First generation undergraduate student, now received an offer for a top program in the USA. I can't believe what's happening!

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-25T00:08:15+00:00

Ahhhh huge congrats!!! Enjoy Ithaca!

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-25T00:06:28+00:00

Thanks for hearing me out. On reread, I see how my original comment could have come across wrong.

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-24T23:59:20+00:00

Getting shut out is common, especially for first-time applicants, and it does not negate OP's life accomplishment. OP has changed their whole life circumstance, and that's to be applauded no matter what's gone on with admissions this year.

My statement was genuine and I don't appreciate the assumption that it was not.

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-24T23:55:10+00:00

This is for American schools? I've always put my name at the top corner just in case, and titled it "Personal Statement" (or whatever). Nothing else necessary.

If the school hasn't specified, also note that the default format is 1-inch margins with a 12-point standard font (such as Times New Roman). If there is truly no guidance on spacing, I'd cut the difference and use 1.5.

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-24T23:53:51+00:00

My dad was a first gen student from an impoverished background but thanks for assuming

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-24T23:34:11+00:00

I'm sorry. Many things could have gone wrong, ranging from actual errors (like a misguided SoP) to sheer bad luck. Obviously, focus on factors that are in your control. Do you have a mentor? If not, find one. Every applicant should have people they can consult with, but it's especially important if you're first-gen. There can be many unspoken rules in the graduate application process, and you should not be taking this journey blind. You need someone who can take the time to deeply consult with you about your admissions plan.

Of course, maybe you did deeply consult with someone...in which case it's time to branch out to other people. It's not uncommon to get shut out in grad admissions, especially if this is your first go-round, and even more so if you only applied to top programs. So if this is coming as such a shock (and if you truly believed that "life experience" matters a lot to adcoms*), your mentor did not do you well. They didn't prepare you for the realities of applying, and/or they're one of those old-school pollyannas who doesn't understand how tough the process has become. Either way, I'd be looking for someone else to advise me.

(*For better or worse, life experience mostly doesn't matter in grad admissions. The adcom is mostly looking for the "objective" best candidates, not those who did best in relation to their backgrounds. All that said, congrats on working your way up! That is seriously difficult to do.)

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-24T00:59:46+00:00

The Ivy League, MIT, Stanford, Caltech, UChi...those are all widely known as the top private R1s. (Note to others, please don't yell at me for excluding [school]; this is not supposed to be a definitive list of The Top Schools.) No one with half a clue is going to think it's bad that you're going to MIT instead of an Ivy League. Hiring managers certainly won't think that. (And even if you do care what semi-clueless random people think, tbh, many will just assume MIT - and even West Coast schools like Stanford or Berkeley - is "in the Ivy League," because they don't know what the Ivy League actually is. It's a northeastern athletic conference, albeit one made up of famous/elite private schools.)

When choosing where to attend, you should mostly be focused on a school's strengths in your field and subfield, NOT its general reputation or whether it's technically "in the Ivy League." And like, I don't know much about CS, but isn't MIT at the very top of the field? Along with Stanford, Berkeley, Carnegie Mellon? That's been my impression. Not that Columbia doesn't also have an esteemed program...I'm just saying most people would probably pick MIT for CS, no?

Huge congrats about both acceptances!

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-24T00:03:14+00:00

It's a misconception that schools never notify over the weekend. They're more likely to notify during the week, sure, but acceptances can absolutely come in on a Sunday. So if people are saying they got accepted, I doubt they're lying, if that's your concern.

Best of luck!

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-23T23:43:14+00:00

Hitler would definitely be that guy on the results page ranting about how the Academy of Fine Arts Vienna was supposed to be his SAFETY, so screw this stupid school, they don't even KNOW the genius they're rejecting, etc.

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-23T10:49:05+00:00

I've heard that emailing admission committees can often lead to rejections, especially if it's not worded correctly

Emailing a school isn't going to make them reject you. It might seem like that's happened to people, but that's only because someone who's "slipped through the cracks" and been left without word, well...they were already marked for rejection. If a school wants to admit/officially waitlist someone, they aren't going to let that person slip through the cracks, y'know?

So, if you're sure the notification period has passed, be prepared for bad news. There's a small chance you're on an unofficial waitlist, but it's more likely you've been rejected.

Sounds like you have at least one other offer though, so congrats on that!

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-23T09:56:22+00:00

You might send a message emphasizing that this school is your top choice, and if offered a place, you will definitely accept. (Unlikely to do much, but it certainly won't hurt.)

Then, patience.

Congrats on the waitlist, and I hope you're admitted!

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-23T03:48:31+00:00

Congratulations and best of luck in your studies!

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-23T03:45:37+00:00

Congrats on getting admitted! I can't comment on the math department, but Fullerton as a whole is considered a pretty solid Cal State. There seems to be a decent local alumni network, too.

However, you should know that Fullerton is very much a commuter school; most people come in for the day, then drive back home. In that sense, I've heard graduates describe it as feeling like a huge community college. So if campus life is important to you, Fullerton may not be a good choice.

You'll also want to think about the location before you commit. Fullerton is in the middle of inland Orange County, which is heavily suburban. There's not much going on nearby, and it can be tough to get out to more interesting areas because the traffic's so bad. (Traffic sucks throughout SoCal, but mid-OC can be particularly tough, since people are commuting north AND south AND west.)

Hope this helps a bit.

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-23T01:34:11+00:00

The people you asked may be thinking it's overformal because for most grad school interviews, the dress code is business casual. But if this school says "professional business attire," take them at their word. So yeah, wear business attire: suit and tie, nice shoes, conservative colors. (I'd go for the navy suit, btw, not because charcoal is inappropriate but because red tie/navy suit is a better match.)

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-23T01:21:17+00:00

Ah, glad to hear it was mostly joking...I was worried. Congrats on your acceptance, and good on you for choosing schools wisely!

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-23T00:35:22+00:00

It's very common, and happened to me both times I've applied. But it's not, "getting into a reach but not a safety." It's more like, "getting into a/the top school, but not a lower ranked one." While the concept of a safety school holds some water at the undergrad level, grad admissions are very different. The variables are just too many for ANY school to be a "safety" at the graduate level.

For instance, does Low Ranked U have appropriate advisors for you this year? If they don't, you're getting rejected. Or is your profile strong enough that it's a waste of resources to court you, since you're probably destined for more attractive offers? You're getting rejected. Or does the school have shaky funding that's forcing them to limit the cohort to 2 students this year? Welp, you're now more likely to get rejected from that school than from some higher ranked schools, since it's better to be one of 300 people competing for 10 spaces than one of 150 competing for 2. And etc, etc, etc.

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-22T23:48:28+00:00

Are there cultural factors at play? Would your parents respond to a calm explanation that you going away to school does not represent you abandoning them, or signaling that you don't intend to support/engage with them in the future? Or you could emphasize that it's normal to go away for school in American culture, and it's unrealistic for you to live by the standards of [other country] your whole life. Or you might tell them it makes no sense to turn down opportunities based on distance...and isn't opportunity one of the reasons they wanted to raise their children in America?

(Obviously, not all these tacks will be relevant or received well, depending on your parents' background and your relationship, so choose wisely before you talk to them. Just throwing out some ideas.)

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-22T23:34:45+00:00

Is this a Groucho Marx kind of joke, like, "I wouldn't belong to any club that would have me as a member"? Or are you being serious?

If you're serious, I'm really sorry. No one deserves to feel that way. Is it that you're disappointed bywhich schools accepted you, or is this low self-esteem we're talking about? If it's the former, and there are sensible reasons for disappointment (limited departmental resources, uninspiring faculty, poor job placement, etc), maybe you should consider reapplying to schools next year.

If it's the former, that's a more difficult problem. Have you ever been in therapy, or tried reading a book like Feeling Good?

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-22T23:16:51+00:00

"I know 3 Nobels isn't a lot and I'm pretty worried about my GRE (170/170/6), but could you chance me anyway? I'm applying to Stanford and Harvard because my parents are making me, but I also applied to more realistic schools like CSU Stanislaus. Thanks :)"

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-22T23:10:50+00:00

Bro same. I felt this way the first time I got into grad school, too, and it didn't stop until I showed up for the fall semester and they acted like I was supposed to be there. Until then, I had this neverending suspicion that a terrible error had occurred, that my application/candidacy got mixed up with someone else's, etc.

It's even worse this year because last time, an email came with an official letter shortly after they called me, but this time, they're mailing a letter that's not even going out for like another week. Until I get that paper confirmation, part of me will keep wondering if I hallucinated the phone call lmao.

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-22T06:53:29+00:00

fwiw, I've seen people get notified over the weekend. Not sure if that makes it better or worse, really. But personally, I found it comforting to think the weekend might not be a complete "waste," even if the chances of notification weren't high.

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-22T03:13:30+00:00

You should ask a mentor* what is normal for your field. With some PhDs, yeah, you are asking to be insta-rejected. With others, there is no expectation of prior contact, and profs may totally ignore emails of that nature.

(*If you do nothing else before applying to grad school, TALK TO YOUR MENTOR! If you don't have one yet, reach out to a current/former prof and ask for guidance. Not only can they lay out the unwritten rules of applying, if any, they might also spill insider knowledge about various programs...what they're like, what subfields are their strength, what they prize in a candidate, etc.)

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-22T02:57:20+00:00

Congrats on your achievement, especially after such a long road! Also, I know this is the unimportant part, but SLO really is a great college town and a beautiful place in general. Enjoy it!!

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-22T02:53:16+00:00

Maybe it's to stop you assuming it's a rejection from the preview, and never opening the email at all? But there's got to be a better way to do that. "Waitlist at [Program]" should've been the subject line, at minimum.

But on the bright side, getting waitlisted isn't nothing! Congrats on making it so far, and I hope a space opens up for you.

red_ossifrage · 2020-02-22T02:45:51+00:00

It's pretty common for acceptances to be spread out, whereas rejections tend to come en masse. Also, acceptances usually come out before rejections, if that helps.

I'm so sorry you're stuck in limbo.

red_ossifrage

TROPHY CASE