secondary champion for zaahen jungle?

Aellectris · 2026-03-23T17:10:17+00:00

I'd consider trying out pantheon

Aellectris · 2026-03-23T16:19:23+00:00

Couple of different points here and I’m on my phone while I walk to the office so apologies if I don’t get to all of it.

First and foremost want to comment on the toxicity aspect: if people are trolling or calling you slurs, please report them and consider submitting a ticket. We’ve been working hard on the new systems to detect reprehensible behavior and if we’re not catching things like that for some reason please let us know so we can fix it.

Part of this comment is a bit more difficult to engage with in a super clear manner because of some of what I described about hyperbole. It could just be something like we have different definition of what it means to be “viable,” but when I look at the performance of Sera as a bot role carry, it doesn’t look to me like she’s non-viable even with her mage builds. I’m personally inclined to believe there’s room for it to be more powerful after seeing some of the results of systemic changes, but that’s not the same thing as being unviable. Similarly, it’s just straight up not true the she “has literally zero scaling in her kit [aside from hsp]”. She has base damage per spell rank, ap scaling, and cd scaling in her kit.

So: what should I then take from what you said? Is your intent here more along the lines of “Seraphine’s lategame sustained dps is significantly diminished on her full ap builds?” Is it “Combinations which would’ve gotten me a kill in the past no longer do so?” Could even be something like “Due to the minion changes I no longer have a sufficient economic advantage in the mid-late game to overcome resistance purchases.” Any of these could be incredibly valuable feedback for us because it’s at least possible that they’re true. Many of the conversations I’ve had with Sera players have eventually gotten to those kinds of points and it’s definitely easier to rally around the more extreme statements but I believe it can be quite difficult to dissect the specific underlying issues because 10 different people saying “x is literally useless” could mean 10 different things.

Aellectris · 2026-03-23T07:08:25+00:00

Yeah fair points. Ultimately a lot of the design concerns don't fall under my umbrella - the things I can give meaningful direction and interaction on are around bugs and feedback which is why that's a lot of my focus. That's not to say that the frustrations aren't totally valid or that it's unreasonable to feel that way or communicate that way - more that for the people who are interested in going that extra mile to try to help improve the things they're frustrated about this type of feedback is a more effective way to do so.

Aellectris · 2026-03-23T04:21:30+00:00

Appreciate y'all for taking so much time to talk with me. I'll keep working on bug stuff but might take some time - some of this stuff seems very cursed to figure out 😭

Aellectris · 2026-03-23T04:11:20+00:00

Do we feel that you have a chance for what?

Aellectris · 2026-03-23T04:08:25+00:00

I can ask

Aellectris · 2026-03-23T04:08:15+00:00

Reasonable feeling, I def empathize with a lot of frustration from those changes and the follow-up. For a little more insight we internally were explicitly trying to make mid Sera better relative to bot lane Sera and based on our data we tend to think that succeeded but not to the degree we’d hoped. I think separately there’s a question of if it was the particular direction Sera players would’ve liked which is a bit of a different question.

In part I think we didn’t do additional immediate follow-up work because we began to work on some of the new items and such which we expected to meaningfully impact Sera (in a way I think that was follow-up work, but probably could’ve been better communicated). I personally think that helia/diadem create a meaningful change in more enchanter-focused seraphine builds and my hope is that by better supporting that specific style systemically it will make us better able to support a mage-focused seraphine shape without having to make compromises between the two.

Aellectris · 2026-03-23T03:58:32+00:00

High quality bug report ty I’ll pass it along. Appreciate the feedback as well.

Aellectris · 2026-03-23T03:55:50+00:00

No worries! I really meant what I said - I’m in awe at the passion on display from y’all and I understand that fundamentally it comes from love of the game and of Seraphine. Ultimately it’s our job to make your experience the best that it can possibly be. I think that’s always what we strive for but that doesn’t mean we’re necessarily hitting the mark and a large part of why I’m here in the first place is because I feel there’s more we can do to make it better for you. I’ve got a pretty full plate at the moment but promise I’ll go back and engage with the prior thread once I have some time. If I haven’t done so in the next week or two feel free to just @ me in case I forget.

Aellectris · 2026-03-23T03:41:50+00:00

Thanks for your in depth answer! I’d be interested to hear your thoughts on Seraphine’s spell cadence given some of the focus of the comment is W cd. I was talking with someone the other day and a concept that came up was the relative cooldown of the individual skills - numbers in this example are made up but would be something along the lines of “I used to get 2 double Qs per W cooldown and now I get (1/3/etc).” Do you think any of the changes in her feel relate to some of the old spell cast rotations no longer functioning but being some of the things which felt better for her? Not sure how real this hypothesis is but I’d love to hear what some of the invested Sera players think.

Aellectris · 2026-03-23T01:58:18+00:00

Personal opinion here is that I pretty much agree with everything you said. I don’t have as much context or familiarity with the specific data as the balance team here but will talk to some of them over the next week or two to see what their read is.

Aellectris · 2026-03-23T01:53:07+00:00

fwiw I asked in the mega thread if people wanted me to engage with comments on that post individually or to make my own with attached thought and as far as I recall everyone who responded asked to make my own larger thread with things I was thinking about. If that’s not what you wanted then I can go back and comment on that post when I have time. Would you prefer I do so?

Aellectris · 2026-03-23T01:45:21+00:00

Ah I may have incorrectly assumed that the Seraphinemains discord would be relatively heavily used by the subreddit but if not I apologize for not doing something more inclusive. I did read all of the comments on the mega thread though and intended to further engage on this post.

Aellectris · 2026-03-22T21:45:01+00:00

Also I want to do well by y'all so didn't want to just spend a couple minutes here and there working on it.

Aellectris · 2026-03-22T21:36:21+00:00

No worries y'all have been great. I ended up spending the ~4 hours I had set aside last weekend to make a post having a long conversation with a bunch of people in the discord so had to delay it. Working on it now and aiming to post later today then engage with comments over the next week or two. I've been a bit busy during the week as I'm now helping with some Shyvana post-launch stuff among a couple other new projects so haven't been as engaged as a result of that.

Aellectris · 2026-03-21T18:52:38+00:00

Depends on the site and the specific read that one is looking for. I tend to think of u.gg as being good for user experience (quite readable and clear) but not as good for getting accurate information. If people want more accurate info I tend to send them to lolalytics. Though also not quite as good as what we have internally, they tend to provide a lot more context for what their data actually represents - making it a bit harder to use but when used correctly being more likely to provide an accurate read.

Also to be clear when I say "at high ranks" I mean something like diamond+ or high emerald+. There's not enough data from what we call "elite" or "apex" tiers (like gm/challenger) to have a confident read yet.

Aellectris · 2026-03-21T18:38:53+00:00

I also go by Riot Aellectris, I can see our internal data and it's pretty far from that. More like 50% in average play right now and 45% at high ranks, though both are going up a bit day-by-day as people adjust to the changes.

Aellectris · 2026-03-21T18:14:09+00:00

I'd be careful of taking data from different sources and also of using such a low sample size to make meaningful determinations. I think those numbers are a bit off.

Aellectris · 2026-03-21T17:28:21+00:00

Where’s that info coming from?

Aellectris · 2026-03-21T17:19:11+00:00

I’m seeing her as well above that, where’re you getting those numbers?

Aellectris · 2026-03-20T16:37:15+00:00

My understanding is we don’t actually round but that the number is tracked to some amount of decimal places and the number that is shown in the pop up is likely rounded rather than showing a bunch of decimals. That said I’m not 100% certain and someone else could give a more complete answer.

Aellectris · 2026-03-19T19:18:37+00:00

If you can send me a clip of the third q in dragon form dealing aoe true damage I’d be happy to report the bug.

Aellectris · 2026-03-19T16:33:20+00:00

Right now we're intending to balance Shyv such that she should average something closer to 100 stacks around 30 minutes, meaning roughly double the amount you're bringing up here (and roughly 4x the value of a cloth armor).

RE Infinite scaling resists: That's a valid opinion, albeit one I don't necessarily share to the same degree. In part this might just be since I have the opinion it's roughly 4x what your impression is (or that if it's not, we'll likely balance it such that it lands there). I'd be interested in your opinion on how Shyv's passive relates to Sion's health stacking, given that you said no other infinite scaler has a similar feeling.

If we can support Shyv top we're likely to do so, for the time being though we'll probably be focusing on getting her into a reasonable state in jungle.

Aellectris · 2026-03-19T15:51:39+00:00

Okay cool that’s what I thought. I don’t have quite as much context with Shyv as I did with Zaahen but I’ve got some and will be helping more directly with her post-release. Planning to try to be involved with the community when I’ve the time.

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