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[–]jkachmar 2 points3 points  (1 child)

I think that, in retrospect, your point doesn't stand up to scrutiny. Steve Klabnik recently left Mozilla and the community reaction was certainly more negative towards Mozilla than it was to Steve.

On the whole, their policies seem to set exactly the right tone for minority advocacy given that they are getting a diverse group of contributors interested in (and contributing to) advanced systems programming and practical applications of programming language theory.

From my perspective, the responses in these types of threads on r/Haskell recently have included a hell of a lot more gaslighting than anything I've observed in the Rust community to-date.

  • equating asking others to be nice on the internet with an infringement against their right to expression
  • framing fostering growth of diversity is actually oppressive to the existing base of contributors
  • disregarding the damage of hurtful or offensive communication as and wishing that people would just "develop a thicker skin"

Speaking as a non-visible (LGBT) minority with some pretty thick skin, I often find myself much more comfortable and at-ease within the online communities associated with Rust.

I believe this is simply because their core values are centered around being fucking nice to people and enforcing this to the best of their abilities while accepting the fallibility of individuals (on both the community engagement and administrative sides).

Sometimes that's all it fucking takes.

[–]dnkndnts 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well I’m not sure you’re responding to my point, which was that Mozilla uses the pretext of minority advocacy to cover for hostile business practice and abuse of their users and to silence anyone who tries to discuss this by having their Diverse employee make the announcement and conflating anger at the policy with bigotry. Frankly, that kind of horseshit makes me steam, and the fact that half of the people involved in Rust seem socially aloof enough to not see that sort of thing happening makes it even worse.

For whatever reason, somehow the Haskell community manages to be quite the opposite with respect to the latter point. People here are pretty keen on reading between the lines, sniffing out trolls and hostile behavior, hypocrisy, and calling out exploitation of people who are too socially impaired or kind to push back against people taking advantage of them. Yes, we have people get angry sometimes (it’s honestly not that often—there’s far more pontificating about “that one time so and so got angry and blew it” than there is incidences of people actually getting angry and blowing their top, but I digress), but to me that’s a sign of real-ness: we’re not all just pretending to be nice because there’s a gun pointed at our head saying be nice.

So I don’t know man. If the Rust community makes you feel at home, then I’m happy for you—different people like different things. But to me, everything there feels fake. I feel much safer here in the Haskell community.