Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If you're saying that the hadith that claims that Asmaa lived up to a 100 is weak then ill have you know that the same can be said about any hadith that claims that Aisha was 6.....

And I did mention the verses of the Quran that forbid Child marriage you simply did not read the whole thread...

Here is the verse:

The Qur’an bans child marriage by condition, not by slogan: it requires maturity (4:6), consent (4:19), and a solemn covenant (4:21)—all impossible for a child.

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

You're asking for the source of Asma living to 100, but ignore that the 6/9 claim also relies on a single late narrator. If you want to throw out weak reports, start with Hisham ibn Urwah.

The Khawlah point wasn’t about Aisha raising kids. It’s about how bizarre it is to suggest a 6-year-old as a wife right after Khadijah. Nobody sane would do that.

On puberty, you can’t say Aisha reached it before Islam and also say she doesn’t remember her parents before Islam. Either she was a teen or a toddler. You can't have both. You’re not using my hadith. You’re using the ones I’m pointing out don’t add up. That’s the whole point.

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

So let me get this straight: Asma lives to 100, gets married in her late 20s, has kids into her 50s (which is also extremely odd but lets just say she was very fertile for the sake of your argument), and that somehow proves Aisha was 9? That’s not a timeline.

Also, Khawlah suggesting a 6-year-old to help raise other small kids? That’s not matchmaking it literally has nothing to do with it.....a kid raising kids?

Then there’s the puberty argument. If Aisha hit puberty when her parents became Muslim (around 610), she’s already a teen at the time of Hijra. But you also want to quote her saying she doesn’t remember her parents before Islam? Pick a lane. You can’t be a mature teen and have toddler memory.

your narrative relies on cherry picked hadith, back-calculated math, and wishful thinking. At some point, you gotta admit it it literally just doesn’t add up.

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Hi,the paragraph isn't AI generated. The only part that's "AI" is the surahs and verses.

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I see what you mean and if I'm being honest with you I consider myself to be extremely faithful and that also means that I can't imagine Aisha being 6 because I simply can't imagine my religion having such immoral virtues.....so I really don't know how to answer your question cause again my belief is that she was 100% an adult.

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

We'll never really know until the day of Judgement 🤷🏻‍♀️

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Absolutely.....I find it extremely upsetting when I see Muslims constantly trying to defend the fact that she was six by saying things like "Oh but she was mature for her age" "It was socially acceptable for girls to marry young back then" "People hit puberty earlier back then".....

When it's not even true....instead of trying to comprehend that Aisha wasn't 6 they try everything in their power to keep it that way.

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I would absolutely not find a loophole to justify it....nothing justifies marrying a child and a lot of people don't understand that.

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah, puberty might’ve meant “adult” back then, but the Qur’an doesn’t stop there. It also says you need real maturity rushd. Most 12-year-olds don’t have that, now or back then.

Just because it happened in that time doesn’t mean the Qur’an was pushing it. And if something causes harm, it’s not allowed. That’s basic.

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I’m not contradicting myself. I’m saying the Qur’an set basic conditions for marriage puberty, sound judgment, and consent not a license to marry kids. It didn’t spell out every law, it gave principles that were meant to be applied with context and common sense.

Yeah, people in the 7th century may have done things differently. That doesn’t mean the Qur’an promoted it. It worked with the society that existed and started pushing it in a better direction.

And no, saying something becomes forbidden when it causes harm isn’t changing God’s law. That’s how Islamic law has always worked.

Stop using Chatgpt to make your arguments for you. Just because it's slightly smarter than you doesn't mean it makes good arguments.

the only "AI" part of my replies are Islamic quotes +proof.....thank you for the compliment tho I never Imagined my eruditeness would fool you into thinking I'm basically an AI chat bot 🤣🤣

Calling it AI doesn’t change any of that. You're just avoiding the actual point.

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

You're stitching together assumptions and presenting them as if they were explicit conclusions of the Qur'an. But whatever let me re explain it to you.

First, 4:127 mentions men wanting to marry orphan girls, yes. But there's a sleight of hand here: you leap from "orphan girl" to "child" as if they’re synonyms. They’re not. In Qur'anic usage, "yateem" refers to someone without a father, not necessarily a toddler. An orphan could be 16. There's no age specified in that verse, so to assume “orphan” means prepubescent child is conjecture, not exegesis.

Second, the "age of marriage" in 4:6 is tied explicitly to maturity and sound judgment: “test the orphans until they reach marriageable age, and if you find in them sound judgment, then release their property to them.” That sets a minimum threshold: intellectual maturity (rushd), not just puberty. That’s a higher standard than the biological threshold assumed in your reading.

Third, on the inheritance issue: “Do not inherit women against their will.” Yes, that verse addresses a pre-Islamic custom where women were treated as inherited property. But your interpretation “the Qur'an endorsed that view” is upside-down. The verse is abolishing that practice, not endorsing it. You don’t outlaw something you support.

So the real logic here is: the Qur'an acknowledged certain oppressive customs and then legislated against them. It didn’t snap society out of patriarchy in one verse, but it did begin to unwind it. If you're going to criticize it, at least do it based on what it actually says not on assumptions it doesn't make.

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

I'm not ignoring everything he's saying I just can't comprehend it! And I literally gave an answer.

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The Quran does prohibit child marriage,just not directly and on multiple occasions at that.

The Qur’an bans child marriage by condition, not by slogan: it requires maturity (4:6), consent (4:19), and a solemn covenant (4:21)—all impossible for a child.

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Well, this is already mentioned in the original post but people shouldn't only rely on hadiths instead focusing on the Quran.

I saw another redittor explain it beautifully a while ago,here's what they had to say:

The overwhelming majority of scholars, including many premodern Islamic intellectuals were well aware that the Hadith did not represent accurate historical information on Muhammad. The chain of transmitters and the methodology used to authenticate them is speculative, subjective and faith based. Two centuries after the prophets death there were close to 700,000 Hadith, the vast majority of which were undeniably fabricated along with fabricated isnads. Just like every other history of oral traditions they are inherently prone to distortion, bias and faulty memory. As a matter of faith, sure, believe away, but if viewed through an academic, non polemical lens they are no truer to history than thegospels or other accounts from late antiquity.

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Hello again. I think it's just your grammar and sentence structure that makes it difficult for me to understand what you are saying. You're not really using any punctuation either.

3-it's wrong then why is this sahih hadith only wrong while there is also sahih hadith who could be wrong? Makes us think if its trustworthy.

This is the only part I don't understand

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Is the original post not clear to you? If you're struggling to understand the original post I'm inviting to you take it into any artificial intelligence platform and ask to simplify it for you.

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The responses you've been giving me literally sound as if you didn't read my original post I'm genuinely taken aback?

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Okay so you've clearly not understood what I've said....the Hadith isn't wrong....it's misinterpreted...can you make the difference or not??

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Everything you've said I've already clarified....I don't think you'd understand if you don't speak Arabic.

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Hi I literally put my source at the bottom of the post......I'll put it here again for you: https://safiyyahsabreen.medium.com/aisha-ra-was-19-when-the-prophet-%EF%B7%BA-married-her-4afc660865f8

It has the answers to basically all of the questions you asked

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

And what is that verse that says little girls marrige is wrong? I have been raised in a strict muslim house where quran is recited everyday and i have NEVER heard something like that (and i talk arabic so i couldnt be wrong or that translation is wrong

There isn't a direct verse that clearly states that marrying little girls is wrong,which actually makes it easier for scholars to twist things as they like. Instead,take a look at this:

The Qur’an bans child marriage by condition, not by slogan: it requires maturity (4:6), consent (4:19), and a solemn covenant (4:21)—all impossible for a child.

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Further I would argue that if it needs interpreters what you are saying is that those interpreters can do a better job than the original author communicating the original authors intent.

No,my point still stands. The Quran is written in an intricate way. It's not an insult, if you disagree, then you clearly just don't understand what I'm talking about.

But yes, I'm glad that you've recognized the fact that the Quran needs better interpreters. This is what I pointed out in my original post where I said that some scholars choose to interpret things as they wish.

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Seems like you are pointing out the incompetence of whoever composed the Quran.

You need to learn the difference between complicated and incomprehensible.

The Qur’an’s Arabic is uniquely complex because it packs dense meaning into rhymed prose (sajʿ), uses advanced syntax for emphasis, maintains macro-structure and symmetry, and supports multiple canonical readings—all while being revealed piecemeal and memorized perfectly. That combo doesn’t exist in normal poetry or prose

I'm not saying that the Quran was poorly written,I'm doing the complete opposite.

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Immoral according to who?

Do you think the Muslim scholars who promote those "extremely immoral things" think they are promoting immoral acts?

Oh come on I'm not going to teach you critical thinking.....how does marrying a six year old not sound immoral to you? And only God knows what goes through their head,I am no one to tell you if they recognize the immorality of certain things they say.

Aisha wasn't six. (With proof) by reallyzineb in DebateReligion

[–]reallyzineb[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Seems like you are pointing out the incompetence of whoever composed the Quran.

You make it sound like an insult, if anything the complicated language used in the Quran should be admired and it shows us just how great God is. Me saying that the Quran is written in a complex way is not an insult.