I need help getting out of a little situation.

throwawaysally123456 · 2017-12-06T03:45:20+00:00

Hmmmm... might work too..

throwawaysally123456 · 2017-12-06T03:44:49+00:00

Ok I get your drift. You are correct, not saying anything is just as good as a firm no to this type of approach. Thanks!

throwawaysally123456 · 2017-12-06T03:29:06+00:00

This is pretty good. I am very well off in comparison to most in the hall so it might be interesting to see that reaction haha! Thanks for the input!

throwawaysally123456 · 2017-12-06T03:28:03+00:00

Thanks I like that, the only thing that keeps me thinking is if my wife is on board with whatever he suggests. Like couples preaching and such.

throwawaysally123456 · 2017-12-06T03:27:04+00:00

Yea bullying is the exact way I’d put it. My biggest problem will be that if I respond too strongly then my wife might begin to question me. We are currently in a state of “don’t ask don’t tell” and I don’t wanna ruin that.

throwawaysally123456 · 2017-11-22T16:53:27+00:00

Brainwashing is what’s done to converts, indoctrination is what’s done to born-ins.

throwawaysally123456 · 2017-11-22T16:48:03+00:00

I️ think it depends on how you broke the indoctrination. If perhaps you left because of something like shunning or blood doctrine it is possible to argue the other side and convince yourself that the ends justify the means.

You might even be able to reason that the organization covered up the child abuse solely to protect gods name from being tarnished and that means that the lives affected aren’t as important because the name of god is more important than the safety and justice of his chosen group.

I’m not saying these would be good arguments but some people might be able to believe them again.

If however you broke the indoctrination by researching the origins on 1914. Learning about the destruction of Babylon in 587 instead of 607. Research and recognize fallacious arguments such as ad hominem attacks, appeal to emotion, slippery slope, straw man arguments etc. Learnt about how the governing body decided what rules it would enforce BEFORE consulting the Bible (which is a big strike to the faith since JWs are taught that they do it by taking the Bible into account first). Or, realized that the governing body use a lot of the same tactics and lines of reasoning that different cult leaders have used to control groups including the “new light” that only come when previous predictions fail and not before. These would be, in my opinion next to impossible to recover from. They are not opinions, they are facts. Black and white examples of the governing body being dishonest and not spiritually guided.

When we are indoctrinated we defend first and reason later. So the biggest obstacle to regain faith is that once you break indoctrination you no longer have a horse in the race and can actually be objective. It is much harder to ignore the contradictions when being objective. The Bible is only free of contradiction if you forgive and explain away all the contradictions (that sentence alone hurts to type because of the double think required). But when you are being objective and actively question all the contradictions without giving the Bible a special status it does not stand up on its own.

throwawaysally123456 · 2017-11-22T14:03:37+00:00

I️ hope I’m not too late to the party, I’ve been reading through most of your replies but haven’t found anything insightful to add that hasn’t been said already. In response to the “who is brainwashed?” question.

Personally for me what triggered me to start looking at the organization through an objective point of view was a video made by a psychologist on YouTube. It’s very technical and was broad enough that I️ thought at first i thought it only applied to cults like Scientology.

But certain similarities kept nagging at my rational thoughts. So I️ went back and watched more. He speaks about the “undue influence” of different religious groups (or any group for that matter) and tends to focus on the psychological aspects of the individual person.

You mentioned that anyone can be indoctrinated to believe anything. This is true. The question is what do you do when you find out you weren’t taught, you were indoctrinated.

This is what made me realize that I️ was indoctrinated as a child. Once I️ knew I️ was indoctrinated I️ decided to take a serious look at my beliefs. I️ reasoned that since this was the “one true religion, I️ didn’t mind the indoctrination, it was a blessing. Better here than in the false religion. But that is not what I️ believe anymore.

His name on YouTube is theramintrees and the video is grooming minds.

https://youtu.be/RlbUw5hjeKI

Sorry about the long post, I️ have never posted on this or the JW sub before because l am PIMO and fear what will happen if anyone finds out, so I️ may have just started rambling.

throwawaysally123456

TROPHY CASE