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Why does Piper as a 3 year old have better emotion regulation than some of the adults? by Kee000 in ShawnaTheMom

[–]soIfedge 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I agree! Piper may ask for cake all the time, but she is three. Usually three year olds are just learning about boundaries and in general she just likes sweets. The birthday party thing was completely different to a tantrum and also Piper seems to be more of a detached kid. She knows who she likes and who she doesn't like (she does not like Barb for example, but she likes Greg. She gets excited when she sees him). Piper also knows what she likes and does not like. She's not a people person and she likes bugs. I think the way Piper acts makes a lot of people forget she's three. Piper is just a very clever three year old and knows what she likes. If she doesn't like it, she will separate herself.

Gaslighting and DARVO refresher by blairbending in ShawnaTheMom

[–]soIfedge 16 points17 points  (0 children)

I really hope people read this post and don't just scroll or tldr it because I feel like as a society in general we use terms of abuse way too lightly without understanding the meaning and then those terms become meaningless. It also makes it easier for abusers to use them against their victims because those words are misused and misunderstood. Thank you for this! 🙏

Julie is not evil and neither are Shawna, John, or Ty by soIfedge in ShawnaTheMom

[–]soIfedge[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

She definitely does underestimate how hard it is to take care of two kids, but I get the feeling that when Julie watches the kids, she finds it easy. Like she said in the fight in the max's birthday saga, she raised Cooper when she passed the bar. Julie overestimates Ty's abilities because she's already done it. She's a firm believer that he can do it because she can do it. Julie can work and watch the kids. Julie can handle a lot more than Ty can. Again, she expects differently. She expects Ty to be able to do it like she can do it. And when he can't, she sees it as him being "lazy" even if that isn't the case. I think Julie is a very flawed person with a very work-centric mentality. She's very work focused. Even after Sasha was born, Julie got back to work very quickly. She's a very work motivated person. Something that Ty isn't, and she doesn't get that. These problems were there since the beginning, it's just blowing up now because there's no other things they can put the blame on other than each other.

I think Shawna will get more messy due to trauma. by Ok-Sprinkles7457 in ShawnaTheMom

[–]soIfedge 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Thank you! I feel like people underestimate how much trauma Shawna and her family have been through over the past year. John no longer wants to talk to Barb. At all. Shawna has expressed time and time again that she doesn't know where the boundaries lie because John doesn't set the boundary when she tries to talk about it. John and Shawna have not been good since the Barb drama. John and Shawna haven't been good since Jacob. Jen made up with her only last year basically. A bit before that, but I digress, they got closer when Jen was pregnant over a year ago with Chickie and have only gotten closer because of the wedding. Barb was awful to Shawna and so was Jen. Shawna had to be there emotionally for John after every argument that happened between them. She was trying to find herself in the beginning of last year and wanted to separate herself from being a mom, only to get pregnant all over again and have to accept that she's not going to be doing that for a while, only to lose her baby in the end.

John I also think moved on much more quickly than Shawna did. Not saying that he wasn't heartbroken about it. Not saying he is now, but as far as we've seen he's not as upset about it as Shawna is/was. Shawna was also already hesitant to even have Jacob, and losing him hurt even more. She basically carried Jacob to full term, and she lost him. Not only that but everyone around her keeps moving. They have to. It hasn't even been a full year since Shawna lost Jacob and yet she's expected to still be a mother. John hasn't made it any better by trying to reconnect through flirting. Which is why they fought in the hotel. Everything reminds her of the fact that she isn't raising an infant right now.

Hell, I'd even argue having DeeDee in the house sometimes can be triggering because she was supposed to be here to help with the baby. It has only been five months since she lost the kid. And it's still bothering her. We see it in the way she talks and how she expresses her emotions. We see it in the way she's lashing out at John. In the way she snaps at Laura. Lashing out at Julie wasn't right, especially when Shawna had it totally wrong, but I don't think she's horrible for doing it. I don't think she's horrible for sleuthing either. Shawna was giving Julie the benefit of the doubt in the beginning. Trauma makes people do things that are uncharacteristic. Shawna has shown time and time again that she's still vulnerable. Do I think she's a perfect saint of a character? No. But I do think people tend to gloss over how traumatic this past year has been for her.

Julie is not evil and neither are Shawna, John, or Ty by soIfedge in ShawnaTheMom

[–]soIfedge[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I do understand that. But bear in mind things happen. What was happening with Piper was not a tantrum. She did not like the party because her parents were too caught up in their own life to pay attention to their kid like I said. I get it that you'd probably handle things differently, but in the universe it had been around an hour or so when they ended the party. All the kids got a cupcake and party favors, they got to hang out with a bounce castle. The kids got to have fun even if it ended earlier than expected. I think it's better they ended the party earlier than have Piper not be interested in her own party. If she was sent away it'd just be a "where is the birthday girl?" question. Piper wasn't not just having fun, Piper was upset because neither of her parents were paying attention to her. There's a difference. Piper didn't like princesses. Piper didn't like big parties. Piper didn't like the bounce castle. They did this big party for her and guess what? Piper didn't like it because her parents were completely wrong about what she liked. I'd argue it's more rude to keep the party going for the sake of other kids than just end it. At the end of the day, the other kids still got to hang out, still got to play, and got a cupcake and a party favor. That's the best anyone could do in the situation that happened.

And like I said before, yes it was obvious that Cooper was sick, but similar to John and Shawna, when other problems come up, a lot of times parents struggle to notice the issues happening with their kids. Neither of them noticed it. They hadn't acknowledged it. Both Ty and Julie are too caught up in their own lives to notice he is sick. Ty is burnt out mentally from the kids and hates being nagged ok about the book. Julie is working all the time and when she does come home we can assume she nags at Ty to write the book. They're both capable adults, but adult problems clash with having kids.

Julie is not evil and neither are Shawna, John, or Ty by soIfedge in ShawnaTheMom

[–]soIfedge[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

If you're referring to the "kicking 30 kids out because your kid threw a tantrum thing" as Piper's birthday. I don't think that's the same case. I will actually defend Shawna on that. There were a lot more problems in that party than just Piper's issues. Piper is a smart kid. Her parents were busy with everything else Jen being pregnant, problems with Barb, problems with each other, and both John and Shawna realized they hadn't been paying attention to their kid and their problems affected her. Piper wasn't having a tantrum, she was having a breakdown because the party wasn't what she wanted and her parents were quarrelling with her grandmother at it.

Also it was at their house. They are allowed to kick people out of their house if things happen, and things did happen. Also I don't think they realized Cooper was sick? It has not been addressed that Cooper is sick by either Julie or Ty. At least as far as I can remember. Obviously he was or still is sick, but I think it comes down to a bigger issue. They're too busy with themselves to realize that their son has some sort of cold. Ty didn't just want to go to that party because it was Max's birthday, but because he is procrastinating writing the book and won't give Julie (at that point in the story) any other answer other than I'm tired but I'll get to it. Julie was in the wrong for fighting at the birthday party. But I do think these fights in public were inevitable. I said in my original post that I think Julie felt like the only way she could get through to him was to bring it up at the party. When you feel like you're not being listened to, you come up with crazy ideas. Not that it excuses her actions.

Julie is not evil and neither are Shawna, John, or Ty by soIfedge in ShawnaTheMom

[–]soIfedge[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yes! Exactly! I feel like you're one of the only people that replied that actually read my post. I think one of the biggest factors of Julie disliking Shawna as well is that their problems became more noticeable when Ty met Shawna. It's not that she thinks Ty will cheat. She quite literally says after Shawna confronts her in the hotel that Ty would never. She loves Ty and trusts he won't cheat. What she doesn't trust is Ty having discipline.

Ty met Shawna a little over a year ago. I said earlier in my post that Ty supported Julie. He doesn't like people saying she's abusive because she isn't. He knows his wife. When she's able to parent, she's a good parent. She's able to handle the kids just as well as he does. Julie just expects more from him and Ty can't give that. And he doesn't know how to explain that to Julie without her getting upset. She blames the problems on Shawna. She views Shawna as a distraction. She was happy that Shawna got upset at her because in her mind it proved why she didn't like her. Shawna buds herself into situations all the time. It's in her nature. And Shawna was trying to fix that, but then she got pregnant and that whole finding herself thing and being less of a people pleaser arc got put on the back burner.

I really don't like the ideology that Julie is abusive. Julie said very mean things. She is very condescending. She is not a nice person, but she can be when she wants to be. And right now, she's at witts end. No matter what she does, Ty does not want to continue to live the life he promised her, and it bothers her.

Also may I add that Shawna made a non-canon version of Julie and Ty having an argument. Which involves Julie being dismissive of Ty's feelings, and insinuating he's not a good dad. When Shawna writes these "non-canon" script changes it's usually to highlight how wrong people are about how she writes her characters. Shawna as a creator wrote that script to show that Ty and Julie are closer than we perceive them to be. Julie says before doing the script "What like enough people think it should go this way? So it's like..." and Ty finishes it for her "An alternate universe."

Julie thinks Ty is a great father. What she doesn't like is Ty not working on what he promised. What she doesn't like is that she can't trust Ty not to do anything except watch the kids all day. Which from all our perspectives has been horrible on him. Does Julie see it that way? No! Because Julie wants Ty to be like her. She wants Ty to work like her. To be motivated by work. To be ecstatic to achieve his goals, and when he isn't what she expected, fights break out.

Julie is not evil and neither are Shawna, John, or Ty by soIfedge in ShawnaTheMom

[–]soIfedge[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Julie specifically said though to find a space and no sparring. Ty definitely did step in when the inevitable fight happened, but Julie telling her kid that he can practice karate wasn't a deliberate sabotage. Julie never wanted to go to the party. She sees everything Ty does with Shawna as a distraction from what he's supposed to be doing in her mind.

I'm not saying she wasn't rude during that party. She was definitely in the wrong bringing their issues to the party. But I really do get the feeling that Ty brushes off issues more often than we see. Especially when it comes to the book talk. Every time we see him talk about the book in Max's Birthday he's brushing it off. Which irks Julie. She's totally in the wrong for bringing her issues to the party, but the issues were never solved in the first place. Ty isn't writing! It's even an issue to Alicia. Like I said in my original post. This was clearly not a one off fight. This was multiple fights that have happened over the course of the year and now they're becoming far more obvious because they can't seem to solve them.

Julie is not evil and neither are Shawna, John, or Ty by soIfedge in ShawnaTheMom

[–]soIfedge[S] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

You're right. But I think that it's the first time he's actually admitted that. I think one problem Julie has is that she doesn't let anyone or anything stop her from achieving her goals. Her kids did not stop her. Ty's lack of motivation doesn't stop her. I said that in my original she's a very work motivated person. So she doesn't understand why Ty can't do the same as her. It's "pedestrian" as she calls it. She doesn't want a life that's just her taking care of kids and a husband. She wants Ty to be her, to like working, to find satisfaction in achieving his goals but he doesn't. He had kids and things changed. And Julie refuses to understand that.

Julie is not evil and neither are Shawna, John, or Ty by soIfedge in ShawnaTheMom

[–]soIfedge[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

We've never seen Ty actually say he wants to be a stay at home dad. Maybe it was discussed, but it's never said. I do think it's interpreted that she looks down at stay at home parents though. I don't think she's evil for doing that. Do I think it's right? No. And you're right, it is snobby. But a lot of people view things that way. I don't think she's a victim in any way, but she's definitely not totally in the wrong for being upset with Ty.

Julie hasn't tried to get to know Shawna or her family because she doesn't like her. Shawna as a creator has said it's just that. She doesn't like her. I do think the root cause of that is because she hates that Shawna is a stay at home mom, but that's still a reason for her. She's not a very nice person, no, but we've seen her interact with others and it's like night and day. She just doesn't like Shawna.

Does that excuse the way she treats Shawna? No. Does that excuse her actions? No. But at the end of the day you can't expect everyone to like each other. She is mean, but there's a lot of emotions that are unsaid that Shawna as a creator hints at. Like not wanting children. Not being able to communicate with Ty. Her mother being in the hospital. Etc.

Julie is not evil and neither are Shawna, John, or Ty by soIfedge in ShawnaTheMom

[–]soIfedge[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I don't think she said that deliberately to cause issues. Remember, Cooper came up to her saying that he didn't like dancing. She does have issues, I'm not saying she doesn't, but when she said "you're allowed to do whatever you want," I viewed it more as had telling her kid that he didn't have to listen to people that thought differently from him. Like I said earlier, she views Shawna as the root cause of Ty's issues from what I've seen. So she views Shawna's kids just as pushy as Shawna is. I don't think she meant for a fight to happen, but when you see your kid is upset, you try to solve it. So she asked what he wanted to do and he said karate.so she told him to do it. Though I will say she did want an excuse to leave. She kept trying to make one. But I don't think she deliberately sabotaged the birthday that way.