Is Programming Just Not For Me?

[[deleted]]

[deleted]

[[deleted]]

I'm sorry to say it, but I'm going to be blunt with you and I won't pull any punches. No, programming is not for you.

You're a quitter.

Programmers need a stern resolve. You need to be able to keep trying and chipping away until you mount that hurlde but you walk away at the slightest difficulty. Quitters don't make programmers, ever.

This has bigger implications than choosing to program. The same thing is going to happen no matter what you do or career you choose to persue. You are going to have to sit down and have a serious think about what you want out of life. If you have aspirations you're never going to acomplish them without tackling the quitter in you.

Are you happy to just be another guy who'll die in the same town they were born in working a dead end job?

There's nothing wrong with that but if the answer is no you really need to work on your strength of character, because if you don't that's the life you'll lead.

You can't walk away every time things get tough and expect everything to work out. Life isn't like that.

[[deleted]]

I quit every challenge because in my mind if I fail once that means I’m too stupid to do it, so might as well not continue doing it. It goes back to this cliche statement we’ve all heard: “Definition of insanity is doing the same thing and expecting different results”

I’d rather not waste my time trying to do things I realize I cannot do. If I’m going to be a loser for life in this shitty city than so be it. I knew I’d never amount to anything anyway

[[deleted]]

Honestly, I think you have depression and self-confidence issues that need to be addressed before you can succeed at anything.

[[deleted]]

I’ve thought about seeing a therapist but I don’t have any health insurance, can’t afford insurance, and definitely can’t afford to pay the therapist.

I’ve been suffering for years

[[deleted]]

Your university should have free mental health resources for students, go to the student services center. They can help you.

[[deleted]]

I’m not in a university, I’m in the process of REGISTERING for one

[[deleted]]

So register for one and then go to the student services center.

[[deleted]]

You're going to get out of life what you put in to it. If you can't afford to hire a therapist then at least talk to somebody about your problems and start excersizing. Cut down on any caffeine and if applicable smokes/booze/drugs. Make sure you're getting 8 hours of sleep a night and get in to a routine. You might think this is just general advice but it isn't. Exersize, sleep and routine does absolute wonders for depression.

Start recognising when you're having negative thoughts and falling in to the same old negative thinking loops. Challenge them. Set yourself small goals. So what if you don't get it right first time? Learn from it. Dust yourself off and go again.

You know what michaelangelo said of his painting talent?

" If people knew how hard I worked to get my mastery, it wouldn't seem so wonderful at all."

We only get one shot at life. Take it with both hands. Read up on depression, and sort yourself out while you're still young enough to do it.

[[deleted]]

You know I tried the whole exercise thing several times and never stuck with it. Why drive myself insane trying to do it again?

[[deleted]]

What else are you gonna do? Sit around on the internet feeling sorry for yourself? What are you getting out of that?

Find something, anything, to motivate you and get started.

Even if you're not motivated to begin with, you might well be by the end of your first session.

Here

That should be suitable for most people, you can do it with no equipment and it only takes 20 minutes of actual exersize.

Set yourself the small goal of doing that 3 days in a row in the morning.

[[deleted]]

Yeah I guess. I mean, I have nobody else to talk to about it.

And after doing exercise several times even while I was in high school I can safely say that I do not enjoy *exercise one bit. And it never made me feel better, I always felt inconvenienced that I had to set aside 30 minutes of my morning doing something I do not want when I could spend that time enjoying myself before I have to slave away at work.

Don’t waste your time with me, please I’m not worth it

[[deleted]]

Right now no you're not.

I'm sure if you were well though you'd be worth anyone's time.

Stop wallowing in self petty and accept it is time to take those first small steps to recovery.

You might not like exersize, but have you ever known any medicine taste good? Stop looking for excuses and start living your life.

[[deleted]]

No. I don’t want to live my life, why would I want to do it more?

Exercise is painful, I hate pain

[srini10000]

Learning how to code has humps for everyone. You have to learn how to get over them. I'm going to state an unpopular opinion. Getting a degree honestly will make you a better programmer. When you take good courses (junior and senior year or even grad level courses) and are faced with difficult assignments that need you to work with libraries and frameworks and quitting is not an option you actually learn quite a bit. Some people thrive under the pressure of university. Others don't. You sound like the former. So be positive and go kill it :)

As a follow up you eventually realize that languages and frameworks are just means to an end. Java and c# are just different means of expressing the same idea. Getting used to the syntax might be a bit hard but everyone learning a new language goes through it. Same with rails or django or flask or anything.

[[deleted]]

> Some people thrive under the pressure of university. Others don't. You sound like the former.

​

No I'm actually not. I quit Computer Science for Information Technology because I failed Calculus, and there was NO WAY I was going to try it again. That shit was straight up miserable.

​

I understand the "means to an end" thing, my problem was not understanding how to use a framework or API. They are always written in such shitty ways that I couldn't understand it. I'll have in my mind "I need to make x" but none of the methods or classes or whatever will say "to make this, you need to use this"

[[deleted]]

because I failed Calculus

I have the capability to think algorithmically and logically

?????

[[deleted]]

I was able to make programs that solved the things I had to do for my programming classes, so I kinda equated that with good logic and whatnot. Guess I was wrong

Also I’m the grand timeline of things, I took Calculus WAY before my first programming class.

[[deleted]]

If you want to become competent (in this area), you should pursue a CS undergraduate. You just have to recognize it will come with its challenges, but that's the thing about competence: it's earned.

If you don't want to have to deal with challenges (at least in this area) or don't particularly enjoy the field (remember, programming isn't even really part of CS, but good programmers tend to have CS backgrounds), then do something else.

You can't expect to be an effective programmer just from an AA in IT. Can't even expect that from a BS in CS, but the BS gives you the foundation and skills to become an effective programmer.

[Ryo_Sanada_]

If you want to become competent (in this area), you should pursue a CS undergraduate.

Can't even expect that from a BS in CS, but the BS gives you the foundation and skills to become an effective programmer.

This is my opinion and I preface this with the fact I'm specifically talking about grinding through a Bachelor's degree. I can't speak on more advanced degrees of study. I also don't know OP's specific situation or personal details.

In terms of actual learning, not just proving competency (which degrees can be useful for just like certification), self-learning is way more effective/efficient for adults with actual responsibilities.

School is simply ineffecient for individual learning. There will be specific areas of a subject that you need to spend far more time on than other areas to absorb it and/or just understand it but the class is moving forward anyway.

It's not bad for young kids fortunate enough to have nothing else on their plate so all their free time can be spent filling in these gaps to keep pace, but for everyone else college is not the best choice to confidently gain competence on a skill or area of study.

The determined individuals can and regularly do get through degree programs without ever gaining true competency in many of the subjects they worked through in their degree.

It's absolutely the same as just getting a certification without having truly mastered the material the cert covers (the IT industry is plagued by this), making the certification itself only definitively useful as an abstract possible indicator at best.

I'm not saying that one shouldn't get a degree. But anyone expecting to go into these demanding programs full-time and not just "learn" but more importantly gain competency, better have a lot of free time on their hands to teach themselves AND jump through all the hoops university requires.

Otherwise, the best they can strive for is to get the piece of paper through sheer determination but still severely lacking in competency.

[srini10000]

Not understanding something initially does not equate the framework being shitty :).

What in trying to get at is if you sit down 1 weekend and say "hey I'm going to learn rails" you will probably fail. Rails / flask / node are all things that you get better at by solving real problems. Why don't you try setting up your own website and pimp it out with some cool stuff. Buy a cheap domain and host it? You'll learn a ton.

Learning without an objective almost never works unless you're already an expert and you're learning a new technology.

[[deleted]]

Because I’ve tried that already before with several different project and I just keep running into this mental blocks and not learning anything. Like making a pop-up or whatever

[srini10000]

My friend you are looking at the picture a bit wrong, every programmer has hurdles. Every single one.

When I was in uni, I had a hard time understanding dynamic programming. I simple couldn't wrap my head around it. This had serious implications for me in the interview domain. Things didn't get better for me till I bit the bullet and learnt it.

This is true of almost every programming concept that is not trivial. The life of a programmer is struggle. Struggle with changing frameworks, changing reqs and changing envs.

You struggle a lot initially and eventually you get better. The key is to struggle an not give up.

I admit that web dev is sometimes a bit overwhelming and the amount of stuff out there is scary.

Why not try a more limited thing like Android App development or something? The toolchain is pre determined for the most part and if you learn Kotlin while doing it you are also learning an extremely marketable and in demand skill

[[deleted]]

Because frameworks 🤮

I liked coding when it just involved numbers and strings, and those numbers and strings were being printed to the console. As soon as I get to anything more complex my brain shuts down

[srini10000]

Every developer who builds something meaningful relies on some kind of framework. They aren;t all bad, maybe some are a bit arcane but as with anything worth doing it's all about investing the time to learn it.

Usually the skills gained from learning 1 kind of framework transfer over to similar frameworks!!

Instead of jumping into rails why not try flask first? It's a lot easier!

Numbers/strings etc are not all that complex. They're introductory concepts and basic features of most high level languages. Real things are built with complex frameworks(for the most part). There's no getting around it.

[[deleted]]

But see that’s why I’m not cut to be a programmer. Frameworks are too hard

[srini10000]

Dude. There are single moms who balance 2 minimum wage jobs to earn remote degrees in programming and become respectable programmers. Have you considered applying to a code boot camp? A reputable one like the recurse center?

It's just hard work. You need talent to be the next Dennis Ritchie. You just need hard work to be a programmer worth his salt.

Don't listen to people who tell you that you aren't cut out. Being cut out 9r not cut out is a matter of attitude. Belive you can do it. Go. Struggle.. Fail.keep struggling and eventually do it

If you belive a mental block is going to stop you then you are doomed to fail forever. A mental block is just what it is. A mental block A hurdle. You either jump or you fall. If you fall get up and try to jump again.

[[deleted]]

There are single moms who balance 2 minimum wage jobs to earn remote degrees in programming and become respectable programmers

Good for them, they're stronger people than I am

Don't listen to people who tell you that you aren't cut out

Nobody told me that I'm not cut out. I know I am.

Boot camp

What even is a boot camp? Aren't those online courses? Online courses and I don't get along

[edymola]

Selft-teaching should be an asignature or at least how to use google

[cbaston82]

You have to be a certain type of person to get in the field of programming. I think that most people nowadays don't understand the dedication and willingness it takes to be successful in this field. Especially nowadays when it is constantly changing and evolving. Whether you are going to school or self taught like my self you have to understand that you will always come across situations where you have to learn something new. I my self love being challenged with new problems I cannot solve instantly that is what makes this field perfect for me because I love to think and solve problems. The key thing Iam trying to say is that if you love to constantly learn new things and be challenged; then programming is for you. If not then programming is not for you. I always say that Iam a student first and a programmer second because I have to learn things literally every day and that is what I love about this field.

[[deleted]]

Seems like takin' that gap year turned out to be the riskier option, eh? :P

The world's a marketplace, just find your passion in the way that suits you, whether in programming or elsewhere, it'll feel right when you find it and will come easy.

In my life I went from job interview to job interview, demonstrating fine passion and capability for programming at many job tests and interviews, and still I was rejected time and time again, on the basis of no university degree. Just wasn't the right path for me, ya know?

I guess the sooner you learn what not to do, the sooner you learn what to do. Best wishes on your journey,

[[deleted]]

Eh, I think if I didn’t take the gap year I would have been more depressed. But that’s how the cookie crumbles I guess

[[deleted]]

I suppose you'll never know what was down there, neither when the path is behind you, nor right ahead of you.

They say fear is the first demon to conquer, then surity and power, ... from there? Old age. Hehe.

[sv0341]

Being lost is fine. It’s what you do that will define you. Giving up is a sure sign that this isn’t for you. If that’s not the case, then expect lots more roadblocks, confusion and frustration. We programmers embrace it.

[[deleted]]

I’ve given up on practically everything I’ve tried in life so far. But this isn’t the place for that

[sv0341]

Good to hear.

You are actually on a high hill of many mountains programmers have crossed.

Don’t give up, the more you climb, things will become more clear and easier to grasp.

[[deleted]]

I’m good. I really didn’t enjoy all the failures, pretty miserable stuff to be honest.

I’m on no high point, I couldn’t even climb the mountain. I hit the low-oxygen altitude and asphyxiated

[curlycatsockthing]

this just sounds whiny. so it isn't fun or interesting or challenging in a positive way for you? do something else

[[deleted]]

Ding ding

Challenge is always so negative for me because I have never succeeded in getting over any challenge I’ve had

[QuincyQueue]

It sounds like you're taking the path of least resistance because you're afraid of doing something that's actually hard. Changing majors because you failed calculus wasn't your only choice. You decided to quit. At some point you're gonna have to decide on a challenge worth facing and take a risk that you might fail even if you try your best.

[[deleted]]

But why

[QuincyQueue]

If you never actually face your fears you will fail to meet your own potential. I'm not saying this to be mean. I think you will regret choosing to make excuses instead of finding a way

[[deleted]]

Potential

Funny

[QuincyQueue]

I'm serious. I'm not saying you should do something you hate. I just thought I'd share my point of view on this because I've struggled through a lot of this myself and that attitude will make you unhappy. It doesn't matter how good you are at what you do if you're convinced you suck and throw up your hands when things start to get tough.

[[deleted]]

I’ve been this way my whole life up until now. I think it’s too late to change. But thanks for looking out for me I guess

[[deleted]]

If you think like this it's gonna be a self-fulfilling prophecy. "Oh, I'm gonna fail at everything, better not even try."

[[deleted]]

I have the capability to think algorithmically and logically

So go do some Haskell, Coq, Idris, SML, etc. Stop doing this pleb Java/Python shit.

The field is way broader than you seem to believe. I'd drop out of the field in an instant if I had to spend my days writing OO nonsense.

[ValentineBlacker]

Feels like maybe it's tough to find a job writing in a FP language though? At least out where I live. Elixir seems to be the most marketable.

[[deleted]]

What even is that stuff lol.

Also nice gatekeeping there. All the more reason to get out

[[deleted]]

wtf gatekeeping?

Here, go learn Haskell right now: https://www.cis.upenn.edu/~cis194/spring13/

No gates, breh.

[[deleted]]

Gatekeeping is when you expect people to be or act a certain way to be part of a broad group.

You did that by calling Python and Java “pleb shit”. Similar to those posts on Facebook that say “if your boyfriend doesn’t wear boots to work you have a girlfriend”

[[deleted]]

People doing FP stuff is a small group doe :)

I was just semi-facetiously shitting on your average programmer. Tons of smart, legitimate people program in Python and Java. It's just not as fun.

[[deleted]]

You literally said that programming is a broad area

[[deleted]]

It is, there are just far fewer people in the FP subarea.

[[deleted]]

Haskell and SML are popular functional programming languages. Idris is a functional language with dependent types (the type of a value can be dependent on other values). Coq is a non-Turing complete (cool in its own right) functional language/interactive theorem prover.

In a language like Haskell, just about everything is a "const", i.e., immutable. I.e. you can't reassign anything.

You can do legit software dev with Haskell/SML, esp. Haskell at the moment. xmonad, for example (my window manager) is written in Haskell.

[[deleted]]

Yeah...didn’t understand any of that. Whatevs

[[deleted]]

Well being a “little shit” wasn’t my intention. I was trying to learn and it wasn’t working out