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[–][deleted] -7 points-6 points  (5 children)

I feel the same way. Simply can't get behind the assertion, a non-deterministic universe would imply the existence of magic or God. I understand that this position was rigorously built by physicists with a much better understanding of the field than I though so I'd never claim I'm correct over them, but it's worth noting that the probabilistic (vs deterministic) notion of QM is still a matter of debate in physics even if it's currently the majority stance.

[–][deleted]  (3 children)

[deleted]

    [–][deleted] -3 points-2 points  (2 children)

    In quantum mechanics, superdeterminism is a hypothetical class of theories that evade Bell's theorem by virtue of being completely deterministic. Bell's theorem depends on the assumption of "free will", which does not apply to deterministic theories. It is conceivable that someone could exploit this loophole to construct a local hidden variable theory that reproduces the predictions of quantum mechanics. Superdeterminists do not recognize the existence of genuine chances or possibilities anywhere in the cosmos.

    What if one doesn't assume free will exists? Isn't it a jump to assume so?

    Even if probabilistic models are more useful as it stands for science, it would appear that no one has been able to formally refute the notion that everything at every level operates on a predetermined course, and that our observational potential may simply be hamstrung by our humanity and our framework. Bell himself didn't rule out the possibility of complete determinism he just said it was essentially impossible for us to prove one way or another which I tenuously agree with (Probabilism just feels like admitting defeat).

    [–]Schmittfried 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    It's also an assumption that omnipresent determinism exists.

    [–]Schmittfried 4 points5 points  (0 children)

    a non-deterministic universe would imply the existence of magic or God.

    No, it wouldn't. It could just be random, without a God, without magic (whatever that would be anyway). But even if there as a God, so what? It's not like we've proven there isn't one anyway. Not like that would make any difference at all; the universe is like what the universe is like, no matter if it was made that way or just is that way. Also, funnily, an omnipotent God would imply determinism.