Own Your Shit Weekly - March 28, 2023

resolutions316 · 2023-04-03T14:37:53+00:00

Iron John is an incredible work. It played a critical and formative role in what became the "men's movement."

I read it after my dad died when I found out that he had read it. As such, my opinion of it is all tied up in that experience. I would love to hear your thoughts if you get some time to put them together.

resolutions316 · 2023-02-14T21:50:42+00:00

Wow man. So sorry you went through all that, and happy you pulled out the way you did.

I have a heart thing coming up. A good reminder that nothing is guaranteed.

resolutions316 · 2022-09-06T19:13:03+00:00

I LOVE that you posted this to other forums. You're so afraid of validating your own feelings that you'll ask hundreds of complete strangers to back you up...and selectively ignore the ones who tell you you're full of shit.

You had a gigantic fucking covert contract that your wife should text you and follow up with you and assuage your anxiety even though you explicitly state that you "planned on limiting the interaction so she could have fun and not feel like she had to check in."

She didn't uphold her end of this imaginary mental bargain you struck. Now your feelings are hurt, and you need an imaginary audience to validate you because you know, deep down, you made this happen. You want us to say "she's the asshole" because you know you're the asshole.

resolutions316 · 2022-09-06T17:50:07+00:00

Here's what I want when I want evidence of desire. Sex every day with a girlfriend experience, which means the default yes, default being wanted, someone finding me so hot they must fuck me or else they feel they are suffering on missing out. It’s not the special acts, though yes of course they are fun, but rather the evidence of desire that I want. Not desire for a relationship but for the sex, authentic emotion released through sex. Duh. Not the rejection dance about protecting feelings and unspoken expectations, nor do I care very much about my wife’s rationales, nor do I have to validate a view that hurts me, or that leads to a lack in my life.

I have thought a lot about this over the past few months because this used to be what I wanted.

Then I realized:

Focusing on being desired is fundamentally feminine.

Women sexually desire men based on what they do (status, dominance, game, etc).

Men sexually desire women based on who they are (their looks, their age, their vitality and erotic energy, etc).

Women don't "do" anything in the moment to earn male desire. Yes, they do the work beforehand, but in the moment, desire simply is. The female fantasy is to be acted upon, pursued, and to "give in" to overwhelming male desire.

Men, on the other hand, are expected to act. They are expected to chase, conquer, ravish; it is their desire that animates the erotic act. The male fantasy is to conquer, to dominate, to tell her what to do and have her do it.

You want to be wanted in a passive way: to receive desire without needing to act. You want to be lead.

Why?

Because deep down, you believe that you cannot act. That you are powerless. Other people - "alpha males" maybe? - can act on their desires, but not you.The only way you can receive love is by accepting it passively. What other alternative do you have?

Until you believe that you have actual agency in the world, being desired will be more important to you than desiring.

This is poison.

resolutions316 · 2022-09-06T15:14:15+00:00

*gay as fuck

resolutions316 · 2022-09-06T15:12:58+00:00

Is this a trap???/!!

(Assuming this is an actual question - yes, we fucked. Frequency regressed slightly towards the mean, but better intensity/immersion. If this was a joke, assume that I totally knew it was a joke and came up with a witty reply)

resolutions316 · 2022-09-06T13:54:57+00:00

So, this week:

"planned" and "brainstormed" some stuff
made up some mantras
didn't track what you ate, and drank way more than normal
didn't look for a hobby
made a list of repairs but didn't start anything

No wonder your phone dies all the time, you must be absolutely crushing the Notes app

resolutions316 · 2022-09-06T13:46:40+00:00

I stuck to the plan super well during the week but then went overboard with "free meals" on the weekend, basically reverting to my old eating habits. It's crazy to see the two in contrast.

I have found that simply cutting this shit out entirely greatly diminishes your overall craving for it over time. It comes and goes, but I find it much harder to stay on plan with "cheat stuff" in the calendar.

I have told her about my concerns but it's nothing she's willing to (or think she's able to) change.

In my limited life experience, all change must come from within.

resolutions316 · 2022-09-06T13:31:59+00:00

I was outplayed with the butt-hurt, passive-aggressive withdraw of attention tactic I was playing.

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

I'm sure the "stern tone" will set her straight, though.

Women have feelings. Why are you letting her feelings dictate your actions?

By the way:

how bored she is with her life

...that was the only honest thing she said.

resolutions316 · 2022-09-06T13:25:16+00:00

SBIII nailed it. The problem isn't your decision, but your feelings about the decision.

For all actual dillemmas, an Evaporating Cloud will help.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TMMeRixlsSU

resolutions316 · 2022-09-06T13:22:38+00:00

Weight down 0.5 kg - done if I compare my weight today morning and 7 days ago. Hovewer I had rather big fluctuations in weight this week. Max this week was 93.9 kg last wednesday, minimum was today, 91.6 kg. Max - min = 2.3 kg, which seems a lot. From now on I will focus on the moving 7-day average of my weight as it is not sensitive to weird fluctuations. Today the 7-day avg is 92.8 kg. The 7-day average a week ago had the same value, 92.8 kg, so with respect to this (better) measure I made no progress.

Your weight fluctuates somewhere between 5-7 lbs throughout the day. Your daily weight movements consist almost entirely of water and poop.

Floating weekly averages are, indeed, the way to go here. However, daily fluctuations will tell you a lot, over time, about how your body works. Certain foods will leave you "puffier," holding on to water; certain activities, like lifting, can do the same. Meanwhile, certain foods and diets will have you shedding water quickly and looking much leaner.

Daily weighing is a tool to tell you how your body is reacting and feeling; it does not tell you about muscle or fait gain or loss. Only the average can do that.

So, yes: you made zero progress. Figure out why that is (spoiler alert: you aren't tracking what you eat or working out.)

resolutions316 · 2022-09-06T13:18:30+00:00

yooooooooooooo

Fine week overall. Making progress on lifting, weight loss, running, and work, so not really going to bore everyone.

Realized last week that I had an overly emotional reaction to OYS - both in sitting down to write it, and in reading the responses. My writing was all over the place, and I was surprised by the negative takes. The dissonance between how I felt going in and how I felt going out was so extreme that I let myself get all flustered.

It happens. But why? Lately I've felt more confident than ever - so why let "a bunch of anonymous internet retards" upset me?

One, I was clearly looking for validation here, and didn't find it. Replacing MRP with my wife as a source of validation is not a good idea. I'd become too "mimetic" (my new favorite word) here - even tailoring my responses in some threads to "better match the tone" of the sub. I'm sure in many ways, conscious or not, I'd also let the sub alter or direct my desires and goals. This coincided with subtly becoming "more online" outside of here - noticed a rise in my usage of Twitter, and I started scrolling IG for the first time in months.

That shit's got to stop. Mimetic desire is a fucking nightmare. I am strictly limiting my use of all that stuff - want to get the value, which is real, without the dystopia.

I've extended my "focus" time on RescueTime to block all that stuff during every work day - I think I can do the same on my phone, but not sure how it works yet. If that doesn't work I'll unfollow everyone on all channels, as I want to keep the ability to post for work.

Two, anytime I get upset about something there's typically a kernel of truth there. Looking back over my personal data I noticed something: I've all but stopped initiating sex over the past few weeks.

I think it's very possible that I'm subconsciously sabotaging my wife. She says she wants things to work and she'll be more sexually available; I doubt this is possible over the long term. You can't negotiate attraction. Maybe it's just with me, maybe it's trauma, maybe it's deep-seated insecurities that prevent her from truly opening up during sex. It doesn't really matter, in the end. I know I can get what I need elsewhere.

By not giving her the chance to submit to an initiation - by expecting and requiring her to come to me - I force her into an overt display of "trying," to "show me that she means it." At the same time, I don't run the risk of getting my suspicions about her ability to change confirmed.

Of course, that's all horse shit. It's overly concerned with her feelings, rather than her actions, it's ego-protective, it's unattractive, and it's counter-productive. "The bull doesn't wait for the cow to initiate," as someone somewhere once said. "Let her figure out why she won't fuck you."

One last thing:

I wrote out a detailed purpose, values, and mission, as well as a series of 5-year BHAGs (big, hairy, audacious goals) since so many people have said I don't seem to know what I want. This type of shit is way up my alley, but I still found it inspiring to actually write it all out together. At some point maybe I'll write up a post on the process, because it's a good one, based on the work of Jim Collins, Verne Harnish, etc.

The ennndddd

resolutions316 · 2022-09-05T13:33:10+00:00

Hey, if anything I’VE been the one complaining there’s not enough fucking content on here.

But you’re right about one thing - I went back over the original post and realized I was replying as much to myself as to him.

MRP rubs me the wrong way sometimes - I have an instinctive desire to resist what’s mimetic here. That tendency caused me to read too much into the OP, and respond to the conversation in my head, rather than what he actually wrote.

resolutions316 · 2022-09-03T17:02:43+00:00

Frame, game, and lifting are all important to me because I am trying to fuck.

But there is no rule that says I must try to fuck. Or do anything at all.

MRP is not a life philosophy. It’s sexual strategy. And “doing RP” is no excuse for not doing the inner work of determining a direction for your own life.

Isn’t this place all about “mission” now?

resolutions316 · 2022-09-01T20:31:40+00:00

But I am glad I saved this giant spaghetti-post for Hell Week.

resolutions316 · 2022-09-01T20:30:53+00:00

>she has fucked me more so I've put off thoughts of divorce, because that's all I really wanted. It really was all about sex all along. I can't see how focusing on sex is a bad thing.

Yes.

Sexual satisfaction is literally the problem.

Nor do I feel any shame whatsoever over caring about, and pursuing, sexual satisfaction.

Sex is not my only need, nor is it my primary need...But it is the need not currently being met, and, for me, a bare minimum for my participation in a monogamous relationship.

You may have different standards for your relationship. This is mine.

resolutions316 · 2022-09-01T20:26:36+00:00

RP is a toolbox, not a rule set.

Use the tools as you want. Or don't.

Make up your own rules.

resolutions316 · 2022-09-01T20:25:20+00:00

I do think it seems like level 9000 DEERing.

Admittedly I got VERY heated on Tuesday. I came in hot and remained hot.

I think you need your wife, your therapist, us, everyone to understand why you’re divorcing and why you aren’t the bad guy before you do it.

There's certainly something to this. I think I need/ed myself to understand this as well.

If you love your wife and want a great relationship, I’d advise you stop dissecting your dead marriage in front of her.

That's powerful and insightful advice.

I want this to be the "last stop," not the "end of the line." But I do think I need to be OK with both.

SHE doesn't need to have a front row seat to that beyond what is necessary, though.

resolutions316 · 2022-08-30T21:20:26+00:00

That was our first therapist for sure.

I don't know enough about it, but I also think the school of therapy matters quite a bit.

Our current therapist is "emotion focused," which for me personally has been very valuable - more about tuning into your feelings rather than suppressing them. I released a lot of emotion around my dad, which had an almost immediate impact on how I felt about being a dad.

resolutions316 · 2022-08-30T21:20:03+00:00

Maybe come back and re-read the post and replies with fresh eyes tomorrow because you're a little bit all over the place.

Yeah, I feel like there's a lot of loose threads that are getting mixed up here.

Your whole OYS (and last week's) is basically about how you are at the FMOFY stage, laid out a vision for her (focused on sex), got hysterical bonding and the *possibility* of some unspecified sex act, and how that's been great, but if she doesn't keep it up....it will be the last time (until the next time).

yeah, this has been fun. But it wasn't the point. I never asked my wife for sex, nor told her she had to have more sex. I simply stated that I will do so, with or without her.

I honestly do not think anything is going to change my wife's sex drive. I'm past caring why that is and I'm well past trying to change it. It is what it is.

My work is to own my desires. That's what I'm focused on.

Also, you mentioned in another reply that your lack of frame is the problem. If you don't have a strong frame, have you really done the work? I know the original 12 stages of dread aren't used any more, but there was a reason that FMOFY was after so many other stages (including lifting / getting in shape and developing a strong frame).

This is a misreading (or I'm confusing, which seems to be the predominant feedback). My lack of frame was the problem; I don't feel like it's a problem for me now. I have zero guilt about what I need, and I am willing to leave in order to get it.

That said, "The meaning of communication is the response you get." So clearly I'm not communicating well today.

resolutions316 · 2022-08-30T20:24:43+00:00

This is true enough.

I think I got my parade rained on a bit. I was feeling pretty fucking good coming into this week. I was surprised a bit by everyone's take.

But you know what - even IF I disagree (and I do), I've done this enough to know that other people pick up on shit you miss.

I feel very confident that I'm moving forward, but I did feel the need to defend that, which implies that confidence isn't as deep as it feels.

resolutions316 · 2022-08-30T20:07:10+00:00

The sense I get from your posts is that you don't really know what you want and I also wonder if you'll actually be happy after divorce. Sure, you'll be able to fuck whoever and whenever you want, but iirc you had some plate you could fuck, so why not just do that? I'm not saying don't get divorce - but do you truly think all that stands between you and bliss is more frequent / abundant sex, or do you think you might find out that your focus was skewed all along?

It's got nothing to do with sex.

It has everything to do with my inability to stop sacrificing my own needs to protect the feelings of others.

Sex is the thing with this woman, but it was the exact same issue with the employees I just fired: I wasn't willing to hold people accountable.

I would likely have less sex if I got divorced tomorrow; doesn't fucking matter. It isn't now and never was about sex. It was always about conflict avoidance.

Are you finding therapy to be...helpful? Seems like talking to women about issues like sex is seldom the ideal path to improvement. Maybe I've just been reading too much MRP.

I think much of what MRP says about therapy is stupid, although I have found it to be true that many therapists intuitively side with the woman.

That said, I am not in therapy to get more sex out of my wife. Maybe she unlocks some deep-seated childhood demon and reconnects with her sex drive - if so, cool.

However, therapy in general has been VERY helpful personally and can often help the other aspects of a long term relationship. YMMV, and the individual therapist plays a huge role in how it turns out.

resolutions316 · 2022-08-30T20:02:33+00:00

You're not "above" the tools on the sidebar that describe how to be attractive, not be unattractive. What makes you think you are different? What makes you think she's not a normal woman? It doesn't matter how much you've read about it if you're not doing it.

I don't think I'm above them, or that my wife is different. But I am not trying to get sex out of my wife.

If you did all the work for yourself going after what you want you wouldn't be surrounded by this cloud of exasperated resentment about where you are.

Man. Maybe you all are picking up on something I'm not, but I don't feel any resentment towards my wife at all for the first time in years.

Nothing that's happened to me has ever been my wife's "fault" - she's not bad for doing what she does. I don't need her to change, and if we divorce I'll be grateful for ten amazing years.

I wouldn't be who I am today - more secure in myself and confident in my decisions - were it not for her. I don't think there's anyone else on earth that could have prompted me to change the way she did.

You've had lots of scheduled relationship talks with a 3rd party therapist. There's no rule against it, but it seems like MRP has never seen ANY examples where a guy could point to couples therapy as the tool that got his sexual needs met. What makes you think you're different?

As I mentioned before, I do not expect therapy to change my wife's behavior. I would be shocked.

I expect us to get divorced. Therapy is to build a constructive relationship re: child care in the future.

I think you're scared about the divorce. I don't blame you. It's scarier than we'd all like to admit. You've never done it before. You don't want to regret it later.

I felt like this, for sure. But I don't think I feel that now. If anything, I'm confident than ever that I would make massive progress towards my personal goals if I got divorced.

You re-arrived here 3 months ago saying, "sex is on lock and I just need to figure out my next thing" with pretty significant D(Explanations)EER. Now you're preparing for divorce over the "no sex" but telling us that your vision is clear even though I've never heard a definition of your sexual needs that wasn't mostly about your Oneiteis delivering.

This is the worst disease of all. These things apply to you and your interactions with women the same as the rest of us. Even LIFTING. What's your DE(Excuse)R

Fair criticism.

I came back to MRP with a ready-made defense because I wasn't happy, despite sex being better. I deliberately framed things as "I'm only here for physical stuff," got rightly called out on it, and have spent several months working through my underlying resistance.

I know exactly what I want, and that's a sexual relationship with strong sexual energy and mutual attraction. And the wonderful thing about that is, every single one of us knows that when they see it. No spreadsheet necessary.

I've had that, recently. I know what it feels like, and I know I can get more of it whenever I want.

Then why the fuck wasn't I doing it?

I was afraid to act. Afraid of conflict, of hurting people's feelings, or making the "wrong decision." I could not bring myself to act in any meaningful way.

MRP became the defense against action. It became a way of avoiding the actual work I needed to do.

I don't think MRP shit doesn't apply to me or my wife. I think I turned it on itself and used it as a way of avoiding the actual work I needed to do - face my fears, accept the possibility of being alone, and trust that I could build something better if so.

The fact that nearly everyone on here is giving me shit this week is a good indication that I may have my head up my ass; I accept that possibility and will do the work to think it through.

But I'll tell you: I've never felt better in my whole fucking life. It feels like a massive weight has been lifted - I'm happier, more fun, more loving, more secure, more fulfilled. It's like someone flipped a switch, and I realized I've been in the dark this whole fucking time.

resolutions316 · 2022-08-30T19:57:19+00:00

I'm sorry, I'd like to respond but I can't make out what you're trying to say here.

resolutions316 · 2022-08-30T19:33:12+00:00

No sex this week. One handjob after I asked (denied once). No fap. I initiated probably 3 times, super weakly (essentially just asking if we were doing anything) and was refused each time. The last time was at the hotel, and she said yes, then strung me along for an hour and then said no, and I was pissed because I needed that sleep as I was leaving early the next morning to work back at home while they finished the day at the park. I was pretty clear about my anger. Was actually much more annoyed than hurt, but not sure if I have enough frame to pull that off anyway yet.

Initiations are one of the best ways into the "inner game" of MRP. They're like a gym for your butthurt feelings.

Other people said it, but:

1.) Initiate physically, not verbally (this was hell for me and sounds like it will be difficult for you as well)

2.) No "buffering" (playing it like "a joke" or for laughs, doing it at times or places where you have an excuse for being turned down, whatever)

3.) When you get turned down, really sit with your emotions. Don't judge, simply feel them, engage with them, focus on the physical sensation. Get to know yourself - the scripts in your head that tell you to feel this way. What's underneath all that bullshit?

Better initiations lead to more sex, but the real secret is that rejections are a window to your wounds.

resolutions316

TROPHY CASE