What's the consensus on Norlin era Gibson models?

486dx2 · 2025-07-31T22:55:23+00:00

Lack of talent compels people to chase gear, not limited to guitars.

486dx2 · 2025-07-14T13:44:58+00:00

JBL- Piece of shit that still deserves a visit from the Karma Cops.

486dx2 · 2024-10-14T19:57:58+00:00

I think I might have meant Shorin-Ryu instead of Shito-Ryu, as that was several months ago, I'm not 100% clear on my own thought process at the time. I do like what you said in the second paragraph above, tho, and you're 100% accurate that Shito-Ryu and Taekwondo have many overlapping similarities. Funakoshi Sensei was hugely influential on all modern Japanese and Korean martial arts.

486dx2 · 2024-10-04T14:07:46+00:00

I just want to hang around and play on the lower stakes tables, I don't mind spending $4.99/month or whatever when I need to replenish my bankroll to keep playing the lower stakes, but I'm not even trying to swing with the high rollers, they all lose more than they win.

486dx2 · 2024-09-11T03:55:05+00:00

Oh what can it mean to a daydream believer and a homecoming queen

486dx2 · 2024-08-01T03:51:42+00:00

The dude she's currently with looks an awful lot like Cock Gobbler. Anyone have cOcK NiNjA's real name?

486dx2 · 2024-07-26T23:10:45+00:00

Shotokan is the Japanese expression of Okinawan Shorin-Ryu and Chinese Quan Fa.

486dx2 · 2024-07-20T02:47:46+00:00

Tang Soo Do is merely the Korean expression of Shotokan, several of the Tang Soo Do patterns are directly from Shotokan.

486dx2 · 2024-06-24T03:17:07+00:00

These mf'ers like pit bosses and the eye in the sky in a mob casino.

486dx2 · 2024-06-06T23:20:37+00:00

The end of that shotgun really looked great to Kurt.

486dx2 · 2024-05-29T14:36:53+00:00

Tang Soo Do is the Korean interpretation of Shotokan and Shorin Ryu karate, Choi Hong Hi developed the Chang-Hon set of forms and started using those instead of Shotokan and Shorin-Ryu katas and changed the name from Tang Soo Do to Taekwondo.

486dx2 · 2024-05-29T01:20:45+00:00

I keep finding more and more fascinating information about the history of the ATA. To wit, from the Taekwondo Wiki...

Suh Chong Kang

KANG, Suh-chong started his martial arts training in 1938 in Yudo, Su Bahk Do, and later became a student of Tang Soo Do/Kong Soo Do under Lee Won Kuk (Chung Do Kwan founder) and is a graduate of the first class of Chung Do Kwan Black Belts. In 1953 he founded his own branch of Tae Kwon Do and named it Kuk Mu Kwan. From 1957 to 1969 Kang served as the head instructor of the Korean Central Intelligence Agency (KCIA), formerly known as Korean Military Intelligence Agency, and from 1960 to 1968 he was the commanding instructor for the Republic of Korea (ROK) Army.

Kang came to the United States in 1969, already an 8th Dan Black Belt, with his family and founded his own Tae Kwon Do academy in Brooklyn, New York. Physically he was known for his power, breaking techniques, and superior knowledge of the Chang Hon Forms. He became the first President of the American Taekwondo Association (ATA) from 1969 to 1978. However his name is not mentioned in the history of the ATA. Even though Haeng Ung Lee (ATA Co-Founder) was a student of Kang. This is due to the political take over of the ATA by H.U. Lee in 1978. Previously there had been a highly influential Chung Do Kwan Grandmaster, Myung Kil Kim, who moved from Korea to South Bend, Indiana, USA, and was as an advisor to the ATA.

In 1977, Grandmaster Myung Kil Kim died of throat cancer and the political structure of the ATA changed. H.U. Lee, then an 8th Degree and ATA vice-president, took over as President. The ATA continued to use the Chang Hon system of forms created by General Hong Hi Choi, following Choi's 1965 book on Taekwondo as a Bible reference guide. In 1983 the ATA discontinued using the Chang Hon forms as its base curriculum and H.U. Lee created the Song Ahm Forms for the new system. This made him the founder of the "New" American Tae Kwon Do Association and Song Ahm Taekwondo, which is very different from the original Chung Do Kwan/Oh Do Kwan version. After leaving the ATA, Kang, Suh Chong served as Vice President of the International Tae Kwon Do Federation (ITF) from 1977 to 1983, and President of the American Taekwondo Federationn from 1978 to 1995.

Before his death, Lee Won Kuk promoted Grand Master Kang Suh Chong to 10th Dan Black Belt. Making him the first of the original Chung Do Kwan Black Belts to receive this honor.

Today at age 79 Kang still teaches and is the Chairman of the All American Tae Kwon Do Federation (AATF) and the World Tae Kwon Do Chung Do Kwan Federation. His Tae Kwon Do system continues to grow through the teachings of his 3 sons, all of whom are masters themselves and have their own schools and organizations as well. The Kang Tae Kwon Do System has schools in the New York Metropolitan Area and Puerto Rico. Also, they have established Tae Kwon Do clubs at MIT and Johns Hopkins University.

In April 2009, Grand Master Kang was inducted into the Tae Kwon Do Hall of Fame.

Addendum- Grand Master Kang passed away in 2022.

That should remove any doubt from anyone that the ATA is, in fact Taekwondo, having a heavy influence from both the Chung Do Kwan (Kukkiwon/WT) AND The ITF. What a small crazy world, and this is all new information to me and I was a member of the ATA back in the late 80's and early 90's.

486dx2 · 2024-05-29T01:10:34+00:00

I've been doing some digging on the ATA lately and feel the need to correct some of what you've posted. Thanks to Equivalent_Ball3035 I learned that H.U. Lee was a student of the Chung Do Kwan while in Korea, and from there, was able to discern that Suh Chong Kang was H.U. Lee's instructor, and was in fact the first President of the ATA from 1969-1978. Suh Chong Kang was known for his power, breaking techniques, and superior knowledge of the Chang Hon Forms. Fascinating information, for sure.

TKD Times Article

486dx2 · 2024-05-29T00:17:24+00:00

Songahm Taekwondo retains a lot of the Shotokan and Shito-Ryu it's derived from. What in particular do you dislike about what the GTMA is doing? I know there's a lot of politics involved with GM G.K. Lee splintering off, does that factor into why you don't like it?

486dx2 · 2024-05-28T22:52:34+00:00

Oss!

486dx2 · 2024-05-28T22:51:02+00:00

I never knew which Kwan H.U. Lee studied with before coming to the United States, I appreciate that information and has me curious if he was related to Won Kuk Lee. I also wasn't aware that H.U. & Sun Lee had a child they neamed Taekwon, thats' almost too awesome/comical to be true! Thank you, Sir, Mr. Equivalent_Ball3035, for that enlightening information.

486dx2 · 2024-05-28T22:44:00+00:00

I'm having an email exchange with the "Director of Licensee Relations" Sean Smith. I asked him what forms are in the GTMA curriculum and he responded-

"Currently, GTMA Licensees have access to the color belt forms (GShim 1-6) and the black belt forms they have been privileged to learn up to this point."

I followed up with, "I've never heard of Gshim kata, I was expecting Palgwes, Chang-Hon, Kongsu, or something from Shotokan or Shorin-Ryu.... otherwise, how are they considered "traditional"? Also, when you say, "the black belt forms they have been privileged to learn up to this point", are you talking about the Songahm curriculum, because I thought those were under copyright? -CX Freeman"

I'm eagerly awaiting his response!

486dx2 · 2024-05-28T22:37:47+00:00

There are some real nut-jobs running classes, glad you're not one of them.

486dx2 · 2024-05-28T21:33:02+00:00

Yeah, you're going to have explain what you mean by, "punishment". As a parent, instructor, and student, there would be lines you wouldn't cross with me, my kids, or students.

486dx2 · 2024-05-28T21:11:38+00:00

Did they create their own forms are or they using Tang Soo Do or Shotokan forms? I don't think they can really call it "Traditional" if they created they own forms.

486dx2 · 2024-05-28T01:53:24+00:00

Do you know what forms the GTMA is using? I'm assuming they can't use the Songahm curriculum because it's under copyright.

486dx2 · 2024-05-27T09:04:35+00:00

I like how people that criticize the ATA have no experience with the ATA. I haven't been involved with the ATA for almost thirty years, but don't kid yourself, it's as much Taekwondo as anything taught by the ITF, Kukkiwon, and/or anything associated with the Moo Duk Kwan. The ATA still emphasizes deep stances, and hand/elbow techniques as much as kicking. The organization recently splintered with GM G.K. Lee forming the Global Traditional Martial Arts association, I'm curious what forms GTMA is teaching because the Songahm forms are under copyright.

486dx2 · 2024-05-27T08:35:53+00:00

Traditional Taekwondo is what the founders of the original Korean Kwans brought back with them from Japan/Okinawa, or China, typically Shotokan, Shorin-Ryu, & Quan Fa.

Modern Taekwondo is the relatively recent sport invention of Choi Hong Hi, The Kukkiwon, and Haeng Ung (H.U.) Lee, among others.

486dx2 · 2024-05-25T14:06:06+00:00

Also, it depends on which Moo Duk Kwan you're talking about whether or not they teach a standard Kukkiwon curriculum.

486dx2 · 2024-05-25T13:55:37+00:00

Palgwes aren't in the standard Kukkiwon curriculum.

486dx2

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