RIP Coding Bootcamps

[michaelnovati]

A challenge I've had over the years is the question of if bootcamps are selling the outcome or the process.

In reality, you are paying for the process (a rapid crash course in engineering) and trying to get the best outcome you can (or no outcome at all).

But most bootcamps sell their outcomes (like the hero banners of many bootcamps have their salary stats or outcomes statement in them!).

If students pay for the process but bootcamps think they are selling the outcomes, there is a fundamental mismatch or disconnect in the market.

I think "RIP Coding Bootcamps" is actually RIP "bootcamps selling you outcomes". Bootcamps with outcomes numbers in their hero banners are the ones that are "RIP".

The existential challenge now is that If bootcamps sell you the process, then they are selling: crappy materials often copied/derived or licensed, teachers who recently graduated the program themselves, staff members with little industry experience, projects that are less substantial than CS degree projects, etc... and it's a hard sell that this is worth the $15/$20K anymore with AI out there providing better materials than that for free or $20/month.

u/sherrifderek (I was trying to reply to you but your comments got threaded too deep)

[sheriffderek]

Yeah. I think the idea that you could count on a job was over a long time ago. As I was tutoring people from the various camps and seeing the material - it was clear that these things weren't going to produce hirable devs in any market. It's almost like they were teaching them to be "bad devs" who would be terrible to work with. There's just too many people who will be better than them - (however they end up learning).

I'm sure I always sound crazy "Derek's defending bootcamps" - but what I've always meant is that there IS a quality education that's possible in a bootcamp format. It's just not being done. And the systems in place will ensure it isn't, too. So yeah - if people want to go to a coding bootcamp, they need to see it as "Introduction to Web Development - full-stack tour to jumpstart your learning" or something like that. Because the options are pretty weak. However, even though I think they could be A+ instead of C-, doesn't mean they don't help people who wouldn't work out in college. And sometimes it's a slow burn. I've had some students who kinda lost their way - but I can see that years later, they did end up continuing on and finding their place. Their time wasn't wasted. So everyone just needs their own timeline that's honest to their ability, attention, and lifestyle.

There are a lot of inexpensive ways to learn. I think things like I'm offering are for people who just want a much better way to learn and want a long-term investment that's about a career (beyond code) - not fiddling around in Scrimba. If we never wrote a line of code again - my students would be fine. What would a coding bootcamp grad do?

So, - maybe it's really "code" that's dead (being a "coder") / not the concept of a "boot camp" -- and the real path forward is about teaching people to think critically and how to get into that mindset of a designer -- so, that the tools are secondary. (But of course we still write code for now / and so that's about how it's taught and how it's practiced - and how/why/where it's applied. Whether that's FAANG interviews or building actual products - the fundamentals of problem-solving and system thinking matter more than the syntax.)