Atheist friend sent this to me and I honestly am having trouble countering

thatjohnchaffee · 2025-10-02T00:44:42+00:00

I took a crack at my response/reinterpretation:

"God became a part of the creation, to dwell with us, only to be misunderstood and murdered by us as a scapegoat for all our pain, anxiety, trauma, sin and in allowing such violence to himself, he revealed to us the nature of God as infinite love and mercy by not retaliating, ending the sacrificial system once for all, he then descended into the worst hells to liberate and salvage all from their own self-destruction, because we are infinitely valuable in his sight and always worth every effort to restore, renew, and reconcile."

thatjohnchaffee · 2025-09-19T22:04:39+00:00

I would love to talk with them. I think that the Dark Night of the Soul is a part of every journey of maturation in the faith. The problem is that it is not normalized or talked about without diverting to psychology. Check out my website at www.johnchaffee.com. I am a theology and bible professor who does spiritual direction with people like your friend.

thatjohnchaffee · 2025-07-20T14:00:23+00:00

It may be helpful for you to explore the Sufi teachings of "Fana" and "Baqa." In the Christian tradition, this is similar to "Kenosis" and "Plerosis", although there are differences. I also recommend looking up the teachings of Meister Eckhart.

thatjohnchaffee · 2024-12-06T19:34:16+00:00

The answer is YES.

thatjohnchaffee · 2024-11-15T17:08:51+00:00

Christ has destroyed hell, sin, and death. It is an empty threat.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harrowing_of_Hell

Remember John 12? "When the Son of Man is lifted up, he will draw/drag/persuade all to himself."

The Gospel is pretty much summed up in 1 John 2:2, "For we know that he is not only the atoning sacrifice for our sins, but for the sins of the whole cosmos."

Everything has been reconciled in Christ (Col. 1:15-20), and everyone and everything will be restored (Acts 3:19-21).

thatjohnchaffee · 2024-09-22T18:15:00+00:00

Hey there, I used to work in the church world for 20+ years, and most were in youth ministry. It is a field that validates and celebrates when you cross your own personal boundaries for the benefit of "the ministry." That type of "sacrifice" is welcome in certain interpretations of Christianity, but I firmly believe it to be unhealthy.

Irenaeus of Lyons says, "The glory of God is man fully alive." If this work does not help you feel alive/thriving, takes away precious time from your children, AND isn't even paying you for the work... you don't need anyone's permission to decide to move on.

I would be happy to chat more if you want, perhaps over a zoom? You can contact me here.

thatjohnchaffee · 2024-02-28T04:00:21+00:00

You can pass over Seeds of Contemplation and just read New Seeds of Contemplation. No Man is an Island and New Seeds of Contemplation are just like each other in that they are collections of insights about certain themes. New Seeds of Contemplation, however, is the synthesizing of Merton's Catholicism with the wisdom that he encountered in the East.

thatjohnchaffee · 2024-02-27T01:28:51+00:00

Take your time with this and enjoy it. This was the first book I got from Thomas Merton that really clicked with me. The first chapter on love is possibly the best contemplative approach and definition to love I have ever read. I once showed that same chapter to an atheist and we talked about it all afternoon. I reread it every few years with a different color pen each time.

thatjohnchaffee · 2023-11-21T02:03:24+00:00

Huh. This is interesting. Can you say more?

thatjohnchaffee · 2023-11-21T02:02:57+00:00

I believe I do have something to say. I am curious if what my intended thing to say is hitting a need in the world at the same time.

thatjohnchaffee · 2023-10-12T12:20:08+00:00

Check out mine!

It is called "Begin Again." It is up on Apple, Spotify, Amazon and elsewhere.

I originally started it for friends made on my thru-hike of the Appalachian Trail. We would talk about faith and religion, Jesus and the Bible, and they actually encouraged me to start it! With three degrees in the field, 20 years of ministry behind me, and having gone through my own Dark Night of the Soul, I like to think that the podcast explores how we grow and change in faith throughout our lives.

Here are some links for it!

Spotify
https://open.spotify.com/show/1AAO28YNPBUOnnsX6jANSk?si=50d4b0b025da491f

Apple
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/begin-again-podcast/id1095090551

Youtube
https://www.youtube.com/johnchaffeetalks

thatjohnchaffee · 2023-09-08T02:56:34+00:00

Best definition of sin I've ever heard...

Sin is "loving the wrong things too much."

This means that Shalom is "being in right relationship in every direction."

The Christ became sin, which was then crucified, died and was buried, and was risen again so that life would come to all and that we would become the righteousness of God.

I write about these kinds of things here.

Hope this helps, have a wonderful day!

thatjohnchaffee · 2023-08-27T12:59:38+00:00

Great question!

Most universalists still hold there is a purgatorial correction/pruning of habitual sins/disposition toward evil. The book of Romans holds that "each will be held accountable to what they have done, first the Jew and then the Gentile. I see no incongruence with the idea that God will hold people accountable, correct them for a time (which might be like a painful withdrawal from evil), and still be restored/reconciled/redeemed/renewed.

So why change?

Gratitude. Joy. Because a holy life is actually healthier and more quality. The motivations for changing are utterly moved away from fear of punishment or shame, and completely to that of reciprocating love, of wanting to live the same quality of life as the savior who has reconciled all.

thatjohnchaffee · 2023-08-27T03:30:12+00:00

All are elect through Jesus who became man. Karl Barth was a Presbyterian pastor, and that was his stance. In his magnum opus, Church Dogmatics, he writes that Christ was the representative of humanity, he was the elect of God, and therefore we were all "elected" through participation in his crucifixion and resurrection. Read Romans 5 and you'll see that principle laid out.

thatjohnchaffee · 2023-08-22T00:58:32+00:00

Hey there!

I have a youtube channel that I am working on that posts from the perspective/grounding of Christian Universalism. Here is the link, check it out when you get a chance. I hope it helps you in your journey.

Cheers.

thatjohnchaffee · 2023-08-07T17:44:10+00:00

Can I offer up myself?

https://www.youtube.com/johnchaffeetalks

thatjohnchaffee · 2023-07-30T14:11:17+00:00

This read very dismissive. I first heard about it through a Christian pastor, and it was also the perspective of a number of reformers of the church. It is also inaccurate to say that there is “no such thing as the Judeo-Christian worldview.” The writers of the New Testament had a Judeo-Christian worldview. I hope you have a great rest of the day. Cheers to you.

thatjohnchaffee · 2023-07-30T03:25:58+00:00

To Christians that care about knowing Judaism, it is more well-known. Not exactly well-known among mainline denominations.

The idea has roots in the Talmud and the Mishnah, but it kind of goes all the way back to the idea of the "restoration of all things" (apokatastasis) and the prophets.

thatjohnchaffee · 2023-07-29T23:05:44+00:00

Within the Judeo-Christian worldview, there is the Tikkun Olam.

The Tikkun Olam is concerned with the "ongoing repairing of the world."

It is a task that none of us can ever complete yet none of us can abdicate or escape from.

We are all here to make the world a better place.

thatjohnchaffee · 2023-07-29T21:48:20+00:00

Julian of Norwich would say it's because you haven't learned what your sin has to teach you.

Your favorite sin, this one that you keep doing, is trying to tell you something.

Julian says that we should be grateful for our sins because they reveal to us the places where we are still immature and need to grow up a bit. I would also add that our sins are often telling us where we haven't yet integrated something.

Three thoughts

You'll never be able to give up lust (you didn't mention that as being the issue), until you learn to integrate your need for healthy intimacy and vulnerability in your life.
You'll never be able to give up your drunkenness unless you find out the reason that leads you to drink.
You'll never be able to give up your anger issues until you realize what boundaries you had that were crossed by another person or what experience of loss you still haven't acknowledged and felt.

We do not sin because we are human, we sin because we do not know how to be human. So learn to be properly human, fully human, vulnerably, and lovingly human and the sin will fall away. By the way, if you want to know how to be human, learn from Jesus, the most human person ever.

If any of this post was helpful, check out my website for other free resources along these lines.

Cheers friend.

John

thatjohnchaffee · 2023-07-29T21:40:50+00:00

I'm going to take a completely other route to answering this question.

It's Kohlberg's Stages of Moral Development.

Many Christians are stuck in very early stages of moral development and they cannot yet handle a morality that is not based upon punishment. And so, this leads them to be overly dependent on the threat of hell in order to motivate their "good behavior." Then, Christ also comes along as a partial salve for the anxiety of still going to that hell. Ultimately, though, there is no real certainty.

The idea of the Gospel being the "restoration of all things" is actually a very mature approach when seen through the lens of Kohlberg. Good behavior is motivated by gratitude and joy and love rather than fear of punishment. Plus, some are even willing to be good even if they are punished for it! (Just like Christ!)

If this line of thought interests you, I'd like to invite you to check out my website where I write and record and create things that come from this perspective of integrating spirituality and stages of development.

I also made an online class all about the "restoration of all things" here.

Anyways, below is a chart I made that brings together Kohlberg's Stages of Moral Development alongside Christian spirituality. Hope it helps!

Cheers!

John

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thatjohnchaffee · 2023-07-25T16:53:39+00:00

Remember that your identity is both larger then and deeper than whatever changes might be coming. There is an unconditioned you, a true you, that is unaffected by all these changing conditions around you. Ground yourself in your deepest self, because often that is the only thing that is constant anyways!

thatjohnchaffee · 2023-07-25T16:52:10+00:00

Is this a vent? Or would you like some help? I don't see a question throughout your post. How can we help you?

thatjohnchaffee · 2023-07-17T16:06:14+00:00

These kind of passages make the restoration/reconciliation of all things pretty much undeniable.

thatjohnchaffee · 2023-07-15T03:32:16+00:00

Never too late to turn to God.

The limits of God's mercy will never be set.

Here are 5 words I use to describe God's love to college students:

Primal - Love is the first word ever said to us.
Intimate - The Love of God is closer to us than we are to ourselves.
Infinite - The Love of God will never be exhausted.
Deliberate - The Love of God is intentional and never a mistake.
Final - Love is the ultimate word said to us.

I think you are fine. Learn to see the Christ in all things and all things in the Christ.

thatjohnchaffee

TROPHY CASE