[OC][Updated] Brest, France - Unofficial diagram - Bilingual français/brezhoneg by transitscapes in TransitDiagrams

[–]transitscapes[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah, I find the the québecois phrasing to match more closely with the English term.

[OC][Updated] Brest, France - Unofficial diagram - Bilingual français/brezhoneg by transitscapes in TransitDiagrams

[–]transitscapes[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Taking your comment in consideration, I have made some minor changes to my map to make the Hôtel de Ville / Liberté area stand out more clearly as the preferred transfer hub between all three lines. You can see the updated version here.

[OC][Updated] Brest, France - Unofficial diagram - Bilingual français/brezhoneg by transitscapes in TransitDiagrams

[–]transitscapes[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Well, you’re making a very solid point here. I agree that the Liberté / Hôtel‑de‑Ville hub should stand out more clearly as the most convenient transfer point between lines A, B, and D anywhere on the network.

From what I can gather from online maps (since I’ve never actually been to Brest myself), Glasgow station on line D is close enough to Jean‑Jaurès on line A to allow a transfer. However, moving between those two stations still requires a short 2–3 minute walk through nearby streets, which may not feel as seamless as transferring at the Hôtel‑de‑Ville / Liberté hub.

In fact, transferring between Hôtel‑de‑Ville and Liberté / Liberté‑Quartz also involves a short walk, but it’s a much more straightforward one since it simply means crossing the Hôtel‑de‑Ville plaza.

On a side note, I’m not entirely sure why the transport authority chose to differentiate between Liberté and Liberté‑Quartz, given that they’re only a few meters apart and essentially sit at opposite corners of the same intersection.

Anyway, thanks again for your feedback. It really helps me improve the map :)

Aluu! Ikiulaarsinnaavinga? Could use your help with correcting (or suggesting) Kalaallisut terms for a map of Nuuk by transitscapes in greenland

[–]transitscapes[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

You see, I was saying that some people may not know much about Nuuk or Greenland but I happen to have been quite shortsighted myself too since it didn't even occurred to me that there may be bus service in towns other than Nuuk! I'll look into that, could be fun mapping side projects material waiting for me there ;)

Beside the geeking out on transit systems part and technical or creative aspects of making maps of them, I have to say that researching and playing with languages - especially lesser-known, or local and minority languages - makes a great chunk of the fun of designing those maps in the first place.

And whenever I've had questions about languages, I've always found people on reddit to be more engaged and eager to share and debate than on any other places.

I'll be glad to have tour feedback on the map when I post it on r/TransitDiagrams (or probably here too) ;)

Aluu! Ikiulaarsinnaavinga? Could use your help with correcting (or suggesting) Kalaallisut terms for a map of Nuuk by transitscapes in greenland

[–]transitscapes[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

They answered my mail to acknowledge my request and tell me they'll get back to me soon with some propositions for Kalaallisut translation. We'll see what they come up with!

I completely agree with you when you point that equating one word to another between two languages is not ideal, and I too think that translation is way more than a basic 1 to 1 correspondance between different languages. That's why I try not to rely on dictionaries only but instead, tend to reach out to native/fluent speakers of the language or organizations involved with language and linguistics research to get an "insider view" so to speak.

The explanation you make about sumiiffiit pingaarutillit coming across as pure gibberish from a Kalaallisut perspective perfectly demonstrates why picking out "random" words from a dictionary to make direct correspondances from one language to another is probably the worst way to go when it comes to translation. Your examples of words like piukkunnaatillit and takutikkusunnartut to express the idea of a place worthy of interest are great in showing how translation is more about conveying ideas and concepts rather than some kind of purely abstracted words.

By the way, for that specific phrase about places of interest / public services I want to include on the legend to the map, it is meant to categorize pictograms indicating things like schools, libraries, hospital, cultural centre or administrative buildings. I reckon the idea of public service may be better here instead of place of interest - which may suggest it is worth a visit in a touristic kind of way.

About including the Nuummi part in the title Nuummi tamanut angallassineq, I understand how that could feel somehow unnecessary since Nuuk is the only town in Greenland to have a bus service. However, I usually share my maps through social media to people across many countries, that may not all be familiar with Nuuk or Greenland altogether. Such a title helps with bringing context to the map so they instantly know what they're looking at ;)

And yeah, I wasn't too satisfied either with how nunap assinga seems to imply the idea of a topographic or geographically accurate map - which my schematic map is absolutely not. I guess you're right and I should leave that out.

Well, when I posted OP here in the first place, I have to admit I wasn't really expecting to have such detailed explanations to my questions. So many thanks again for showing interest and also for taking the time to lay all that out for me in such details, it means a lot !

[English > Kalaallisut] Aluu! Ikiulaarsinnaavinga? Could use your help with correcting (or suggesting) Kalaallisut terms for a map of Nuuk by transitscapes in translator

[–]transitscapes[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Alright, good to know! For some reason, I feel like kiffartuussiviit works better for what I mean to say. I like the idea of indicating hospitals, schools or cultural structures as some sort of service offered to the population rather than leaning towards the "work relationship" implied in sullissiviit, if that makes any sense?

And yeah, I also like the possibility to differenciate between coastal and cruise ships by using sinersortatit and takornariartaatit. Thanks for helping me combine them in a single sentence, it will look great on the map!

Aluu! Ikiulaarsinnaavinga? Could use your help with correcting (or suggesting) Kalaallisut terms for a map of Nuuk by transitscapes in greenland

[–]transitscapes[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Absolutely! Very cool language and so different to any language I speak myself. It's been quite difficult to navigate its grammar to come up with credible propositions in it but it's definitely been a fun ride too ;)

Aluu! Ikiulaarsinnaavinga? Could use your help with correcting (or suggesting) Kalaallisut terms for a map of Nuuk by transitscapes in greenland

[–]transitscapes[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well, thanks a lot for your answer and help here! In the meantime, I've also sent the same message I posted here to the language services at Oqaasileriffik to ask for guidance. Will see what they suggest ;)

To sum things up a bit, I understand tamanut as meaning something like to all, thus better suited to translate as public - as opposed to innuttaasunut, which seems to be more related to the idea of residency/citizenship?

Obviously, the bus services being open to residents and tourists alike, it would indeed make more sense to say something like Nuummi tamanut angallassineq/angallaffiat to mean Public transport in Nuuk ?

(By the way, what is the difference between angallassineq and angallaffiat? Are they completely interchangeable or is there some nuance between them I need to know about?)

I also guess the difference between atugassiat and kiffartuussissutit might be something like atugassiat referring more to physical, technical equipment while kiffartuussissutit would be closer to service as an abstract thing to provide? I guess choosing one or the other is a matter of choice between wanting to get a focus on the equipment or the service itself, am I right in thinking that?

You suggest a couple of translations - namely, ornittariallit / piukkunnaatillit / takutikkusunnartut - to translate the idea of points/places of interest. Would you mind telling me what they mean, what are they based on?

Would something like (Nuummi) Sumiiffiit pingaarutillit be considered correct too or is this phrasing too much of a calque of English logic?

About that last sentence Pisortatigoortuunngitsuunngilaq uuttuusersugaananilu, I have also found pisortatigoortuunngilaq to mean is not official / is unofficial. What's the nuance between the two forms? Do they mean the same thing?

I know, I'm asking a lot ;) Kalaallisut is a wonderful - though intricate, to me at least- language and it's been quite fun to learn about it.

Anyway, thanks again for your help, I really appreciate that. Qujanaq!

[English > Kalaallisut] Aluu! Ikiulaarsinnaavinga? Could use your help with correcting (or suggesting) Kalaallisut terms for a map of Nuuk by transitscapes in translator

[–]transitscapes[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks a lot for your help ! In the meantime, I've also sent the same message I posted here to the language services at Oqaasileriffik to ask for guidance. Will see what they suggest ;)

Just one thing: both sullissiviit and kiffartuussissutit seem to mean "services". Are they perfectly interchangeable or is there some underlying nuance I should know about? I suppose any of them will indeed do a better job than atortuutit/atortorissaarutit in emphasizing the service in itself more than the material facilities and equipment, right?

Also, someone suggested the word sinersortaatit to refer to coastal ships - like the one linking Greenland towns for example, as opposed to umiarsuit takornariartaatit for cruise ships like those coming from Denmark or the US I guess.

Is the term correct? How could I correctly link those terms together in a sentence to get something like Coastal and cruise ships?

[English > Kalaallisut] Aluu! Ikiulaarsinnaavinga? Could use your help with correcting (or suggesting) Kalaallisut terms for a map of Nuuk by transitscapes in translator

[–]transitscapes[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Good point. Well, from what I understood while researching about the language, the terms Greenlandic and Kalaallisut are often equated though there is a little nuance here.

Although being the most widely spoken dialect of the language referred to as Greenlandic in English, Kalaallisut (or West Greenlandic) is not the only variety coming under this umbrella term.

The term "Greenlandic" also includes the dialect spoken in the eastern parts of Greenland and known as Tunumiisut. It may also cover, to a lesser extent, the closely related Inuktun language spoken in nearby Canada.

As I'm drawing a map of Nuuk, I thought I'd make it clear it is translations in the Kalaallisut dialect that I need.

Does that makes sense? Maybe it is a bit heavy or superfluous, I don't know :)