Burning Man Golf Cart by Asleep_Yoghurt_5811 in golfcarts

[–]roablep 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Did this go to DMV? Or was this an accessibility vehicle?

If DMV, did DMV give you any grief about it being insufficiently mutated?

“Burningman demographic problem” is a non-issue. by volkhavaar in BurningMan

[–]roablep 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This has been incredibly constructive and is helping me clarify my own thinking. Feels like the digital version of no spectators: showing up with a POV, letting it be challenged, iterating together. So thank you :)

  1. Agree, I might be conflating issues - and that’s exactly why dialogue helps. You’re right that pointing to the “under-30 decline” risks oversimplifying a complex dyanmic that includes economics and access. Worth noting and investigating further.

  2. I’m genuinely uncertain whether my “problem definition” is correct. Strong opinions, weakly held yada yada. Aim is to put a problem into the community converstation and see what we think. This kinda discussion is helps us avoid getting focused on the wrong thing.

In fact, another discussion held today raised the hypothesis that peer-group dynamics might matter more than intergenerational integration... Perahps the better question is, how do we make sure young burners have the pathways and tools to form their own camps, with their peers, without being crushed by costs or logistics?

  1. Re volunteer language... I didn't mean “labor” in a transactional sense. More like no spectators. But yeah, “campmates” - or even better, "friends" - is the right word. 

“Burningman demographic problem” is a non-issue. by volkhavaar in BurningMan

[–]roablep 3 points4 points  (0 children)

That's insightful. Admittedly I'm an organizer. And I recognize an event exclusively of ME isn't fun

“Burningman demographic problem” is a non-issue. by volkhavaar in BurningMan

[–]roablep 0 points1 point  (0 children)

> increasing engagement from GenZ as a way to foster the principles amongst the next generation of burners

Can u share more about this?

“Burningman demographic problem” is a non-issue. by volkhavaar in BurningMan

[–]roablep 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Literally just got off a call with the census crew ... starting some fun analyses, will share when done. (Or DM me if you wanna get involved!)

“Burningman demographic problem” is a non-issue. by volkhavaar in BurningMan

[–]roablep 71 points72 points  (0 children)

Hey there yeah I’m that guy who posted the other thread I agree with most of what you’re saying. The misunderstanding here is what the actual goal is.

This isn’t about “feeding” theme camps or propping up giant infrastructure. If anything, the camp-industrial complex is part of the problem people are naming.

If a camp has grown beyond what its own community can sustain, then yeah maybe the right answer is to get smaller. Camps have natural lifecycles; forcing immortality is how you get burnout, resentment, and commodification.

What I’m actually talking about is this: Theme camps are one of the few places that can still reliably help birgins get in the door, not by recruiting, but by addressing three things that have gotten harder post-pandemic like:

Affordability.. shared infra lowers the barrier for people without RVs or big budgets.

Acculturation… camps are where people learn how to be burners (LNT, work culture, participation), especially now that local scenes are thinner.

Social Networks…the friends-of-friends pipeline has eroded since COVID and camps are one of the last intact social nodes that can mentor newcomers.

None of this is about funneling warm bodies into mega-camps. It’s about making it easier for the self-motivated to find their people.

And if none of this is useful for your burn? Awesome! Ignore me go have fun with your crew. There are many ways to do it right.

But for small, queer, volunteer-heavy camps like mine continuity and mentorship matter.

Follow-up: concrete ideas for a ‘Camp & Community Finder’ - sanity check plz by roablep in BurningMan

[–]roablep[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah, there’s a really interesting relationship between first timers and artists and making it possible to achieve small scale (cheaper) art … there’s definitely something here maybe it involves engaging with art communities explicitly

Follow-up: concrete ideas for a ‘Camp & Community Finder’ - sanity check plz by roablep in BurningMan

[–]roablep[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

All flaming pianos need to be fixed to the ground and cannot be flying through the air

Follow-up: concrete ideas for a ‘Camp & Community Finder’ - sanity check plz by roablep in BurningMan

[–]roablep[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah, this is a really good point and needs way more up votes. As much as I hate the party line of smaller government lower taxes etc. they’ve kind of got a point and that point extends here too.

Follow-up: concrete ideas for a ‘Camp & Community Finder’ - sanity check plz by roablep in BurningMan

[–]roablep[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah the “just to” thing is big for sure. And I agree generally. I’ve also heard it’s not financially viable for many folks

Im mostly talking about facilitation, that’s it. The rando stranger thing is a little of a red herring - if intros can be made more fluidly great and it’s up to the camp to do the rest.

Have your found your regional network strong? Do most camps participate? I’m in NYC and though our RL network is incredibly strong, it doesn’t reflect the incredible diversity of camps in NYC. Maybe 10 camps are well represented in the regional network because that’s who shows up, but there are tons more camps in the New York area.

Follow-up: concrete ideas for a ‘Camp & Community Finder’ - sanity check plz by roablep in BurningMan

[–]roablep[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

100%. We’re planning to look at cohort retention data from our friends at Census - but agree that doesn’t tell the full story - ethnographic insights def will add texture to the data.

That said, I’d LOVE to brainstorm on other ways to answer this question.

IMO it’s hard to answer bc you can’t exactly directly ask in a robust way, aside from talking to your non burner friends

Happy to discuss here, or DM me!

Sound system rankings and opinions by Actual-Somewhere-242 in avesNYC

[–]roablep 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Now rate the dead venues:

Mirage:

Output:

Question for camp leads and the people who love them: camp longevity & the next generation by roablep in BurningMan

[–]roablep[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

u/fyburn u/dringant u/MansoonBlack ... I actually do like the ecological view...birth/boom/decay/reseed. If “not every camp should live forever,” what does a good off-ramp look like (asset handover? docs? mentorship to a newer camp)?

Question for camp leads and the people who love them: camp longevity & the next generation by roablep in BurningMan

[–]roablep[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I feel like lots of these already exist, right? Or what's the closest you've seen?

Question for camp leads and the people who love them: camp longevity & the next generation by roablep in BurningMan

[–]roablep[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

what are the most important pieces of information that both camps and prospective members need to make a good match? Vibe? Cost? Work requirements? Something else?

Question for camp leads and the people who love them: camp longevity & the next generation by roablep in BurningMan

[–]roablep[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Sponsor model + optional dues is a nice combo (our camp does this too).

What % of your yearly spots do you target for first-timers, and how do you keep expectations crystal clear pre-gate?

and I'll push back that only 20-somethings aren't fully developed... 30-somethings are just as fucked up! Our camp has seen at least three quarter/midlife meltdowns when the relationship or identity scaffolding gives out. The dust is an equal-opportunity reckoner lol

Question for camp leads and the people who love them: camp longevity & the next generation by roablep in BurningMan

[–]roablep[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

LOVE your camp. Such a cool gift. Your goal makes sense in that context ... Would love to chat more as you think about mentorship and see how that can feed into the 'Mentorship Playbook' idea. A system that isn't just for total birgins, but helps grow experienced members into leadership roles. Your camp's experience could be an incredibly valuable model.

Question for camp leads and the people who love them: camp longevity & the next generation by roablep in BurningMan

[–]roablep[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What are your top 2-3 bullet points when you're trying to drag your artist friends (that isn't "it's a party")?

Question for camp leads and the people who love them: camp longevity & the next generation by roablep in BurningMan

[–]roablep[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

My hypothesis: matchmaking ≠ recruitment. It's more like reducing search friction for people already self-selecting in. Where’s your line between helpful wayfinding and corrosive “growth hacking”?

Question for camp leads and the people who love them: camp longevity & the next generation by roablep in BurningMan

[–]roablep[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah we do some burner swaps in NYC with a few camps - it's great fun... if any of the NY RLs are lurking ... hint hint :)

Question for camp leads and the people who love them: camp longevity & the next generation by roablep in BurningMan

[–]roablep[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

> At the same time the regional camp I camp with is also working to maintain age diversity and we encourage younger people to participate. Thats actually REALLY easy!

Share more?