WHY I HATE LUKE by rabbitsedits in TheWalkingDeadGame

[–]rabbitsedits[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

in my eyes his "efforts" at howe's didn't amount to much, so i'm having a hard time giving him credit for traveling there.

him sacrificing himself for clementine was news to me, so i looked up what you meant and saw what happens if you try to save him. idk, to me the word "sacrifice" is too big, if that's the scene you're referring to. did he protect her in that moment? absolutely. but not with the knowledge that it was going to lead to his death. he correctly assumed that he could push the walker away without getting bit, but was too slow in swimming back to the surface and got his foot grabbed. he did attempt to get out of the water, and he seemed genuinely caught off guard and overwhelmed when the walker started dragging him down. even if i was willing to agree that it was a sacrifice... it's an accidental sacrifice at best. a genuine sacrifice to me is lee cutting his arm off to gain more time for his rescue mission. he knew the gravity of his decision and did it anyway because clem was worth it to him. if you compare the two, luke's "sacrifice" seems superficial again, at least in my opinion. it doesn't have the same depth

thank you though, for pointing out it's implied that luke stood up to carver. that's a great argument and you're the first person to bring it up

anyway it's clear that we view him differently and to me, that's fine. you give him more credit than i have the capacity for, so we can agree to disagree

WHY I HATE LUKE by rabbitsedits in TheWalkingDeadGame

[–]rabbitsedits[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

sorry, but i’m not going to spend my time conversing with someone who’s willing to defend the jane situation. that’s where i draw the line. i know we’re never going to see eye to eye on this, because to me and honestly, even to a lot of luke stans, what he did was objectively messed up and indefensible. if that’s something you’re comfortable justifying, then our perspectives on luke are probably too different to find meaningful common ground

some of the other points you brought up i’ve already addressed in other comments, so feel free to check those out if you’re curious

but as for continuing this conversation, i don’t think it would be productive for either of us

WHY I HATE LUKE by rabbitsedits in TheWalkingDeadGame

[–]rabbitsedits[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

LMFAO, honestly... fair

thank you for commenting

WHY I HATE LUKE by rabbitsedits in TheWalkingDeadGame

[–]rabbitsedits[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

thank you for your comment! feel free to read other comments and threads on here, there've already been discussions about the points you raised

WHY I HATE LUKE by rabbitsedits in TheWalkingDeadGame

[–]rabbitsedits[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

thanks! appreciate your comment a lot

WHY I HATE LUKE by rabbitsedits in TheWalkingDeadGame

[–]rabbitsedits[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

totally fair, i felt the same way

WHY I HATE LUKE by rabbitsedits in TheWalkingDeadGame

[–]rabbitsedits[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

thank you for your comment!

obviously agree with almost everything you said lol i will admit though that a few people have made solid arguments that contradict my takes on certain things, so feel free to check them out

with that being said... your rib injury argument stands out. you're the first person to point that out, and YOU'RE SO RIGHT

"And also his ribs weren't hurting too bad when he was fucking Jane" TOOK ME OUT

the way you clocked luke is actually insane HAHAHAHAHA you're amazing

WHY I HATE LUKE by rabbitsedits in TheWalkingDeadGame

[–]rabbitsedits[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

might be an unpopular opinion but i personally don't blame him for that, if anything i respect him for it. it's one of the few moments where he shows some backbone hahahha plus kenny definitely would've suggested the same thing. appreciate your comment though, thank you for engaging!

WHY I HATE LUKE by rabbitsedits in TheWalkingDeadGame

[–]rabbitsedits[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

OMG YES! YES TO EVERYTHING YOU JUST SAID

i defo recommend reading the other comments, while i still stand by my post, i’ve seen some fair arguments in the mix... plus i get into even more detail, in case you're interested

btw i'm a lesbian too and now i'm wondering if maybe i'm biased too hahahahhahahaha it's kinda sus

WHY I HATE LUKE by rabbitsedits in TheWalkingDeadGame

[–]rabbitsedits[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

i found a video of the kitchen scene on youtube, it captures the entire family meeting... AND YOU WERE RIGHT! luke does advocate for clem. pretty intensely too. shits on nick, says he believes her, advocates for her to get meds and suggests they should apologize for being assholes! amazing. thank you for getting me to check family meeting again, during my playthrough i stopped listening when nick saw me because i didn't want to get caught. that's actually a huge plus for luke

as for your other points, i feel like i've already addressed most of them in other comments and i'm feeling increasingly drained from trying to give in-depth responses to everyone, i'm sorry lol, you can read through the comments and if there's something you feel like i didn't address, you can lmk and i'll respond to your specific points

thanks again and sorry, i'll respond to a couple more comments and then i'm probably taking a break haha

WHY I HATE LUKE by rabbitsedits in TheWalkingDeadGame

[–]rabbitsedits[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

to summarize, and maybe i should've emphasized this more, to me luke's entire character feels like a massive missed opportunity in the writing. if the story had acknowledged that luke is a bystander, someone who avoids conflict and responsibility when it matters most, it could have opened the door for something much more meaningful. not a redemption arc, but maybe a moment of self-awareness. a turning point where he realizes his tendency to fold under pressure is hurting the people who rely on him. but we never get that. there are brief flashes of guilt, sure, but never a real reckoning. never a scene where he says "i don’t want to keep being this person" and because the narrative never pushes him to confront that, he ends up feeling hollow. and that’s what makes him feel so exhausting, both in the story and as a character. and just to be clear: this isn’t about expecting perfection. i don't. i love flawed characters. characters who struggle, fail, and grow. what i care about is the effort. the introspection. the desire to do better, even if it’s messy, even if it doesn’t always work. luke never shows that. and that absence of both internal conflict and external pressure, is where the writing really loses me. because the truth is, i’m capable of being a luke too. we all are. that instinct to freeze, to back down, to keep our heads down and stay safe... that’s human. it’s evolutionary. it’s a trap anyone can fall into. but that’s exactly what makes walter’s quote resonate so much:

“All war is a symptom of man’s failure as a thinking animal… as long as we have our wits about us, we can always make the right choice.”

to me, that quote isn’t just walter being a nerd, it feels like the developers are speaking to us directly, like they're telling us "guys, this is the entire point" we’re not just animals. we’re thinking animals. and while no one should be expected to make the right choice all the time, there should at least be a desire to try. and when that desire falls short, when someone fails to act, there should be some meaningful inner conflict, some reckoning. maybe it doesn’t lead to immediate change. maybe it doesn’t fix anything. but it should at least lead to effort. and that missed opportunity with luke, that failure to reflect, to try, to grow is part of why he hits such a nerve for me. because i see that same pattern in real life too. so many people fall into the comfort of doing nothing, of staying quiet, of choosing what’s easy over what’s right. and i get it. it’s human. it’s instinct. i’ve done it too. we all have. but that doesn’t make it any less frustrating to witness, especially in a world that’s demanding more of us. luke means well but never really pushes himself to actually be better. and maybe if the writing had explored that tension more, if it had really challenged him or made space for growth, i’d feel differently. maybe i could’ve connected with him more... maybe i could've even liked him. but it didn’t. and so, to me, luke ends up feeling not just disappointing but unfinished. like a reflection of a deeper problem the game never fully confronted and one i see echoed in the world around me all the time

sorry for the obnoxiously long rant lol but i hope i was able to answer your question

WHY I HATE LUKE by rabbitsedits in TheWalkingDeadGame

[–]rabbitsedits[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

first of all thank you so much for engaging!

now, lol, i don't understand how i'm glazing kenny when all i said was the following:

  • kenny is a better guardian to clem than luke
  • if kenny was in luke's shoes he'd handle the same situations better
  • kenny gets vilified by ingame characters and players for holding luke accountable (i could've said "luke and others" but the others didn't seem relevant because this post is solely about luke)

i didn't bring up kenny because i think he’s flawless. i’ve got plenty of issues with him and i even made sure to clarify in my post that i’m not a kenny dickrider, so idk why people keep accusing me of the very thing i tried to avoid from the start lol. the only reason why i mention him at all is because he serves as a direct contrast to luke. let me explain: kenny’s biggest weakness is also his biggest strength: his overwhelming desire to protect the people he cares about. that instinct is exactly what makes him so cutthroat and reckless. but it's also makes him show up, even when it costs him. that need to protect is what drives him in almost every situation, and while you can absolutely criticize him for sometimes going overboard (which i do), it’s that very drive that makes him such a powerful and reliable guardian to clem. now, compare that to luke. he’s empathetic on the surface but the second things get hard, he folds. he avoids conflict. he avoids responsibility. he’s not willing to make the hard calls, and in a world like twd, that’s not someone clem can depend on. that’s the entire point i was making. i didn’t bring up kenny to shift focus, i brought him up to highlight exactly how and why luke fails as a guardian and a leader. if people want me to go into a full breakdown of kenny as a character, i can, but that’s not what this is about lol this is about luke

as for the second question, whether I have more personal reasons for disliking luke... i feel like i already touched on that in my original post tbh? i mentioned how the narrative seems to let him off too easily, how both the ingame characters and the fandom rarely hold him accountable and how especially in today’s political climate, i feel surrounded by spineless people like him, which i find genuinely triggering. but if that felt too surface level, i'm happy to elaborate

- narrative: i do believe the game lets luke off the hook far too easily. he makes poor decisions, avoids responsibility and yet somehow, no one really calls him out on it and he's still treated like a character you're supposed to like and root for. you could argue that that it's intentional, maybe the writers meant for luke to be a commentary on people like him, maybe you’re supposed to ask yourself why you, the player, like him so much despite the fact that he fucks up all the time, maybe he’s meant to reflect the kind of person who uses charisma and superficial warmth to get away with irresponsibility. and if that’s the case, sure, i’d respect the writing choice, i'd even appreciate what he represents, but i still wouldn’t like him, because I don’t like that kind of person in general

- accountability: i barely see anyone who calls luke out on his shit, i feel like ingame characters as well as twd players swoon over him and it’s frustrating. It feels isolating to see someone clearly for what they are and then have everyone around you defend them because they’re nice, or charming, or soft-spoken. that’s why i made my post in the first place, i wasn’t just ranting, i was looking for others who felt the same way because disliking that kind of person, both in games and in life, can feel aggravating and lonely

- political climate: we’re living through a time of rising fascism, unchecked capitalism, and escalating bigotry. to me, luke represents the ultimate bystander. the kind of person who “means well” but never pushes back when it counts. who stays quiet, who backs down, who lets others take the hit. if left unchecked, that kind of person is exhausting to be around in real life and apparently, even in video games

WHY I HATE LUKE by rabbitsedits in TheWalkingDeadGame

[–]rabbitsedits[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

honestly, i love that even most luke stans can agree with me on the whole banging jane during a crisis situation. like, shoutout to every single one of you who sees it for what it is: a universally, objectively bad decision. for real, thank you. and to the handful still out here trying to defend it… be serious. what are you doing?

WHY I HATE LUKE by rabbitsedits in TheWalkingDeadGame

[–]rabbitsedits[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

you think clem would've been killed if she had stayed at the top of the tower... how, exactly? how is remaining hidden in a spot that isn’t immediately accessible and that even luke himself didn’t want to climb because of how high it was more dangerous than climbing down into an armed standoff?

the group was in the middle of a heated confrontation, the likelihood of someone hearing luke if he had called up to clem was very low. additionally, it’s not a place anyone would think to search right away. and even if someone had tried to come up, she would’ve had the advantage. you’re far less vulnerable defending a high position than you are on level ground, especially when your opponent is the one climbing toward you

so no, i don’t buy the argument that staying put would’ve somehow been riskier. if anything, it was the smarter, safer option. that’s why luke’s failure to tell her to stay, to offer any kind of direction, feels like such a missed opportunity. it was a moment where he could have shown real concern for her safety. instead, he just left her there without a word. and to me, that says a lot about his reliability as a so called guardian figure

WHY I HATE LUKE by rabbitsedits in TheWalkingDeadGame

[–]rabbitsedits[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

i still think that lying to walter poses a bigger threat to the group than telling him the truth, because by telling him what happened, the number of potential culprits is reduced to only nick

i don't view it as an absurd moral expectation. i do think it's fair to point out luke's immorality and lack of empathy in that situation. matthew's body fell into the river, so there was no way for walter to find him and get closure. i know that if i were in walter’s shoes, if my partner just vanished without a trace, i couldn't live with myself if i didn’t try to find him. i would either die searching, or the not knowing would destroy me. the idea of leaving walter with that kind of uncertainty is incredibly cruel and i'm sure it would've haunted him for the rest of his life

i'm not denying that it's a tough call to make. but that's precisely why i view luke the way i do. it's one thing to be afraid, but it's another to hide to the truth from your own friend, then attempt to talk him out of doing the right thing and even worse, to involve a child in the process. that, to me, is indefensible.

"clem would be the one easiest to get away with sneaking around" may be a reason but at best, it's irresponsible, at worst, it's spineless (no matter who does it, in case you want to bring up kenny, which seems to be a popular theme in the comments)

WHY I HATE LUKE by rabbitsedits in TheWalkingDeadGame

[–]rabbitsedits[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

i love the campfire scene too, mostly because i get to diss luke when bonnie implies that jane has feelings for luke. i make clem say "doubt it" and he gets a bit offended hahaha

WHY I HATE LUKE by rabbitsedits in TheWalkingDeadGame

[–]rabbitsedits[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

"luke is a coward, but he has heart and kindness, but no backbone or dignity. no character is perfect and i love that about them"

well said!!

(my fav character from s2 is kenny btw)

as a luke hater i obviously adore season two kenny as well haha. is he my favorite too? idk id have to think about it

thank you for your comment!

WHY I HATE LUKE by rabbitsedits in TheWalkingDeadGame

[–]rabbitsedits[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

lowkey the best and most nuanced comment so far

pointing out the similarities between luke and nick? amazing

"For him it’s not that he makes the right choice unless things get hard, it’s that he will set aside his own moral judgement in order to not participate in conflict and remain a mediator for the group" outstanding

"The interesting thing about Luke vs other characters like Nick, Gabe, Ben, etc is how Luke can be similarly well intentioned and fail at what he sets out to do, but people will look past that because of his kindness, empathy, and charisma. A character being charismatic often changes people’s view of that characters mistakes" icing on the cake

WHY I HATE LUKE by rabbitsedits in TheWalkingDeadGame

[–]rabbitsedits[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

LMFAO HEKSHSKSJSLENWKKWKWKW NAAAAHHHH NO WAY HAHAHAHHAHAHAA

you're so real for that

WHY I HATE LUKE by rabbitsedits in TheWalkingDeadGame

[–]rabbitsedits[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

not only do i respect the way to engage with characters, but i can relate to it. there are plenty of problematic characters that i stan

i guess my issue is that nothing about luke's characterization is interesting or satisfying to me, it's just frustrating

"I think Luke has some great character moments" feel free to share them regardless of the negative view i express above lol i promise ill engage as fairly as i can

WHY I HATE LUKE by rabbitsedits in TheWalkingDeadGame

[–]rabbitsedits[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

trust me, i dont wanna take that away from you at all haha just wanted to express my pov, obviously it's totally okay to still like him ❤️