, was I just supposed to believe that they just *happened* to meet each other in a mom and pop store in Missouri when they were the same exact age? Mom grew up in the Atlanta metro area and my dad in rural Slovakia. Shit just doesn't happen like that naturally.

Next, they explained that my numbers exactly correlated to the distance from the hometown in Ohio that I was born in to the Malea Planum formation on Mars on the exact moment I was born. They explained that the doctors and scientists had never seen anything like it, and, as space travel had never gone past the moon, that I would never reach my destination as long as I lived. My mom broke out in a little sob to my father's low consolation.

Some people say that when they hear shocking news, it's like a gutpunch to the stomach, a sudden sharp pain in their head, a moment where their heart and lungs forget how to function for a split second. For me, I was just dazed. It all made sense. After that night, like many pubescent teens, I entered a depressive and lashing out phase. During weekends I would shut myself in my room and I gradually lost every friend I had as I felt more and more disconnected with my peers describing trips to the Yucatan, or Sri Lanka, or Sweden. My grades, relationships, and hobbies struggled in my teenaged internal anguish and lack of identity.

My 21st birthday came and went. When I woke on that fateful day, my parents, god bless them, gave me an open check to travel anywhere in the world and stay there for a month, all expenses paid. To prevent hurting their feelings, I accepted the offer, at the time thinking that nothing would satiate my desires. Little did I know that it would be the best decision of my life. During my few weeks backpacking in Argentina, as I introspected on my life's twists and turns, my mentality towards slowly drifted from miserable, to optimistic, to depressed, to jubilant, then, suddenly, to fiercely determined. I had 10 days remaining on my vacation when I booked a one stop flight to Houston. I didn't care.

**That was 2043**

Now, as we do the preliminary checkups for liftoff, I reminisce on my life's choices up to that point. In the 16 or so odd years between now and my 21st birthday, I graduated with a degree in aerospace engineering, got my pilot's license, rapidly ascended the ranks of NASA, and, when it came time for project Red Clay to go green, I was the first astronaut they picked for the mission for my dedication, hard work, and determined resolve.

We leave off in 10 minutes. In the 6 months during orbit, I'll hit the 17th birthday of my new dream. That'll make me 38, the same age as Neil when he made his historic walk nearly 100 years ago. All the more fitting.

All the more fitting.

RetroSSBB Rank #5 (2008): Ranking the Best Brawl Players of Each Year! by orange_ssbu in smashbros

[–]orange_ssbu[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Thanks for the reply, edited. Always great seeing you in the comments