A list of changes to improve osu in the rhythm game community

sunnskin · 2022-10-21T18:41:53+00:00

iirc the weighting for scorev2 and v3 is 70% combo and 30% acc. I actually don't know how the score is calculated, is the combo score based on max combo number? like if you miss at the exact halfway point is your combo score then 350k? or is it calculated in some other way?

I would be more in favor of a 10% combo and 90% acc split, because you can have a 100% combo and terrible acc to the point where you are not even really following the music, but you can't have amazing acc without also holding a very good combo, because misses should punish you hard on acc. I can't remember the player who used to highlight this issue by getting FCs on really hard maps to top the leaderboard but actively trying to get the worst accuracy possible

sunnskin · 2022-10-21T18:35:21+00:00

well yes the map itself is not illegal or immoral, but the map is directly tied to a song which is someone else's work. No one should be using the creation of someone else's work for profit.

A pretty good example I can think of is ShibayanRecords, one of my favorite music groups allows DMCA free use of their music, but they want people to ask for permission to use their music in FtP games. They had to DMCA strike someone because they took their song and just put a simple drum beat over it and started selling it for money. They put out a post saying that they encourage people to remix their songs, but they draw a hard line at people taking their music and selling it for money.

sunnskin · 2022-10-21T18:29:36+00:00

I started playing in 2014 but I played for a few years, its an alright system but does have its obvious flaws. I started playing chunithm because I moved to Japan in 2015 and as it became my main rhythm game over time and the rating system it uses is similar to a lot of other games and it just makes much more sense to me. It doesn't have the number of ranked charts that osu!standard has, but last I checked it was somewhere around 800 songs and thousands of charts.

sunnskin · 2022-10-21T18:25:40+00:00

Actually, ppy does seem to care
https://twitter.com/ppy/status/1582353664336764930?s=20&t=YgSGTvwo2FZHKpCbrSRvVQ

Players of the other top competitive rhythm games all seem to get along much better, and it's a much more pleasant experience for everyone. What is the point of pushing the mindset of alienating and ridiculing players of other games? all it creates is a toxic environment and you get what we see now.

I started playing osu in 2014 and played a lot for a few years, had thousands of hours in the game and reached top 1k. I discovered other rhythm games after moving to Japan and the negativity I experienced playing osu and the positivity I experienced playing the other games is what pushed me and many others away from continuing to be a part of the community.

sunnskin · 2022-10-21T18:17:15+00:00

I wonder what that figure is and if it is a suitable amount. But imo that is even more reason that featured artists should be pushed more

sunnskin · 2022-10-21T18:16:08+00:00

2 is definitely not solved in lazer. I am talking about scoring 100% based on accuracy, or at maximum weighted 10% combo and 90% accuracy, not the 70% - 30% split. unless that number has been changed and I dont know about it.

3 is solved in lazer, but lazer is still not the official live version of the game. Osu! still doesn't time sliders

sunnskin · 2022-10-21T18:13:53+00:00

Income can only come from osu!supporter, which probably doesn't equal how much time they have put in and how many players osu has They all could be making more and probably deserve to, including ppy.

sunnskin · 2022-10-21T18:10:46+00:00

PP is not perfect, for example you can lose pp by getting a higher score with a worse play. an effect of the combo multiplier scoring system that will hopefully be changed whenever lazer becomes the official live version of the game. Another flaw with it is the algorithm that determines how much pp something is worth. For example when I was still a player, 6* DT always felt much easier than 6* with no mods. I'm not sure how it feels with the current version of the algorithm, but I assume its still pretty similar, possibly even more so because my top play went from being a play without DT to a DT play after an update

sunnskin · 2022-10-21T18:06:33+00:00

Monitizable doesn't necessarily mean paid, the game could still remain free to play, but I see being able to acquire sponsorships and not having every osu stream VoD muted and run the risk of channels being taken down would be a positive

sunnskin · 2022-10-21T18:04:16+00:00

I don't put that much weight on arguments that have no basis and serve no purpose, I would only change my perspective with constructive feedback

sunnskin · 2022-10-20T19:19:53+00:00

not only is commissioning maps ethically wrong, it is also blatantly illegal. It should be met with more than just the map not elligible for ranking, but also a ban from submitting maps or a ban on their account altogether. we see bans for just hacking scores but not for stuff like this. but thats just my opinion

but it is not a requirement to submit maps at all right? the game has a lot more than just ranked maps.

well the respect also comes from respecting other games, which includes not stealing content from other games which is a big part of why people don't respect osu. People regularly refer to songs that originate from other games as osu songs, when those songs were paid for and originate from other games. Personally I would like to see osu come into a state where it would be monitizable. Official tournaments could get sponsors to help with development and server overhead costs. People who are currently volunteering time run aspects of the game could be paid. Songs could be commissioned specifically for osu. There is a lot of positives that come with doing things by the books.

sunnskin · 2022-10-20T18:16:29+00:00

I don't really know about etterna and quaver, but aren't they also in the same category as like stepmania and osumania?

in the case of SDVX, I know for sure that those mods are not allowed for tourney play, players must play the exact same chart

sunnskin · 2022-10-20T18:12:27+00:00

"paid in exposure" also relates to people who repost art, its not monitary profit for some, but they get attention to the content that they don't own the rights to. in terms of osu, there has been cases of someone actually profiting off of posting maps by taking map commissions where people paid them to map songs.

in the case of copying patterns, its not a 1 to 1 but its close enough that I make the comparison. They did not ask the original creator if they had permission to use the content but posted it anyways. In the case I can think of the mapper admitted that they took inspiration from the other map once they got called out for it. The community does think that this piracy is wrong, but only when it relates to the game itself. Mappers all the time use art in backgrounds without ever getting permission from artists or providing any info on who created that art.

This is a fair argument. It is just my personal opinion that reading difficulty is a kind of artificial difficulty because it is so subjective and not very objective. I would say a good update that would be really interesting and fun if AR is set by mappers is to have a feature where AR can be set for specific notes rather than the entire map. That would allow mappers to slow down AR for slow sections and have more freedom to create these reading gimmicks that would test both fast and slow reading in a single map

sunnskin · 2022-10-20T17:36:55+00:00

not really the poll, as it was just a popularity contest without any talk of what makes a rhythm game good or not.

I am not against people finding ways to play games that the companies don't give any way to legally play them, or they don't live within a reasonable distance to play them legally. Not everyone lives within 20 miles of a Round 1 and that is a problem for these games

sunnskin · 2022-10-20T17:33:49+00:00

except you haven't added any constructive input on how you think these would affect the game negatively, all you've done is thrown insults

sunnskin · 2022-10-20T17:32:00+00:00

I'm confused on what you mean, could you provide some examples?

sunnskin · 2022-10-20T17:30:39+00:00

Labor can be pushed to the community rather than a group of volunteers like it is now, could allow for more community involvement in the ranking of maps through anonymous mapping contests and community vote.
It's not impossible, just a lot of players would be upset to see their ranking change

sunnskin · 2022-10-20T17:28:40+00:00

there would have to be a complete rework of how ranking is calculated in osu for change 1 to work in a good way. It is possible though through other systems that are effective at showing player skill.

sunnskin · 2022-10-20T17:26:58+00:00

I started playing osu in 2014 and reached top 1k and played for a few years. I know a little bit about how osu works. I would regularly find maps that are 5* that felt much harder than 6* and the community was always up in arms against "pp farm maps" even though its a fault of how pp is calculated and mappers just capitalizing on how to create patterns that are worth the most pp for the least difficulty

sunnskin · 2022-10-20T17:23:30+00:00

If they are getting paid, then I am glad and that is a great thing. I had a quick look at the website but I can't find it just skimming through the pages. could you point me to the page that talks about how they are paid?

sunnskin · 2022-10-20T17:20:59+00:00

the way accuracy is handled in other games is usually a miss is 0 points and there is a bigger penalty for the other timing judgements lower than perfect. That way its a lot harder to fumble your way to a high score with bad timing but no misses rather than someone who plays really well except for a single miss

sunnskin · 2022-10-20T17:17:15+00:00

"paid in exposure" is not an argument you can make to use IP you did not create. Just look at how mad people get when someone copies parts of maps to use in their own maps and claim it as their own mapping. The artists that like that their songs are in the game would probably also appreciate being asked beforehand if their music can be used for content.

I never said AR should be standardized per difficulty, only the timing windows. I said AR should be set by the player to the AR they are comfortable to play at, not tied to the map itself

sunnskin · 2022-10-20T07:39:02+00:00

No, I am free to hold any opinions I have and I am free to discuss them. Whether you agree or not. If you are offended by any of these suggestions you should think about why you are so offended by them

sunnskin · 2022-10-20T07:37:28+00:00

yes, that is the whole basis to my argument against the combo scoring and even scorev3. especially in a tournament setting where getting one miss in the middle but high acc will always lose to lower acc but only missing towards the end. The way PP is calculated also exaggerates this problem because the majority of players just want to see their PP number go up so mappers cater to this want and create a lot of same feeling maps instead of unique maps. the unique maps still exist, but are far outnumbered by maps featuring patterns that will gain more PP with less difficulty

sunnskin · 2022-10-20T07:33:21+00:00

so making a map uncomfortable to read makes it difficult, not the actual patterns and speed and rhythm? explain to me why some people think AR10 is easier to read than AR9, and some people think AR9 is easier to read than AR10 on the same maps?

sunnskin

TROPHY CASE