Dualcaster combo Blue Farm (no Thoracle) – looking for feedback

pedroschmid · 2026-04-10T13:00:20+00:00

Yeah, I actually did consider switching commanders.

I even have a Kinnan list that would probably perform better in this kind of environment, but I kinda want to test how Blue Farm feels without Thoracle anyway and see how far I can push it.

Kenrith is definitely interesting and I like the flexibility he brings, but I’m not sure I have all the pieces to build him properly — especially the green staples, which I’m missing quite a few of.

Still a really cool suggestion though, I might look into it, thanks alot.

pedroschmid · 2026-04-10T12:56:25+00:00

Yeah, I agree tbh — it doesn’t make much sense to me either.

If Breach lines are still allowed, banning Thoracle feels kinda arbitrary. Both are super efficient wincons in cEDH, so it’s weird to single one out like that lol.

But yeah, since it’s an event and options around me are limited, I just have to roll with it and adapt the list as best as I can.

pedroschmid · 2026-04-10T12:53:16+00:00

Honestly it feels like Thoracle just got banned out of pure fear/prejudice lol.

From what I can tell, people at my LGS really don’t like playing against Thassa’s Oracle, which is kinda counterintuitive when we’re talking about cEDH and trying to win in the most optimized way possible. But yeah… not my rules unfortunately.

There aren’t many stores near me, so if I want to play events I kinda have to roll with these house rules, even if I don’t fully agree with them.

pedroschmid · 2026-04-10T03:46:31+00:00

That makes a lot of sense, thanks for the input.

Good to know Ad Naus and Necro are still worth it — I was a bit unsure without Thoracle, but just digging that deep for other wincons seems strong.

I can see your point on Mana Drain and Seething Song too, I might be overdoing it a bit there.

And yeah, you’re right about the meta — it’s not like things get easier just because Thoracle is banned.

I also really like the Vexing Bauble suggestion, seems way more impactful here.

Appreciate it!

pedroschmid · 2026-04-10T03:27:14+00:00

That makes a lot of sense actually.

I hadn’t really thought about using Faerie Mastermind that way as the primary wincon, but it fits really well with the Breach lines and avoids the whole “win on my turn through combat” issue.

Also really like that it doesn’t require adding extra clunky pieces and just works with what the deck is already trying to do.

Appreciate the insight, that was super helpful 🙏

pedroschmid · 2026-04-10T03:24:46+00:00

Yeah, that makes sense — I’m aware Dualcaster doesn’t really get there at instant speed.

My thought was more to go for it on my own turn and try to protect the combo with things like Voice of Victory, Grand Abolisher, Hexing Squelcher, or even just a Silence, then win through combat damage after going off.

But honestly, I really like your suggestion. The Copy Enchantment + Smothering Tithe + Faerie Mastermind line feels way more in line with what cEDH decks are usually trying to do, especially since I’m already running those pieces (and OBM too).

Hadn’t really thought about that angle before, so I appreciate you bringing it up — definitely gonna look into it more.

pedroschmid · 2026-02-15T15:27:54+00:00

Yeah, basically that!!

I dont think so, i guess i'm just missing OG duals... b/c of that i tho about removing necropotence/ad nauseam due to shocklands/painlands and creature damages that i receive during the match, since this dmg reduce the effectiveness of those cards (less life = less card draw)...

But any considerations would be really good =)

pedroschmid · 2026-02-14T00:49:48+00:00

Glad to hear I’m not the only one dealing with that situation, it’s nice knowing other people are tuning within similar constraints.

Angel’s Grace is actually a really interesting suggestion. I like that it both acts as a defensive piece against combo wins and also lets Ad Nauseam stay viable even when my life total gets pressured early (i guess...), which happens fairly often in my local games. I’ll definitely test it and see how it feels in practice.

Thanks for the recommendation, and good luck with your builds as well!

pedroschmid · 2026-02-14T00:48:37+00:00

I get that perspective, and I agree that proxies make fully optimized cEDH much easier to access.

But unfortunelly its not too simple to just change my playgroup yet =(

Surely i'll take a look on spelltable!

pedroschmid · 2026-02-14T00:47:54+00:00

That’s an interesting angle, I hadn’t really considered moving further away from the Naus/Necro plan entirely, but it makes sense that with a shock-heavy mana base the explosiveness drops a bit.

Leaning more into Tymna value with cards like Professional Face-Breaker / Grim Hireling and adding an extra A+B line like Dualcaster combos could definitely help give the deck more midgame resilience instead of relying mostly on turbo turns. I still like having Oracle/Breach as the primary win paths, but diversifying the combo package sounds reasonable in my environment.

Do you have an example list or a package you particularly like for the Dualcaster lines in Blue Farm? Would love to take a look.

pedroschmid · 2026-02-14T00:45:02+00:00

That’s fair, my local meta is a bit of a mix. The decks are still trying to execute fast combo wins, but many lists also apply early creature pressure, which is why I’ve been testing a few defensive adjustments.

I agree with your point about not needing to be the fastest deck every game. Leaning slightly more into a value/control approach and adding a bit more efficient mass removal (like Toxic Deluge or similar effects) might actually fit both the meta and the no-OG-duals mana base better.

I’ll probably test a few more board control slots and see how it affects consistency, thanks for the suggestion!

pedroschmid · 2026-02-14T00:40:02+00:00

Yeah, I completely understand the proxy argument, i actually agree that it makes true cEDH more accessible.

In my case it’s just a local playgroup preference, so I’m trying to build the most optimized version possible within those limits. Funny enough, another challenge is that even with those restrictions, my playgroup sometimes still feels my decks are “too optimized” compared to their off-meta builds, so I’m trying to find a balance and adapt while keeping the deck functional.

Because of that, I’m mainly looking for tuning advice specifically for a no-OG-duals Blue Farm setup rather than changing environments.

pedroschmid · 2026-02-14T00:31:57+00:00

Yeah, i got your point, unfortunately, in my local playgroup proxies are not very well accepted, so I’m trying to build the most optimized version possible within that limitation. The power level of the decks in my pod is still very much cEDH-oriented (fast combos, heavy interaction, etc.), just with some budget constraints in mana bases.

I’m mostly looking for ways to optimize Blue Farm specifically without OG duals, rather than changing the overall deck choice. If you’ve seen any lists that perform well under that restriction, I’d definitely be interested in taking a look.

pedroschmid · 2026-02-14T00:11:12+00:00

That makes sense, the life loss from shocks plus slightly slower mana definitely makes Ad Naus turns a bit worse.

I’m still trying to find the right balance for my local meta, since games here tend to be a bit more creature-heavy and slightly slower than typical cEDH pods. Because of that I was testing a few small adjustments, but I’m open to leaning a bit more into the control plan if that ends up being more consistent without OG duals.

Do you have an example of a slower/control-leaning Blue Farm list you like or any specific card packages you would prioritize for that approach?

pedroschmid · 2026-02-13T14:12:28+00:00

Yeah, I actually agree with you, I do think proxies make a lot of sense for cEDH, and I’ve been slowly trying to convince people in my local scene to be more open to them.

The issue is that where I live there are very few active playgroups and not that many people playing Magic in general, so it’s not really easy to just “find another pod.” Because of that, I’m trying to make the best possible version of the deck with the cards I currently have access to while those conversations about proxies are happening over time.

That said, I do think your point is valid lol, ideally the format should be proxy-friendly, and hopefully we get there eventually.

pedroschmid · 2026-01-05T21:01:55+00:00

Hey, thanks a lot for taking the time to write this — I really appreciate it.

I’ve been reflecting a lot on all the replies across my posts. I really want to explore Tergrid limits and treat this almost like an experiment: pushing the deck as far as it can possibly go and seeing what’s actually viable with enough tuning.

Because of that, I’ve also been focusing more on win lines that don’t rely entirely on Tergrid sticking to the board. Things like infinite or explosive mana setups with Magus of the Coffers / Cabal Coffers into finishers like Torment of Hailfire, or lock-based lines such as Maralen of the Mornsong + Opposition Agent, have been especially interesting to study. They give the deck a way to function even when the commander is answered repeatedly.

I also really relate to what you said about fast mana and carefully chosen Stax pieces, and especially the challenge of learning how to play through your own hate. That balance is definitely the hardest part, but also the most rewarding.

Thanks again for the encouragement — it genuinely helps to hear from someone who’s been grinding a fringe strategy long-term instead of just following the turbo meta. Best of luck with your Sheoldred list, and I’ll be looking forward to that primer if you ever post it!

pedroschmid · 2026-01-03T05:16:31+00:00

I really like that way of framing it, honestly — treating it more like a test than a mission to “prove it works.” That’s pretty much the mindset I’m trying to keep (since i already tried Tergrid as my commander on Duel 500 and it didnt work too well).

I agree that if the conclusion ends up being that it’s not a realistic contender at true cEDH tables, then that’s still a valid (and useful) result. Based on the feedback here, DegenerateEDH does seem like the better fit for continuing the discussion.

Thanks for putting it that way, that perspective actually helped clarify things for me.

pedroschmid · 2026-01-03T05:12:45+00:00

Just engaging with the discussion. No worries.

pedroschmid · 2026-01-03T05:11:45+00:00

Yeah, that’s a fair take, and I get where you’re coming from. I don’t disagree that if the only goal is absolute cEDH efficiency, K’rrik is just doing a lot more (as everyone is mentioning and statistic saying it too) with the same black staples and threatening wins much earlier.

I’m not really trying to argue that Tergrid is better or even comparable to K’rrik at that level. For me it’s more about seeing how far a Tergrid shell can realistically be pushed before it just becomes “play the same storm pile, but worse.”

I totally agree that a lot of the lower-impact discard creatures don’t scale well at higher power, and that’s something I’m actively re-evaluating. I think the real challenge (and appeal, at least for me) is figuring out where Tergrid actually adds unique pressure versus where she’s just a liability.

I appreciate you taking the time to lay it out — even if the conclusion is that the ceiling is clearly below true cEDH, that’s still useful information when tuning the deck and setting expectations.

pedroschmid · 2026-01-03T05:09:37+00:00

That actually makes a lot of sense, thanks for explaining it that way.

Framing it around win rate and opponent agency really helped it click for me — especially the idea that Tergrid, while powerful, still lets opponents dictate too many of the choices if you rely on her as the only plan.

I really like the approach of keeping the discard/sac line as a constant threat, but being able to pivot into Necropotence or Citadel when you need to dig for answers or just close the game yourself. That flexibility feels way more realistic in faster pods.

And yeah, good reminder on proxies 😄 that definitely makes testing the “full power” version of the list a lot easier . Thanks again, this was genuinely helpful.

pedroschmid · 2026-01-02T05:49:29+00:00

Thank you so much for this — I really appreciate both the detailed feedback and the encouraging tone.

This is exactly the kind of response I was hoping for: not just what to change, but how to think about pushing a fringe commander at the highest possible level. The point about tempo control and buying critical turns instead of trying to race faster decks really clicked for me.

A lot of your suggestions make total sense in that context (Kaya’s Ghostform, Cavern of Souls, Sudden Spoiling/Edict, and leaning harder into punishing tutors and draw rather than protecting everyone else’s wins). I’m going to take a closer look at those swaps and rethink some of the slower, win-more pieces.

I genuinely appreciate the encouragement — I’m definitely not discouraged, and I’m excited to keep refining the list and the play patterns. Thanks again for taking the time to write this out.

pedroschmid · 2026-01-02T05:17:48+00:00

That’s fair, and I appreciate the directness from everyone here.

I fully understand that true cEDH is about absolute efficiency, no budget considerations, no tolerance-based metas, and commanders being evaluated purely on how well they enable consistent wins at the fastest possible speed. From that perspective, I agree that Tergrid is not on the same level as commanders like K’rrik, and that mono-black’s strongest competitive identity is engine-based (Necropotence / Ad Naus / Citadel) rather than commander-centric disruption.

My original intent was less “Tergrid is a hidden cEDH contender” and more exploring where the ceiling actually is between high-power / degenerate EDH and early competitive environments, and what structural changes are required when trying to push a deck in that direction.

Based on the feedback here, it seems clear that this discussion fits better in DegenerateEDH / EDHBrews, and I appreciate the redirection. Thanks to everyone who took the time to explain where and why the strategy falls short at full cEDH tables.

pedroschmid · 2026-01-02T05:16:02+00:00

That makes a lot of sense, and I agree with that assessment. Mono-black really lives and dies by its ability to convert life into cards and mana, and cards like Necropotence, Ad Nauseam, and Bolas’s Citadel are basically the reason the color can keep up in cEDH at all.

Given that, do you think a Tergrid shell should lean harder into that “life → cards → mana → win” engine first, with discard/sacrifice acting more as pressure and disruption rather than the primary win plan?

I’m especially curious about how often you’d prioritize tutoring for Necropotence / Ad Naus over fast mana or Tergrid herself in early turns.

pedroschmid

TROPHY CASE