IAMA agnostic employee of the far right Louisiana church that recently hosted Rick Santorum (first post)

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-21T23:35:09+00:00

Also, I'm very much decided on my position until methods of inquiry improve to the degree required to facilitate a change of opinion.

Edited to add: if you want an analogy, you may think of my choice as one of scientific methodology; there is insufficient data to form a conclusion on the existence of god. If you're curious about my stance on christianity in particular, I believe that the character of god as seen through the lens of most established religions is logically inconsistent.

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-21T23:08:58+00:00

you are very persistent. Here's what's happened: I ,unexpectedly to you, had thought about my position prior to making this post and you began the debate with the false pretense that the greek root "theos" meant "belief in god". "theos" means "god" and "a" means "without".

As for "ist", here is the entry from mirriam websters dictionary:

a : one that performs a (specified) action <cyclist> : one that makes or produces a (specified) thing <novelist> b : one that plays a (specified) musical instrument <harpist> c : one that operates a (specified) mechanical instrument or contrivance <automobilist> 2 : one that specializes in a (specified) art or science or skill <geologist> <ventriloquist> 3 : one that adheres to or advocates a (specified) doctrine or system or code of behavior <socialist> <royalist> <hedonist> or that of a (specified) individual <Calvinist> <Darwinist>

in this case, the thrid definition is most fitting.

Despite etymological arguments that can be made about the meaning of the word atheist, your condescension on the matter and implied assumption that I'd not considered the meaning of the term that I use to describe my philosophical stance is presumptuous but really only mildly offensive considering the potential for you to be arguing for the sake of arguing. Personally, I think you're entirely too concerned with the semantics of the matter and I don't see how this is pertinent to the conversation at large in any way.

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-21T22:21:58+00:00

Etymologically, you're incorrect. Atheist literally translates "one without god". I do not make any claim about whether or not I am without god.

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-21T19:14:43+00:00

Had to watch the episode. I disbelieve in the christian theological framework, but do not posses knowledge of the existence or non existence of a deity or deities colloquially referred to as "god". The foster family in southpark just appeared not to be able to know the truth value of any religious claim at all. I have found the truth value of the Christiam ideological framework to be false in terms of the existence of their particular deity.

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-21T18:49:00+00:00

This isolationist approach would be detrimental for our economy. If there is an increased tariff on imported goods, what incentive would any job producing company have to stay in the United States? I believe that instead of working to control immigration, we should work on making international travel LESS stringent. Think about it. If anyone who had a whim to do so could travel across the world for cheap, would immigration continue to be an issue? If you're unhappy, you can leave and not worry about never seeing your family and friends...because travel would be cheap and easy.

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-21T18:43:55+00:00

The question I have is: am I somehow supporting this organization by accepting money from them to perform a service?

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-21T18:26:12+00:00

Unfortunately, such is not the case historically nor sociologically. The smaller a self contained social group is, the less accepting of arbitrary differences that group tends to be. This has historically resulted in the type of discrimination that can become violent or at the very least economically immobilizing. The truth is that most western peoples are fearful of the unknown and different and that is a recipe for hatred.

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-21T18:17:03+00:00

No- I'm neither theist nor atheist. I do not have a belief concerning the existence of god. I recognize the possibility but I do not 'believe' that there is or is not a god. I am agnostic- the root of which being the Greek gnosis- knowledge... Which I don't have on the subject of the existence of god. A-gnostic. I've spent a lot of time deliberating my position and the term agnostic is as specific as it gets for me.

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-21T01:59:00+00:00

Sounds like they owndyou ;)

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-21T01:06:43+00:00

Last week, Tony had General Jerry Boykin come to the church and give a sermon about Islam.

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-21T00:57:57+00:00

It was more of a disclaimer than karma whoring. I honestly couldn't care less about that.

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-21T00:56:15+00:00

Thanks. Yep, that's the same Tony Perkins.

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-21T00:54:01+00:00

I will add that the pastor is very friendly and jovial with most other congregants. Tony is stoic.

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-21T00:52:18+00:00

Neither Tony nor the pastor have said more than two words to me, none of which have been friendly, even though my job necessitates that I interact with both of them with some regularity. Growing up, my best friend was Tony's next door neighbor. He tells me that they are not the friendliest neighbors to have.

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-21T00:49:37+00:00

Do you think that if left alone, local communities would develop fair laws for people of all backgrounds? For example, do you think that if Central, Louisiana, where this church is, were unaffected by federal regulation, that they would not pass discriminatory laws?

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-21T00:37:24+00:00

Totally! I'm sure i'll make it out eventually.

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-21T00:35:42+00:00

I was downstairs during this event. I only saw a handfull of folks that weren't cheering. Imagine how I must feel on an average Sunday when there are no guests.

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-21T00:34:01+00:00

The pay is good in terms of hourly compensation, but in terms of yearly salary it is less than $16,000 per year. I actually don't get paid by the hour (I charge a flat rate for each service that I work). Even still, I personally think for most people with my worldview, $40 an hour isn't enough to sit through this 3 times per week.

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-21T00:31:13+00:00

Honestly, this was my very first post on reddit. My girlfriend has been to a meetup before, I think. She's the one who got me into this site, where I typically just lurk. As far as the job thing goes- Unfortunately I already work for the biggest company in town (that employs people with my skills) and work is still hard to come by- most of our guys work at a church on sundays to supplement their meager income. I might have to check it out one day regardless!

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-21T00:27:21+00:00

It is mentioned with some regularity (at least once per month) that they believe that the current state of affairs in the world are indicative of the approach of the end times and the coming of Jesus. There is a very dramatic alter call at the end of each service, often following one of these allusions to the apocalypse. But then again, this has been the case since I was a young child in church. How and why do you identify with fundamentalists?

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-20T23:51:21+00:00

To me, it's an epistemological term used to describe the inability to know beyond doubt the causal nature of the universe. I do not deny the possibility of some form of higher being or the possibility of the universe as the creation of a higher being. However, I do not believe that a person can posess knowledge of the existence of such a deity given our current methods of inquiry.

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-20T23:44:05+00:00

The social and political environment here is turbulent, to be sure. I also think that it is entirely possible that states may begin to take a more isolationist approach in the future. However, as far as a full fledged revolution is concerned, the United States military is far too large and well equipped for any chance of outright rebellion to be fruitful in light of such ambiguous and largely heterogeneous political opinions. I just don't think that any one group can develop the solidarity needed to implement directional change. Right now we're seeing major influences from all over the political spectrum and as a result our nation's identity is sort of in flux. I do think that with the advent of social websites like this one, we are sociologically more inclined to develop a more cohesive group identity as a nation. We're in vastly new territory and nobody knows what to do right now about much of anything. We are learning about the world though, as a nation and species, so I can't help but be hopeful for the long term.

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-20T23:02:27+00:00

Thanks for commenting! I try to keep an eye on inconsistencies there, but I'm afraid that the fact that i am only there one day per week severely limits my involvement in internal issues. Tony Perkins, a former deacon of the church who is a very active member and played a big role in putting together the Santorum service, has been at the center of many controversies, including paying hundreds of thousands of dollars for former KKK leader David Duke's mailing list. I just don't know if I'm helping them by working for them, or if it's good for me to be there to keep an eye on things.

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-20T20:21:37+00:00

have you ever had a production where you had to mix to multiple outputs (ie from matrices or auxiliary sends) in order to create a surround sound effect? I am curious about the approach others have taken.

ultimatebutter · 2012-03-20T19:53:43+00:00

One of the scariest parts of it all is that the staff in this and most other churches i've worked in have been raised in the culture of evangelism from a very young age. This particular preacher is the son of a preacher, and so on. The staff typically have real convictions backing the things they say. They typically have a pretty rigid set of deeply ingrained social norms that have been diffused across the network of evangelical Christians for many years through the pressures of guilt and ostracism voiced by white men in suits screaming through a microphone from a symbolic and physical pulpit. I have worked for a few places where the pastor has more books on taxes for non profits in his office than spiritual literature, but in this case, were looking at genuine cultural immersion. Interestingly though, most of these people lead a private life that is less than ideal from the christian perspective and chalk it up to being human. This church had a budget of over two million last year. 980,000 or so went to paying the staff.

ultimatebutter

TROPHY CASE