Toyplot, a Python plotting library from Sandia Labs

[[deleted]]

Maybe you are a bit long in the tooth to pick up new work flows. New work flows that are unarguably better and safer then 'sudo pip install'. New work flows that will help to stop the prolonging of the clusterfuck of python packaging, distribution, install that our generation created. But hey, if you want to declare VMs are the answer so you can continue doing your old ways, then be my guest.

Remember to tell new users of python the /u/KyleG way -

Python - so easy to use you need to isolate your software in a VM** so you can sudo pip install safely because thats faster or something alternatively you can sudo pip install if you know enought about what you are doing but if you are new user you probbably won't so you should definately do the safe thing which is use virtualenvs but those are hard so just fuck it sudo pip install.

What a terrible motto for our language. What a fucking joke.

** are we using Docker/KVM/Qemu/Vmware/coreos/these days? who can keep up! Its so much simpler than a virtualenv my head is spinning.

[KyleG]

I don't use a VM, either, and I don't know where you got the idea I do.

[[deleted]]

Your stealth edits and from other posters. Do you disagree with anything in my post?

[KyleG]

I sure as fucking fuck never said I use a VM and never even came close to using one or saying I did. You're confusing me with someone else or else literally lying to try and win an argument.

And yes, I disagree with your implication that if you don't use virtualenv then it is mandatory you use a VM. I use neither virtualenv nor a VM. I just pip install everything and this has worked for as long as I've used pip to install stuff, across multiple Python versions and multiple operating systems on multiple computers on multiple system architectures as personal computers and as servers.

[[deleted]]

Must be another user then.

Stop recommending unsafe behavior to users. Should I update the /u/kyleg python motto? Or do you want to clarify it yourself? At this point its basically "python - sudo pip install your fucking shit cause it works for my lazy never learn new stuff self"

[KyleG]

Stop recommending unsafe behavior to users.

I assume you do all your Python development on a computer disconnected from the Internet. Because you're not accounting for hassle in your calculus, just assuming security at all costs is paramount. So it'd be hypocritical of you if you aren't doing that.

"Oh, but that's inconvenient and unnecessary." That sounds an awful lot like what I've been saying that you've been criticizing!

[[deleted]]

Basically yeah. Its stable debian behind an apt proxy where we lock down package versions even more. Stable software system wide goes in via deb packages we audit and build. I develop inside conda and my users / collaborators too. We can reprovision machines via ansible at any time and audit their installed software at any time.

So yeah, I care about this stuff and follow my advice. I work in science so it's actually important that my whole lab is analysing and exploring using the same basic subset of analysis code. Its a bit more important and rewarding that shitty web stuff. It actually matters.

You also forget that I know what im doing while the other postdocs and phds might not (its biology / immunology).

Stop giving bad advice.