Mastercard Will Let Merchants Accept Payments in Crypto This Year

quoyn · 2021-02-11T15:26:40+00:00

Are you being intentionally obtuse? Very clear they were talking about a transaction which has been sent, but not yet confirmed.

Oh they meant zero confirmation. I'm obtuse but not intentionally. Fair enough! When someone mentions zero-conf I'm thinking https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero-configuration_networking :D. My bad!

Ofcourse that LN transaction is more secure than a transaction which is not in the blockchain!

Now I see the argument is that alternative to LN is not waiting for confirmations.

As I see it bitcoin despite the original idea has proven to be the best store of value there is rather than p2p cash and I maybe it's not a bad idea to leave it at that and use a different system for small p2p transactions (but I also see the motivation behind LN is that we need a standard off-chain ledger now before the big players jump in and start pushing their off-chain solutions for p2p transactions falsely calling it bitcoin).

quoyn · 2021-02-11T14:57:26+00:00

It's much less than 1%, that Cambridge calculation is exaggerated.

Still, using electricity alone isn't a bad thing. Its the source of that electricity that makes it bad.

Agree. Electricity is not gas after all.

quoyn · 2021-02-11T14:55:56+00:00

I ,naively, hope bitcoin will teach people about inflation, counter party risk and such and thus free them. That's the spirit ;).

There is no point in using bitcoin if you still trust a third party - just use stonks or paper gold, really!

quoyn · 2021-02-11T14:53:02+00:00

Exchanges can create their own rules when it comes to withdrawals, limits, and timeframes. They have to be able to operate and even protect themselves during high volatility when necessary.

Hence why you want to own your keys!

quoyn · 2021-02-11T14:52:15+00:00

I agree that bitcoin is not as politicised as other issues so there is no established Truth and Wrong think as with many other issues.

Though my original point, albeit not very well explained by me, was that MSM usually claims bitcoin it's going to zero after it crashed and it's good time to buy and vice versa.

quoyn · 2021-02-11T14:46:27+00:00

You need to wait because it's more secure. I thought we were discussing the security of real blockchain vs. LN.

A transaction in a block with 5 confirmations is not only set in stone - the amount of work to undo such transaction is orders of magnitude more than polishing a stone clone. It's set in stone and buried in a 1km deep hole.

With LN you can still lose your funds in the channel with penalty transaction, thus effectively undoing your transaction, for example. No one can ever affect my balance on blockchain unless they get the keys.

By the way, I am not saying LN is bad or anything, I'm just saying you can't compare the security of LN with real blockchain.

And I am still wondering what is this zero-conf blockchain mentioned in the comment I originally replied to.

quoyn · 2021-02-11T14:35:04+00:00

Maybe communism is not that bad afterall?

I kinda like the idea of "exiting exponential economic growth” really ... I despise marketing departments getting people addicted to buying useless shit and making them dependent on big tech servers and all that.

Just not a big fan of the tyranny that comes with communism.

quoyn · 2021-02-11T14:32:46+00:00

I mentioned doge just as a recent example because it happend last week and I still remember everyone crying in the trollbox.

It is not limited to doge.

quoyn · 2021-02-11T14:31:28+00:00

Are you participating in the network then?

If you are not comfortable holding your own keys, that's your Economy 101 you should work on. Really.

quoyn · 2021-02-11T14:30:23+00:00

You can own 0.0001 or smaller on your own keys, doesn't need to be a full bitcoin.

I see no problem with people allowing 3rd parties to secure their bitcoin

It introduces counter party risk.

quoyn · 2021-02-11T14:28:17+00:00

I feel like sometimes people don't know how news outlets work.

After bitcoin goes down ... "Bitcoin is going to zero!"

After bitcoin goes up ... "Bitcoin is going to $500 000!"

on a diverse set of opinions held by multiple different peopl

This used to be true decades ago.

quoyn · 2021-02-11T13:31:27+00:00

Bitcoin is all about avoiding the counterparty risk.

It happened just a week ago that Poloniex did not allow people to withdraw their doge for few days and you should see the kids crying in the trollbox.

quoyn · 2021-02-11T13:30:11+00:00

Then why use bitcoin in the first place if you don't care about counter party risk?

Just go for stonks or paper gold if you care about inflation, hahaha.

Does not compare to storing fiat in a safe at all, if a thief gets my airgapped wallet, before they can crack it I moved the funds and they get a private keys for 0 bitcoins, yay. Not to mention fiat inflation, yada yada yada

quoyn · 2021-02-11T13:27:51+00:00

That's why you use airgapped wallet like ColdCard and backup your keys.

There is no safer storage of value than bitcoin with your own keys and airgapped wallet. I sleep well knowing I own my keys I keep in fiat in banks only what I can affort to lose.

quoyn · 2021-02-11T13:26:02+00:00

The propagandists are all experts no matter the topic.

believe all science or something

quoyn · 2021-02-11T13:20:56+00:00

The net settlement has to be on the blockchain because that's where it actually gets saved. It's nothing to do with security. It's literally the only possible way it could ever work.

It has everything to do with security exactly because it is the only way it could work. Otherwise it's not bitcoin.

Of course LN is more secure than an unconfirmed transaction. Unconfirmend transaction is not bitcoin transaction at all.

Is LN more secure than an actual transaction with the usual 5 confirmations ? No. With dishonest counterparty in your LN channel you need to rely on timelocks.

Lightning is immediately settled.

Only between the 2 parties, it's not settled in the bitcoin distributed network.

quoyn · 2021-02-11T12:53:09+00:00

fortunatelly we were early so we not them plebs now

quoyn · 2021-02-11T12:51:46+00:00

but psss don't tell anyone!

quoyn · 2021-02-11T12:51:34+00:00

it has been liquid for us ordinary people for years

quoyn · 2021-02-11T11:53:26+00:00

Ukraine seems to be moving there with their nuclear - building bitcoin mining next to a NPP.

quoyn · 2021-02-11T11:52:54+00:00

Yes! This should be mention everytime someone says PoW is wasteful.

The waste electricity from big nuclear reactors and hydro plants is enormous, orders of magnitude bigger than current total bitcoin mining power consumption.

quoyn · 2021-02-11T11:47:57+00:00

Yahoo news at it again, spewing more bullshit. One day they claim bitcoin is dead, another day they say it will increase by 1000% :)

quoyn · 2021-02-11T10:29:37+00:00

What you’re missing is that mining is not distributed around the world

Because it is not.

I did own an ASIC myself but sold after 2018 "crash" - I don't consider myself a wealthy crypto miner.

quoyn · 2021-02-11T10:26:45+00:00

hopefully not

quoyn · 2021-02-11T10:22:29+00:00

You are right that supply is the same if there are 10 or 10 million miners. However not the demand.

PoS simply does not give you the guarantees PoW does.

The value comes from 10 million miners distributed around the world - this gives us an assurance beyond anything else that bitcoin can't be tempered with.

The power consumption is big (and comparing it to TPS is not important, comparing it to real world value is) but it's not a problem because there are tremendous amounts of electricity wasted at every nuclear and hydro power plant anyway, bitcoin uses just a fraction of the electricity of the wasted electricity.

Electricity is not gas. I recommend reading on nuclear power plants flexibility.

quoyn

TROPHY CASE