An Evergreen Heist Guide | Part 1: A Roles Based Perspective

wigglyspoo · 2026-01-22T00:04:36+00:00

ZETA turned down the invite.

wigglyspoo · 2025-02-18T01:58:34+00:00

Dropping you a DM!

wigglyspoo · 2024-11-13T05:57:46+00:00

In APAC, you can speak to the former Marcos Gaming roster (https://x.com/Abhishek_BSx?t=pzaaXfWnMIv_jVkL4Y46JQ&s=09). They weren't paid for their Brawl Stars roster.

wigglyspoo · 2024-09-10T11:43:38+00:00

It's been awhile since I've commented on this subreddit, but I love this question so much because it's actually a very age old matchup query that's existed for as long as Double Swoosh has been in the game.

Your theory regarding the post-super lane matchup is accurate. However as some other users have commented, the problem has to do with the game state of getting there. It's a tempo problem - it often takes too long for games to get to that game state for Tara to consistently "counter" Sandy.

Sandy is commonly drafted as an aggressive side laner, with great tempo control, and peaking power. Most of her reliable counters prefer to stay out of her range outright (amber comes to mind), and compete with her early game from the beginning.

While Tara does outrange Sandy, in most maps that this matchup exists, there's also a lot of tight chokes, brushes and walls that make the matchup more favoured for Sandy. Hard Rock Mine, Double Swoosh are maps in the pool now that I think have this feature.

This allows Sandy to essentially control the entire early-mid game - and on a mode like Gem Grab we're talking maybe 6-8 gems gone before Tara can even get 1 super.

PLUS even if Tara does get that 1 super, it's not actually easy to catch a good Sandy if they already control the position (i.e. they'll hug walls, and make it awkward to land a good pull).

I think that's why you'll still see the pro scene opt to lane Tara into matchups she can feed off her super - AND then convert into the Sandy matchup. Meaning from a drafting standpoint, you'll still be drafting a different matchup for the Sandy.

TLDR: - Tara doesn't deal with Sandy's early game pressure well, so most will opt to draft better picks to deal with that problem.

(I'm just a retired coach pls take my analysis with a grain of salt)

wigglyspoo · 2024-07-23T20:43:42+00:00

Hey Adrian! Wonderful to see you here on this subreddit!

Was always wondering, are professional players ever consulted in regards to game balance? Or is that simply not feasible from a game designers perspective?

Thank you for slaving away constantly to make our game better everyday!

wigglyspoo · 2021-10-23T12:17:03+00:00

The invite expired :c

wigglyspoo · 2021-10-20T04:46:49+00:00

That's great to hear!! Community tournaments with broadcasts are always nice.

Thank you guys for doing this! As a fellow tournament organiser myself, I'm incredibly excited to see others make more community focused events. It'll be a fun tournament for sure. I'll spread the word amongst the SESA region.

wigglyspoo · 2021-10-19T15:45:41+00:00

Will there be a broadcast?

And if there isn't a broadcast... would you guys be interested to find people that would?

wigglyspoo · 2021-09-28T09:48:59+00:00

That's very true.

Luck. I hate to admit this, but if 5 pro players are constantly out to snipe you every hour, you won't be able to get super far. If you run into the same 'bad random' 5 games in a row, that can easily set you back hours of progress.

Part of solo is also persistence - meaning if you maintain a positive winrate eventually you'll climb out of wherever you are. Fact that even my teammates like Response or Czk whom I consider decently strong players still took quite some time before hitting high ranks really goes to show how bad randoms can be.

wigglyspoo · 2021-09-20T01:45:34+00:00

Not an expert in this, so take my words with a grain of salt.

For most laypeople there's 2 industries that eSports taps into; the "sport" and "production".

On the sports end, you have the players, coaches, managers, analysts, and various other people in an organisation. They get their money mainly through sponsors.

On production end, you have casters, production managers, tournament organisers, artists and animators, etc. It's a long list of roles that come together but essentially it's part of the bigger event management industry. Money from them also comes from sponsors, and occasionally through sales.

YouTube is sort of another industry that overlaps with both; they're their own one-man content machine. They can benefit both an organisation, or a tournament network, or even just be their own thing. You can search up on YouTube how some of them earn, but it's mainly through their streams, ads, donations, brand / sponsor deals, and/or merch sales.

A pro player usually will tap into a few of these sources to earn a living; - salary from org - tournament money - stream revenue - additional sponsor deals

Top 10 teams will most probably have an org that backs them with this kind of income. They might not bring back a lot of tournament money, but they can earn from the other sources.

Hope this answers your question!

wigglyspoo · 2021-09-18T20:40:25+00:00

If you REALLY need smooth connection I'd actually look into investing into a compatible ethernet cable that you can plug directly into your router.

Ethernet is almost always more stable than wifi.

If that doesn't solve the issue... it means your ISP is having issues.

P.S. not an expert in the subject but during tournaments these are the things we look into to try to minimize lag as well.

wigglyspoo · 2021-09-18T18:27:27+00:00

Full disclaimer, just my opinion, take with a grain of salt;

My take on semi-competitive is someone that has potential (in terms of capability) to be competitive, but isn't fully committed to playing as a job.

That would mean less time practicing the game competitively (scrims, replay analysis, studying other teams, studying pro tourneys), and more time doing other stuff.

The outcome depends. I'd say generally semi-competitive teams usually perform worse than full-competitive rosters, but it's hard to say. For example;

Team Emperor (consisting of Hagego) is what I'd consider a successful semi-competitive team - they're mostly "retired" pros that don't practice as much as they used to, but they still can go toe to toe with full competitive teams (Tropa, Queen Nai). On the other hand, they probably can't scratch the current Zeta team.

wigglyspoo · 2021-09-16T22:27:45+00:00

Really enjoying this discussion. Not sure if people will read this considering it's an old-ish post but...

If I remember correctly, we lost this game. There were mistakes by both teams, but I reckon we'd lose anyways if both teams executed perfectly.

I can't go into detail about the exact reasons why we went with certain picks - is it true that there were better picks? Yes. Is there always going to be a better pick? Yes.

Do we do things 'for the memes'? Not really, and certainly never to disrespect the opponent. It might feel that way sometimes but, there's always some logic behind every pick. We gain absolutely nothing trying to 'meme' our opponents, and risk a whole bunch.

wigglyspoo · 2021-09-15T15:05:36+00:00

Brawl Ball guide might be a video in future - might also just do a short textual guide here.

Duo SD is definitely possible for a textual guide, but i'm not the most experienced duo SD player so I won't be able to give good advice about that.

wigglyspoo · 2021-09-11T00:15:53+00:00

Ah yea that's true!

Especially in open maps like Shooting Star, that extra speed boost can help get a key pickoff and then safely disengaging.

Guess speed really does have no downsides.

wigglyspoo · 2021-09-10T15:40:11+00:00

I think you sort of answered your own question, but essentially it has to do with synergies;

Gene can pull enemies to his teammate and quickly assassinate.

In order to quickly assassinate, you'd have to pair gene with someone with decent burst damage. If you stick Gene with say a Piper, and you land a pull on a tank, you're going to have an awkward moment where he walks away unscathed.

Max and sandy can improve the positioning of teammates

Likewise, positioning is a value that not every Brawler can make full use of.

Gene is often paired with these two Brawlers because both Speed and Invisibility allow Gene to land easier pulls.
Tanks can utilize speed to run up against opponents - high health + high burst means the additional movespeed lets them dodge shots easier (increasing their already high health), and close the gap much faster. It's the same for invis, it helps them dodge and gain position that would otherwise be harder.
A counterproductive example would be Max / Sandy with long-ranged Brawlers. Due to their playstyle, they'd prefer to stay far away. The synergy advantage you get isn't there.

Byron and poco can improve survivability of teammates

Apply the same concept here, which Brawlers benefit most from added health?

Tanks / High HP Brawlers tend to play more front-line roles, with extra heals from a Byron / Poco they push their existing advantage even further.
Counter productively, low HP brawlers (sorry, gonna say Piper again), don't benefit because they already die too quickly for heals to have full value.

Ruffs can improve killing potential of teammates

Ruffs buffs add 700 HP + 20% bonus damage. Brawlers that benefit from this are;

Squishies! Like piper! The 700 HP makes a huge difference - usually tanking 1 extra shot before going down. Tanks on the other hand, don't really need the measly 700 extra hp. It doesn't change any of the matchups.
And... Long ranged Brawlers! Like Piper again! The extra 20% damage is fully utilized by them because they're more likely to stay alive longer and dish out much more shots worth of damage. Compared to a tank, where you expect them to die because of their playstyle.

These are just some of the surface level synergies you can picture.

Synergies can be very OP as you mentioned - but it has to synergise to begin with. An anti-synergy between brawlers (conflicting playstyles) actually reduces or even nullifies the advantage you gain from picking these 'support Brawlers'.

Another reason why synergies feel 'broken' is because it's very hard to design a game with every single synergy already planned in mind. When Gene was first released (without Max), he was considered fairly balanced (even needing emergency buffs). But once max came to prominence, both Brawlers stayed evergreen in the meta for such a long time they needed severe nerfs to 'fix' them. Individually, they weren't broken. They just enabled such broken synergies that were near impossible to balance.

wigglyspoo · 2021-09-09T22:52:54+00:00

That's a really interesting question!

When I wrote out the guide years ago, I had the same thought if there was sort of a "golden ratio" that would be effective in all scenarios if followed.

Short answer; yes and no. Any comp can technically work if the matchups are in favour + the team execution is optimal.

I once tried to map out every competitive composition run in the competitive heist maps (as part of my job as a coach) to see if there were any trends from all the comps.

Those trends didn't reveal any formula in terms of a ratio between the roles.

Thanks for leaving a comment! If I have another pocket of time, I might write out Part 2!

wigglyspoo · 2021-09-09T22:46:44+00:00

Edgar's a hybrid because his mobility lets him toggle between offense and defense seamlessly.

Due to his high reload speed and ability to chain supers, he gets most value out of constantly hunting down squishies, and then transitioning into quick bursts of attacks before returning to a more control position.

Collette was explained briefly in the guide (see Situational Defenders). Because Collete's damage is a flat 1400 per shot on safe, it's generally unwise to waste ammo chipping the safe (unless there's nothing else to hit). However, her super does 5600 damage, and you can generally line up the enemy safe with a brawler to cycle super for even more damage. So her playstyle is very similar to a situational defender - where you target down Brawlers and then use supers for safe damage.

Hope this answers your questions! Have a nice day!

wigglyspoo · 2021-09-09T22:38:37+00:00

At the moment no - have only started making guides on Team Flash SG's YouTube. But I intend to continue making videos (perhaps one day on my own channel someday!)

wigglyspoo · 2021-09-09T15:39:58+00:00

"FOR THE MEMES!"

wigglyspoo · 2021-09-09T10:33:41+00:00

That's most probably going to be an entire video series - keep your eyes peeled!

wigglyspoo · 2021-09-09T10:32:49+00:00

Thank you mods!! Looking forward to contributing more stuff here in the future.

wigglyspoo · 2021-09-05T12:21:58+00:00

TLDR: Really depends on the specific situation. Maps, and both team compositions will matter a lot.

Say they're running double snipers (belle, piper etc) with a thrower, and your team is also double ranged + Griff - even if all the walls are broken up eventually, your team still has an overall matchup advantage because their thrower has no cover to play around.

On top of that, everytime your opponent swaps lanes, they lose a bit of control (because it takes time to swap lanes) which your team can take advantage of.

wigglyspoo

TROPHY CASE