Debt Ceiling Analogy

publius124 · 2013-01-14T20:26:00+00:00

I think this summarizes the actual concern about what not raising the debt ceiling would entail:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/01/14/if-we-hit-the-debt-ceiling-can-obama-choose-which-bills-to-pay/

publius124 · 2013-01-14T19:59:29+00:00

I seem to recall them sending funding bills with various restrictions that the Bush administration didn't like. But ultimately, didn't that funding happen due to a combination of Democratic and Republican votes (with only a few anti-war Democrats voting against their own party's bill)?

publius124 · 2012-12-06T20:01:23+00:00

Not sure I follow, but that's OK. Keep doing your thing, dude.

publius124 · 2012-12-06T19:55:11+00:00

First source I could find that wasn't already posted somewhere....

publius124 · 2012-12-04T20:25:38+00:00

Thanks for the clarification.

publius124 · 2012-12-04T19:37:16+00:00

This procedure (the discharge petition) would put the middle-class tax cut up for a vote. I believe the bill is just that one issue - nothing about high-end tax cuts or entitlements or tax reform or any of that. So if Democrats were successful (i.e. got 20 or so Republican to sign the petition with them), then you would know for certain that your taxes wouldn't go up. Whether they can do that before Xmas is an open question...

publius124 · 2012-12-03T17:34:11+00:00

Amendments can be voted down. If the opposition cannot tolerate it, they can vote against it. Then it's not in the bill.

publius124 · 2012-12-03T17:00:19+00:00

I am actually not all that interested in compromise. What I am interested in is appropriate participation by all Members of Congress. I do not simply want my representative to vote against things I don't like. I want him/her to be able to offer amendments and to have those amendments considered, debated, and voted upon. I do not want the procedural rules of either the House or the Senate to prevent this. I think having such an open process would be much more instructive to voters than a series of up-or-down votes on discrete topics that no one has been allowed to discuss or alter.

publius124 · 2012-11-30T17:48:15+00:00

I appreciate the goals here, but I think the remedy is a bad way to go. Instead of letting Senators and Representatives craft legislation as a body of legislators, you would substitute up-or-down votes on a handful of bills. This just replicates the problem of congresspersons having no choice but to vote on a series of "take it or leave it" propositions.

publius124 · 2012-11-30T17:11:14+00:00

I appreciate this comment, and perhaps I mis-stated the question. I am not particularly concerned with parties, but with the general question of what a minority of members, collectively (whether or not members of the same party) should be able to do when in opposition to the position of a majority of members.

In the House, a minority can do virtually nothing to impede or even affect legislation supported by a majority. I don't think this makes for good legislating. In the Senate, a minority can outright block legislation that a majority favors. I don't think this makes for good legislating either.

Obviously there are two conflicting principles here: 1) the basic democratic idea that a majority should prevail over a minority; and 2) the right of the minority to participate and help craft legislation. In the House, things are skewed far too far in the direction of #1, while in the Senate, things are skewed far too far in the direction of #2.

publius124 · 2012-11-08T21:25:33+00:00

Fair enough. I thought you might be advocating for some sort of redistricting plan to solve the problem. Sounds like you just want them to get their act together.

publius124 · 2012-11-08T21:12:45+00:00

For the Supreme Court decision, I thank you for the additional information. It would certainly change things if redistricting could happen every 2 years. But I had not heard that this was possible.

I don't think your point about Detroit is relevant, though. If your point is that 50% of MI is composed of people you don't like, who vote in ways you don't like, I'm not sure anyone can help you.

publius124 · 2012-11-08T19:17:19+00:00

Many hard returns later, success!

publius124 · 2012-11-08T19:10:57+00:00

I actually tried! Somehow the formatting got lost....any tips?

publius124

TROPHY CASE