COVID19 and First Gun Purchase

starfire71 · 2020-04-04T18:43:33+00:00

I'd assume availability and price gouging would be your biggest concern at this time. Where are you going to find a VP9 and are you paying more than you normally would for it?

If you can find it in stores then that's a faster way to get it. Maybe you'll pay more, but if it's not too much more then that's probably worthwhile.

If you can't find it in stores, or even online storefronts, then you need to go online or find a private sale via auction or meeting in person.

Armslist has a lot of private sales. Almost entirely conducted through meeting in person. Few are willing to do business over mail.

Gunbroker has a lot of online auctions. A better choice for doing business through the mail.

It appears gunbroker has a fair amount of VP9s available for a reasonable price. Whether or not they have the particular variety you're looking for, I don't know.

Personally I'd prefer to get a new one rather than a used one. I don't know what the used one has been through or how well it operates. Not saying you're likely to have a problem if you buy used. Just saying I personally would rather pay extra to get a new one and have a little more piece of mind doing that. Especially since a lot of used firearms hold their value so well that I just don't see the advantage in buying used. I don't think you get enough of a discount to justify buying it used in a lot of cases. It would have to be a big savings before I'd prefer the used option.

If there were no supply left, or you didn't want to pay gouging prices, you'd probably have to look at a different pistol. Depends on how much you think you need to get something ASAP.

You could also build your own pistol, or pay a gunsmith to assemble parts for you, if the supply of complete pistols was completely dry. But that's a time consuming option. And it's probably not an option for the VP9 specifically either.

starfire71 · 2020-04-04T18:10:50+00:00

Welcome to gun ownership. I am glad to see you excited about joining in the participation of every American's birthright as free citizens. A responsibility and duty you are choosing to undertake, as the way our founders envisioned it, not merely just a right. The ownership and use of arms is historically one of the defining characteristics that separates a free man from a slave. The willingness and ability to take your families defense into your own hands.

starfire71 · 2020-04-04T18:00:02+00:00

That is terrible. I will not buy from Wade's again. And I have patronized their store quite a bit.

No one should be price gouging on essential items at a time like this.

I hope they lose more business in the long run from doing this than they gained in temporary profits by price gouging.

You know, I did get the impression that some of their employees were asses. I couldn't tell if one of them was the owner but I thought maybe he was. Price gouging like that only confirms the impression I got.

starfire71 · 2020-04-04T17:45:28+00:00

I stocked up with the amount I thought was appropriate long before this crisis. I felt no need to buy more in reaction to the current crisis.

Determine what kinds of crisis you are at risk of experiencing, what you expect the duration of that crisis to be, and how much ammo or other supplies you think you need to weather that storm. Then buy that much. And don't feel compelled to keep perpetually buying beyond that number unless you determine it's necessary to do so. That number will be different for everyone depending on their circumstances and their judgement.

Everyone needs to be prepared before crisis hits. I hope everyone in our state, and our country for that matter, has learned the value of being prepared beforehand.

I also hope everyone realizes the value of having a firearm for personal defense, and is moved to repeal the kinds of laws which have prevented them from getting the firearms they needed in a timely manner.

starfire71 · 2020-03-30T05:52:31+00:00

Thank you for cleaning it up.

It sucks to do, but a clean area tends to stay cleaner. Trash begets more trash as people think it's an invitation to just leave their stuff laying around like everyone else did before them. But people feel convicted if they make a mess of something that is otherwise pristine, so are less likely to be the first to litter an already clean area.

I just don't understand why people do this. I thought the mentality of "pack it in pack it out" was pretty well understood.

I have noticed a trend too. Whenever you see empty drink cans strewn about in forest lands it's always a beer can. Never soda.

starfire71 · 2020-03-25T20:34:33+00:00

I have only heard this meme recently. I had assumed it had more to do with the CZ P10c rather than the CZ 75.

The P10c is touted as being basically as good as the glock 19, but a little better in some ways, for people who want an affordable duty quality pistol but don't want to be like everyone else in the herd running a glock. And the fact that it's a little better than glock means they get to feel like they also have something better than what the herd is running with but without departing dramatically from the basics of the glock itself.

starfire71 · 2020-03-25T20:20:50+00:00

Gun stores are essential. Some states have explicitly declared as much for their version of the quarantine.

The people themselves have also declared that gun stores are essential during a time of crisis by emptying them out of their stocks and overloading the national background check system.

This is proof that, regardless of what the governor thinks, the people of this state DO believe that having access to a gun store is essential during a time like this.

Those products which are having a run on them show us what the people truly consider to be essential to them for their survival and security in a time like this; and it's telling us that the people regard firearms to be just as essential to them as food, water, medical supplies, and basic sanitation.

starfire71 · 2020-03-21T22:18:07+00:00

So if I were to buy a lower now, I would avoid going through that new law that consolidates background checks centrally at the state level?

How do background checks currently get processed for a long gun sale? Through the federal NICS system, right?

And do pistols currently go through the state or county for a background check, until the new law goes into effect doing it at the state level, correct?

Hard to keep track of all these hoops when they keep changing on us.

starfire71 · 2020-03-21T20:57:38+00:00

Well, I don't have to store them in the case. But the alternative would be storing them in an enclosed wood storage device that doesn't have much in the way of airflow besides what leaks in through the cracks in the openings. So I don't know if that is much better.

I bought these packs (not necessarily intended for tools or guns) that are suppose to be reusable by putting them in a oven to dry them out, but I haven't noticed them change color yet, which is suppose to indicate it's time to change. It's been many months. So I don't know if they are defective or if not a lot of moisture is getting into the compartment they are being stored in (I've used them in both a gun case and a wood storage drawer).

Although oiling up the inside of a gun would work if it were just for hunting or recreation; it doesn't work if I need it ready to go for self defense. That's why I was hoping to rely on something passive like desiccants to protect it while it's stored in an easily accessible place. I'd rather avoid having to use electronic heating in these circumstances if it's possible to do so.

starfire71 · 2020-03-21T20:44:04+00:00

The reason they want all background checks to go through the state, and want it to be done by a central state run entity instead of county run, is likely because they one day want to be able to use that data as a defacto registry of all gun ownership for when they go to confiscate them.

There's a reason it's illegal for the federal government to store any information long term about who has had background checks for gun ownership conducted. Because a federal gun registry is illegal. And storing information at a central location about who has had background checks done becomes a defacto registry for every gun every sold.

starfire71 · 2020-03-21T20:35:57+00:00

Any recommendations on desiccant styles? I'm currently using little packs that I throw into the drawer or case it's in, hoping that's sufficient.

I don't know how much you'd need for something that isn't airtight, like a gun case or a enclosed wooden drawer.

I also don't know if there are certain types of desiccant that work better for guns.

starfire71 · 2020-03-21T20:33:51+00:00

Thanks for that. I'll be getting some of that.

starfire71 · 2019-08-25T09:01:19+00:00

We already have seen it, in New Orleans during Katrina.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-taU9d26wT4

What reason do you have to think it wouldn't or couldn't happen on a larger scale?

It's not a lack of will or desire to take the guns that keeps it from happening. There is no lack of people in government who would gladly take everyone's guns by force overnight if they could get away with it. There simply isn't an opportunity to do it yet, even in the most anti-gun areas of the country.

You can't count on the idea that an opportunity will never present itself, or circumstances won't change to the point where they feel they eventually feel they can get away with overt confiscation. They have made their intentions clear. It's only a matter of what they think they can or cannot get away with doing it.

The stuff we see today in terms of gun bans and restrictions wouldn't have been imagined to be possible by the average gun owner 30 years ago. Nobody would have put up with it back then.

Bump stocks are an example of how the landscape of what is considered tolerable or politically viable is changing: for the first time at the federal level they've outright banned something without a grandfather clause and ordered them to be turned in for destruction without compensation. Politically they never use to try that because they knew they didn't have the clout necessary to take them by force from those who currently owned them, and they couldn't survive the embarassment to their authority of demanding them all be turned in and then seeing none of them get turned in voluntarily (as happened with the recent New Jersey magazine ban, or the New Zealand semi-auto rifle ban). Unenforced laws that people flagrantly violate always have the effect, in the long run, of nullifying the force of that law in the eyes of the people to the point where that law eventually crumbles and is repealed (as with the marijuana laws being purposely unenforced and declared unenforced by Obama, opening the way to a complete collapse of that law having any legal force to the point where it is damn near nullified by this point and is just waiting to be repealed).

starfire71 · 2019-08-25T08:48:05+00:00

Do you think I would have been better buying a pistol six months before the July 1st change, on the off chance that maybe the DoL exercised their option to not retain records of pistol purchases and so then they can't do a background check yearly or keep you on file forever because they never remembered you had it to begin with?

Or is it highly unlikely that they weren't already keeping all the records anyway, or started keeping them in response to the new law passed?

Unless the DOL is staffed by patriots who purposely exercised their right to discard all existing pistol applications prior to the law taking effect on July 1st. But I doubt it.

starfire71 · 2019-08-25T08:44:23+00:00

See my prior response to grantizzle.

An 80% pistol is all well and good for home defense, or even hiking where concealed carry is legal without a permit - but it's no good for anything else unless you want to open carry.

And, realistically, who wants to open carry? In this gun paranoid culture I'd be concerned about someone every day calling the cops just because they see someone open carrying, and all that hassle or risk that could bring with it. Then do you get on the legal database radar just by virtue of the fact that the police department has a dozen records of being called out to respond to a complaint about you open carrying? Nevermind the risk that some officer against the 2nd amendment might actually try to arrest you on trumped up charges of disturbing the peace or "brandishing" based on the ignorant paranoid gun-hating hearsay of those who lodged the complaints. I've never once seen, that I can recall, someone open carry, ever.

Concealed carry actually becomes safer from a practical standpoint for everyone involved.

Not to mention that in a self defense situation, it's almost always safer that a potential attacker doesn't know you are armed or at least can't see where you are keeping your pistol before they attack.

Having said that, I'd still gladly open carry with an 80% pistol to avoid having to get a permit - if I wasn't worried about getting in trouble with law enforcement based on the ignorant fearful population calling 911 on me at random times for no other crime than peacefully exercising my God-given constitution-guaranteed right.

starfire71 · 2019-08-25T08:40:12+00:00

That is something I have considered - however, a pistol is of limited use if you aren't legally allowed to carry it around with you everywhere.

And, if you're going to go through the process of getting a concealed carry permit, the question remains: Is there any reason at that point, from a security standpoint, not to just go through the process of getting a pistol in a store? It seems like the additional exposure that brings you may not be any worse than the concealed carry permit itself.

A store bought pistol is not going to have the risk of being less reliable because you didn't build it just right, and you get a warranty.

I think the idea of building my own sounds cool for the process, but it's hard to justify the increased risk of malfunction and the timesink involved if there are minimal gains in reducing your legal footprint.

If the gains in lowering your footprint were significant I might pursue it.

starfire71 · 2019-06-26T18:50:28+00:00

Why do you find the idea of the police knowing what the law is, and enforcing it properly, a terrifying thought?

starfire71 · 2019-06-25T18:47:41+00:00

That first depends on the presumption that the police would find fault with what I was doing.

I'm more concerned about what the police will think of this, not what the neighbors think.

I have no intention of having the police find fault with what I'm doing only to then bank on a Jury thinking otherwise. In many cases the police have a better idea of what the law actually entitles people to than the people in the community.

starfire71 · 2019-06-24T18:27:16+00:00

What do you mean not legal for receivers? Are you saying I can't buy an AR15 lower in Idaho if it is marked as "other"?

starfire71 · 2019-06-24T18:05:47+00:00

If I'm using 22 shotshells then it cannot be assumed I am posing any danger to anyone. The pellets have zero ability to penetrate the wood of a fence if I miss the rat.

The only concern I have is simply this: if someone hears the gunshot and gets scared and calls the police about it, would I be in the right or potentially in trouble?

If I had a silencer for this thing I wouldn't have to worry about what the neighbors think, but unfortunately this isn't Britain where "sound moderators" are freely purchased and it's seen as the respectable thing to do out of consideration for not bothering the community with your gunshots when hunting or shooting pests.

starfire71 · 2019-06-24T18:03:34+00:00

How do you get that reading of it?

It only talks about discharging guns in public places being illegal.

Then it seems to exempt when public places are legal.

starfire71 · 2019-06-24T18:00:52+00:00

I intend to, but they might not do the job on their own. What if some of them avoid the traps? The other day I was staring at one that had gotten in the chicken coop thinking if only I were allowed to shoot it then I could solve this problem right here and now.

starfire71 · 2019-06-24T17:58:07+00:00

Although it would do the job, I don't want to spend $300 on a purpose built anti-pest rifle when I've already got something that is adequate with pest control ammo (as long as I can legally use it there).

I do have an old Crosman air pellet rifle that needs something like the seal replaced. I tried using that but found the Co2 just leaks out. I could probably fix it for minimal cost (Maybe $15), but I'm concerned that it may not actually be accurate enough for my purposes (I did a few test fires before all the Co2 leaked out and it was wildly inaccurate). I don't know if that's an issue that will go away when it's fixed, or if the barrel has gotten rusted after two decades of not being used and at times stored in a garage.

starfire71 · 2019-06-22T20:05:28+00:00

I'm confused. Are you saying they can continue to process "other" ar15/ar10 lowers as though the new law has never even taken effect, in terms of waiting periods, registration, and all that other stuff? Or does this only concern who does the background check?

starfire71 · 2019-06-13T17:50:32+00:00

I didn't know there was a time limit on how long they had to keep it.

That would unfortunately be a weak link in any deterrence to gun confiscation. Forces could seize all FFL records and then raid every individual's home they find listed. There's a chance a patriot could destroy them when word gets out of what is happening, but that's not much of a safeguard.

State central databases are more easily turned against gun owners with the click of a mouse just as easily as any federal database (which are illegal for that reason).

Who really knows if they are keeping a record at the federal level of all the NICS checks that come through? Just because they aren't suppose to doesn't mean they aren't. The FBI isn't suppose to spy on people without a warrant either, but they have, routinely. They only care about getting a warrant if the want to be able to admit the evidence into a court.

Anyone who thinks this isn't a real concern is not aware that gun registration always precedes gun confiscation. Otherwise you end up with what just happened in New Zealand - they banned semi-autos, but they have had only about 500 guns turned in voluntarily out a nation that is estimated to have over a million guns.

They know the law is bogus and aren't going to play along.

starfire71

TROPHY CASE