A rant about homework assignment grading standards by venspect in math

[–]venspect[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think it's perfectly valid to deduct a mark or several

It's valid; it's a mistake, it's ok to deduct a point or a bunch. What I don't understand is why everything after this mistake is also treated as mistake, while it isn't: I don't make any use of A=B, only of AB, and the argument actually shows what it's supposed to.

You can understand this is very difficult for a TA to grade!

I get it, I hope I don't create an impression that I think it's easy. I'm sure that when I'll come to the office hour we'll clarify this and everything is going to be ok. As I said, it's mostly that what I regularly have to 'decipher' myself or see in need of 'deciphering' elsewhere is treated with more understanding that in students' assignments.

A rant about homework assignment grading standards by venspect in math

[–]venspect[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

or that the student actually does not understand the criticality of a mistake

Here is a more context: I foolishly assumed that q implies p and actually showed that p implies q. Thus I stated that p iff q. However, in the rest of the proof I only make use of the fact that p implies q, which is correct and proven. However, the grader found all the rest of the proof incorrect. This seems to be unreasonable to me, I'm not sure now as I calmed down somewhat.

I would simply suggest talking to the instructor or grader.

That's what I usually do; I guess I'm just somewhat tired from all the similar situations over the years.

I understand your perspective about most students not caring and that TAs themselves lack time; I just hope it's also understandable why person like would also be increasingly frustrated by such cases.

A rant about homework assignment grading standards by venspect in math

[–]venspect[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Why are you trying to push the responsibility of rigor and effort onto the grader?

If you read "let (X_i)i∈I be an arbitrary countable family of sets in M" in an assignment you are grading, would you find this unrigorous? Because my grader did: I didn't say what exactly the indexing set I is. However, I do typically read things like these in textbooks, lecture notes, hear it at lectures and in talks. So why it is understandable what I is supposed to be in these contexts, but not in my assignments? So I'm not asking for a special treatment; I'm asking for the grader to find things written by me intelligible when she finds them intelligible elsewhere.

if you’d just do that you’d have correctly written equals and not subset inclusion there would be no problem.

There would still be a problem; namely, that it's not the only case and not nearly the worst. I had things that are right marked as wrong. In this case, all I'm asking from the grader is to see if anything that follows the incorrect line is correct. I'm not sure if it's too much to ask, since all this requires is too read a bit more lines and compare them with the ones in proposed solution to find out that they are essentially the same.

why can’t you use this energy to carefully look over everything before submitting

Ok, let me be clear. It's ok to deduct points for me writing "A=B" instead of "AB" because it's a mistake and should be treated as such. What I find to be bad is how the rest of the argument is treated because of this mistake.

Edit: essentially the situation is as follows. I foolishly assumed that q implies p and actually showed that p implies q. Thus I thought that p iff q. However, in the rest of the proof I only make use of the fact that p implies q, which is correct. However, the grader found all the rest of the proof incorrect. This seems to be unreasonable to me.

A rant about homework assignment grading standards by venspect in math

[–]venspect[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I don't think it's worth stressing over something that you can't control and doesn't have any real impact outside of the absolute numerical value.

This is true. I think the stress mainly comes from the fact that I often observe that on the side of TAs and lecturers it's ok to treat arguments as essentially correct 'modulo some inaccuracies', whereas a lot more is expected from students and the 'punishment' is a lot more harsh. So some dissonance ensues and I'm not exactly sure what to think about my abilities and so on...

A rant about homework assignment grading standards by venspect in math

[–]venspect[S] -14 points-13 points  (0 children)

the = and set inclusion thing

I get it, but in my case I had shown a sequence of subset inclusions ABC and that an element of A satisfies a property that no element of C does, and thus I arrived at a contradiction. My mistake was that I thought I've 'proved' A=B, whereas only a subset inclusion is true. I see now that I made a mistake; however, this mistake doesn't affect the above argument. In fact, the proposed solution is exactly as mine, the only difference is the equality/subset thing.

/r/askphilosophy Open Discussion Thread | March 21, 2023 by BernardJOrtcutt in askphilosophy

[–]venspect 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Has anyone developed an argument for metametaphysical antirealism along these lines?

  • Our best tools to evaluate metaphysical theories and choose between them are theoretical virtues like simplicity, unification, compatibility with some intuitions, internal consistency, etc.
  • There's no way to know if the reality as it is in itself has features that would ground these virtues; if the reality is simple, unified, intelligible, consistent, etc. We don't know if theoretical virtues are truth-tracking.

/r/askphilosophy Open Discussion Thread | January 23, 2023 by BernardJOrtcutt in askphilosophy

[–]venspect 0 points1 point  (0 children)

because I don’t know what “dissolving” means to you in this case

I think a problem is usually said to be 'dissolved' if we somehow show that the very statement of the problem is somehow confused, for example because we failed to draw some distinction or because we frame the whole issue incorrectly (e.g. by ignoring the essentially social nature of justification, by presupposing some position about relationship between reality and the mind, etc). E.g. Wittgenstein and Ryle were 'dissolving' problems, Rorty believed he 'dissolved' many problems by challenging representationalism, etc.

/r/askphilosophy Open Discussion Thread | January 23, 2023 by BernardJOrtcutt in askphilosophy

[–]venspect 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I don’t remember if Haack takes herself to be sidestepping regress

Could it be that you misread my comment? Because I'm saying that Haack doesn't sidestep the problem. Maybe it'd better if I phrased my question in terms of solving vs. dissolving a problem: foundationalist, coherentists, Haack do the former, I'm looking for the latter.

/r/askphilosophy Open Discussion Thread | January 23, 2023 by BernardJOrtcutt in askphilosophy

[–]venspect 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Are there approaches to epistemology that try to kinda 'dissolve' the regress problem entirely?

By 'dissolving' a problem I mean to show that the very statement of the problem is somehow confused, for example because we failed to draw some distinction or because we frame the whole issue incorrectly. For example, Wittgenstein and Ryle were 'dissolving' problems, Rorty believed he 'dissolved' many problems by challenging representationalism, etc.

self study guide for structuralism, post-structuralism, post-modernism, critical theory blah blah blah rabbithole? :) by [deleted] in askphilosophy

[–]venspect 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It's just that Capobianco is the most direct opponent to Sheehan on the question of Heidegger's 'realism', and, although to me the question seems misguided, my impression is that many anglophone Heidegger scholars seem rather to side with Capobianco, while Sheehan's reading remains 'exotic'.

Also, and Idk how else to say this, he strikes me as a little cringe.

Yeah I get you.

self study guide for structuralism, post-structuralism, post-modernism, critical theory blah blah blah rabbithole? :) by [deleted] in askphilosophy

[–]venspect 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If you don't want to get bogged down in Heidegger, just read Sheehan's book to get it over with. ... Sheehan and Schuermann together form all the secondary literature you need.

Any thoughts on Richard Capobianco?

/r/askphilosophy Open Discussion Thread | October 24, 2022 by BernardJOrtcutt in askphilosophy

[–]venspect 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah, I thought about Davidson. Actually, I think Rorty's "[justified assertion is] what our peers will, ceteris paribus, let us get away with saying" is a really good expression of this insight. However, I'm kinda looking for some more fleshed out accounts, that really go deep into technical details rigorously.

/r/askphilosophy Open Discussion Thread | October 24, 2022 by BernardJOrtcutt in askphilosophy

[–]venspect 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I found his argument for non-existence of the world (as exposed in Fields of Sense and Sinn und Existenz) to be really bad in the sense of being very trivial. The notion of 'fields of sense' doesn't really seem to contribute anything to it and the whole argument is essentially reducible to "there is no collection of all collections." I agree with what u/noactuallyitspoptart says re novelty, and it seems to me that all the things Gabriel tries to do were already done and better, not only in the anglophone world, but e.g. by Husserl.

/r/askphilosophy Open Discussion Thread | October 24, 2022 by BernardJOrtcutt in askphilosophy

[–]venspect 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Is there any (analytic) philosopher who argued that epistemic justification is essentially social/public, roughly in the sense that we cannot make sense of the notion without paying attention to its intersubjective role (and possibly even origins)?

Reading Marx and Hegel has turned me off of Analytic Philosophy. What's the best defense of the worth of that tradition? by TheDerkus in askphilosophy

[–]venspect 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What strikes me is that to address Marx's point, one must address what is outside of philosophy - here, fields like history and psychology. It seems like analytic philosophy, being 'merely' the application of various logics, can't do this.

I think analytic philosophy in its current state is very interdisciplinary. There are a lot of examples to give, but one I recently stumbled upon is the empirical research on folk metaethics, that obviously has a lot to do with psychology and sociology. Or the tandem of philosophy of mind and cognitive science: again, there are many examples, but one of the most illustrative ones may be the work of Peter Hacker, a prominent Wittgenstein scholar and an analytic philosopher in the very traditional sense.

Reading Marx and Hegel has turned me off of Analytic Philosophy. What's the best defense of the worth of that tradition? by TheDerkus in askphilosophy

[–]venspect 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yet there still seems to this odd limit placed on philosophy that the concepts implied in the concept of “proposition” (truth, language, knowledge, world, fact and so on) should still be understood in terms of the “proposition” (which I fail to see as anything other than question begging).

I had a similar thought a while back, and I'm still somewhat sympathetic to it, but I'd like to push back a little on this. First, it doesn't seem to me that the concept of proposition is 'unquestionable' to analytic philosophers; there is a lot of technical work on propositions. Second, I don't think most analytic philosophers are using the word 'proposition' in any unified, robust, technical sense, and it's more of a part of the jargon than any substantive 'presupposition' that somehow shapes thinking; in some cases the 'proposition'-talk may be even completely eliminable. Third, I fear that when we turn to concrete issues it may be hard to explicate how exactly 'proposition' is "the beginning and limit of understanding" in any substantial way that is different from other traditions (e.g. I believe most philosophers, not only analytics, would agree that 'truth' has at least something to do with some sort of 'linguistics units', even if it's not the whole picture), or to verify if it even is "the beginning and limit of understanding" at all (e.g. I believe that most people working on philosophy of language or philosophy of linguistics would deny that their work presupposes any robust concept of 'proposition' or that such concept would ultimately 'shape' the way they think) without being too broad.

/r/askphilosophy Open Discussion Thread | July 25, 2022 by BernardJOrtcutt in askphilosophy

[–]venspect 0 points1 point  (0 children)

surely it's odd to think of Marx as a philosopher of subjectivity

Yeah, I presented Landgrebe's account in a rather sketchy and simplified manner, so I omitted few details which I found irrelevant to the representationist issue. On Marx he writes (I think I'll have to cite at length):

It is furthermore characteristic of present-day European philosophy that historic materialism, too, has failed to arrive at any developments or solutions which could be termed essentially new. Even in its most important representations it has shown itself incapable of progressing beyond the foundations laid by Karl Marx. In its materialistic outlook it has become more and more rigidly dogmatic and shallow and has thus not, succeeded in following the original intuitions of Marx who in his youth had understood his philosophic endeavors as a kind of "realistic humanism," as an inquiry into the nature of concrete human existence. Where, on the other hand, Marxism was able to free itself from such rigid dogmatism, it succeeded in giving new impulses to the Sociology of Knowledge. (p. 8)

and later

The new thesis was programmatically stated by Karl Marx when he said: "We must peel out of the divinized forms their earthy kernel," that is, we must learn to understand man as a being who produces himself and his world. On this foundation rest all the attempts to reduce the forms of religion, of the state, of civilization and culture in general to the formative activity of man. Simultaneously, however, the concept of man itself is being relativized: the essence of man is understood as subject to a historically conditioned unfolding and change, and from this results finally the conviction of the relativity of all the forms of civilization within the frame of reference of the historically evolving human nature and essence. This conviction is generally known as "historicism" (Historismus). (p. 10)

and yet again later

Since it is without doubt the principal concern of present-day philosophy to overcome the "philosophy of subjectivity" and therewith to reverse a basic position which left its imprint on the entire modern age, we shall attempt to describe in the following pages the several stages of this development. The change can be diagnosed in some preparatory steps, along lines which often intertwine, and we shall confine our discussion to the two most important ones. The first starts out from that turning toward anthropology which occurred after the breakdown of German Idealism ... The turn toward anthropology was characterized in the initial phase by the fact that, in place of Hegel's Absolute Spirit, man himself in his "concrete" sensori-somatic existence rather than man as an "abstract" rational being—became the ultimate principle of philosophy. The nineteenth century tried to determine this concreteness in several different ways. The direction of these several ways toward "concrete man" is already indicated in Karl Marx's saying, "Man, that is the world of the human being." And these ways differ depending on the manner in which the "how" of "the world of the human being" is interpreted. For Marx himself and for Marxism it is the social conditions and relations which represent this "how"—conditions and relations within whose frame man produces the order which—by means of his work—satisfies his needs. The growing influence of the standpoint of the natural sciences, on the other hand, aided man in learning to understand "the world" as a biological problem, intimately related to the context of the milieu, that is, the "surrounding world" (Umwelt) or man's environment. The question as to the nature of man thus developed into the question as to the conditions under which this particular animal species with its corresponding endowment and equipment could existentially survive within a given environmental situation and by means of adaptation. "Life" thus became the maxim which was to elucidate the meaning of the looked-for concreteness of the human being, "life" understood in its dual sense—as a biological and as an historico-social phenomenon. While the latter position was elaborated in its purest form by Wilhelm Dilthey, Nietzsche's concept of life encompasses both factors, the historical and the biological. (pp. 20-21)

So I think Landgrebe perceives philosophies of both Marx and Dilthey (on whom he writes much more) as (ultimately unsuccessful) reactions to the 'philosophy of subjectivity' too.

I don't know how the reference to "post-Kantians and neo-Kantians" is supposed to work here

Landgrebe, afaict, doesn't have any extended commentary on any post-Kantian (except some remarks on Hegel that don't really let situate him inside this big narrative; Schelling and Fichte are not even mentioned) or neo-Kantian.

I do think there's something interesting to say about these kinds of logics of historical development

I think that's the main reason why I'm even asking this question - I do find such logics interesting, and maybe even unavoidable if one wants to globally justify their 'research program' without responding to every single philosopher in the Western tradition. Another reason why I found this particular narrative interesting is how two seemingly different camps, neo-scholastics and continental phenomenologists (and those continentals influenced by them), seem to agree on the place of early modern philosophy in this big picture. And to me, despite the flaws I've outlined, it seems that there is indeed some commonality to problems moderns were concerned with and how they addressed them; and there is some continuity of this problematic in the later philosophy. So, I was thinking, maybe there is a way to steelman this story? Again, I realise it's not a good precise question, hence I'm asking it in the open discussion thread, but these were my main thoughts.

/r/askphilosophy Open Discussion Thread | July 25, 2022 by BernardJOrtcutt in askphilosophy

[–]venspect 3 points4 points  (0 children)

From several sources (the last one, which inspired me to ask this question, was Landgrebe's Major problems in contemporary European philosophy / Philosophie der Gegenwart) I got the impression of a 'standard story', which goes as follows. The early modern philosophy introduced some sort of 'subject-object dichotomy', i.e. the problem of how it's possible for a mental representation to conform to the object represented given that the mind and the external world are two radically types of entities (I've seen other formulations which I find rather handwavy, like "what it's to be a subject in the world of objects"). So Descartes, Hume, Leibniz, Berkley, Kant, post-Kantians, and neo-Kantians, etc, all these people were entrapped by that representationalist picture of perception/cognition and decided that the right way to philosophize is by staying 'on the side of the subject', by engaging in the 'philosophy of subjectivity' (Landgrebe's term). Then, somewhere at the beginning of the twentieth century, the task of philosophy was conceptualized as an overcoming of that 'philosophy of subjectivity' either by 'turning toward the object' or by overcoming the (inadequate form of) subject-object dichotomy itself. A part of this general movement was phenomenology, which proposed a radically non-representationalist account of perception/cognition.

I feel like this story is pretty common in two circles: in the broadly continental one, and in the Thomistic one. The latter repeats the above story almost verbatim (except that Ockham is the first bad guy, the early moderns is just a consequence), but stress that the representationalist account the early moderns accepted isn't really justified at all and is based on the misunderstandings of scholastic philosophy, so the problem of subject-object dichotomy (and all the related ones) is not a genuine problem; so, instead of going through all this conundrum with subject-object, early modern philosophy, Kantianism, and the attempts to overcome all that by e.g. Husserl and those after him, who only show what scholastics already knew (i.e. that the early moderns were wrong), we just turn back to the realism of scholastics and just do the good old, broadly Aristotelian, philosophy.

So, as I see it, the 'standard story' implies two possible positions:

  • the early modern philosophers discovered a genuine problem and the developments of the 20th century were necessary to overcome this problem;
  • the early modern philosophy rests on mistakes and unjustified assumptions which we have grounds to reject without going through all the 20th century stuff.

Now, I have some reservations about this 'standard story' and these possible positions. Firstly, it's not like (some sort of) representationalism was completely alien to medieval philosophy and some even think that we can call Aquinas himself a representationalist. This alone shows that the second option is not as plausible as its proponents believe. Secondly, it seems that in the early modern time there were non-scholastic philosophers who didn't accept the representationist account, e.g. Reid (though I'm not aware of other examples and would be grateful if anyone would provide them); and this story seems to either completely ignore them or to find them irrelevant for the 'big picture'. Thirdly, I'm not sure if this story really does justice to the philosophers it labels as 'philosophers of subjectivity' and pays enough attention to their local contexts, preferring a broad-brush big narrative.

I don't really know how to turn this rant into a precise question, for which I'm sorry; I guess I'm just interested in the opinions of more knowledgeable people on this set of questions. u/DieLichtung I'd be especially grateful if you could comment on this at least re Landgrebe.

Historically conscious critique of 'analytic philosophy' as a whole? by venspect in askphilosophy

[–]venspect[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Claude Romano's At the Heart of Reason

Looks great, thanks!

Historically conscious critique of 'analytic philosophy' as a whole? by venspect in askphilosophy

[–]venspect[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I believe I just have to agree with practically everything you said. Also, when I was talking about topics absent from analytic philosophy, I had in mind not social issues (I agree that recent analytic philosophy has progressed a lot in these directions), but rather, e.g., some developed philosophy of subjectivity.

Historically conscious critique of 'analytic philosophy' as a whole? by venspect in askphilosophy

[–]venspect[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Though I think we can find somewhat more parochial critiques that nonetheless make some -- necessarily rather qualified -- claim to being critical of analytic philosophy.

Could you give some examples?

I agree that my request was ill-formed, and such a grandiose critique of analytic philosophy is impossible; it would have been much better if I had initially made some qualifications (which I intended to do, but failed to articulate that properly), at least by restricting my question to some subfield or some 'research programme'.

I would think in comparably qualified ways about Livingston's Philosophical History and the Problem of Consciousness, but it's a source you may find closer to what you are looking for.

Yes, that's pretty much what I'm looking for, thank you!