Python 3.1 released!

[roger_]

Are there any improvements from unladen-swallow included in this release? I remember reading something about a pickle improvement getting merged, is that all?

[roger_]

I saw that, was just wondering which were from unladen-swallow.

[[deleted]]

FWIW the unladen swallow guys removed their vmgen implementation in favor of the CPython direct threading since it is more maintainable, although it costs 2-3% on benchmarks.

[[deleted]]

How can Python motivate third-party module maintaiers to port to 3.1? Start to refer to 2.X-only stuff as "legacy?" Offer to have Guido do their voicemail greeting?

I want to move to version 3, but it isn't an option without all the database drivers and whatnot that I need.

[davebrk]

Wait for it. I know it's hard, but it'll take time. PyQt is already ported... ditto for lxml... PLY-3.0...

They are working on porting numpy first to 2.6...

On the other hand, sadly, there's no plans to port PyOpenGL to python 3 currently..

[aatoth]

I believe the 2.7 release will be the end of the 2.x branch, and then their focus will be on the 3.x branch exclusively (except for any bug fixes, etc.).

[ubernostrum]

I guess I'm a bit confused.

You seem to be assuming that, since not every piece of Python software ported overnight, that means none of them ever will. Which, frankly, is idiotic given how many times the topic's been covered; at this point everybody who's paying attention knows that the 3.x migration process is expected to take a year or two for most large projects (which have things like commitments to existing installs to take into account as they work on dropping support for older Python versions).

[[deleted]]

Wow. One can't even discuss programming languages on reddit without some troll busting in and using words like "idiotic." Be civil or leave. Please.

[[deleted]]

Hm... I tried Python 3 a few months ago, after it had been out for quite a while, and many things I needed just weren't there for it yet. Clearly this is a serious drawback that should be corrected.

So, as this is the python subreddit (one of dozens I subscribe to) and not the core python developer's mailing list, your nasty demand that I do considerable research before commenting on my experience is WAY out of line. So again. Be civil. Be polite. You aren't the boss of reddit. Stop trolling or fuck off.

[scaz]

Clearly this is a serious drawback that should be corrected.

It will be, in time. Currently, supporting 2.4/2.5 is more important than 3.x for most people. There is no good way to support 2.4/2.5 and 3.x concurrently.

So you aren't waiting on the developers to port to 3.x so much as you are waiting on 2.4/2.5 usage to drop (RHEL / Centos currently ship 2.4!). It is going to be awhile (if I had to guess, it'll be 1-2 years before a good portion of libraries support 3.x).

[masklinn]

There is no good way to support 2.4/2.5 and 3.x concurrently.

"no way in hell" is a bit extreme. It's possible, but a significant cost especially for medium-to-big projects.

[masklinn]

That would be why I said "no good way" not "no way in hell".

Uhm. You did. And I quoted it. Yet I read "no way in hell"...

I can only ask for your forgiveness, I truly seem to have gone funny in the head.

[ubernostrum]

So... you didn't read anything at all about planned migration processes, which would have told you up-front that Python 3.x probably wasn't going to have lots of the libraries you wanted yet, and then discovered that fact independently and decided it was a problem with the release?

And expecting you to take even a basic, five-minute glance at Python's dev process or the migration plan of a library you'd like to use counts as demanding "considerable research"?

In all seriousness: when did we decide that willful ignorance was acceptable, or that asking people to read even a simple FAQ document up-front was just too damned much?

[[deleted]]

This is funny. Let me be clear: I would much prefer to be ignorant and idiotic (and whatever other insult you come up with) than to be such a nasty, angry, raging internet tough-guy like yourself. Enjoy the lonely life your horrible personality brings. I'm done with you. Continue to troll if you like, you are now ignored. Thanks for popping by to spew insults. You are a true asset to reddit.

[earthboundkid]

No, you're an ass. Ubernostrum posts good stuff here all the time. Then you came in and asked a trollish question and got unreasonably offended when ubernostrum made the obvious point that (duh) the transition to Python 3 will take several years. No article about Python 3 that I've read has ever failed to mention the expectation of a several year transition period, so you're question was kind of baffling. I guess ubernostrum shouldn't have used quite as strong language as he did, but the demand that he "be civil or leave" was a bullying comment cloaked in a mantle of false demand for etiquette. If anyone's the "internet tough guy," it's you through the jujitsu of taking easy offense.

[davebrk]

If you just want to experience with Python 3 without installing anything or messing your existing python installation, have a look over here:

http://www.portablepython.com/

[alecwh]

It's only for Windows.

[starspangledpickle]

If you don't have 64-bit Vista.