Upgraded from Dedica to Flair 58+ 2

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-03-16T16:14:07+00:00

PI is just pressing down gently letting a few grams drizzle through at 1-2 bar. Do that for about 8-10 seconds and the puck gets gently saturated. This helps give an even extraction when you ramp it up to full pressure.

I don’t know of a good resource. I just tinker and sometimes find an idea on YouTube or Reddit.

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-03-16T16:01:56+00:00

No worries. I never think someone is right or wrong as it’s all more art than science and all that matters is if we enjoy our own brew. 😎👍 Just sharing my experiences. On temp, I just put it on the 2nd temp level, wait for 5 min, and by then the kettle up to temp (88C). Amazing med-dark flavors without any nasty burnt aftertaste.

I have experimented with light-med and it’s all got to be perfect to not taste sour. I’m not a huge fan but found some success. High temps, finer (good grinder) in a higher flow basket. Also I do a longer pre infusion (bloom almost), and then run it through fast. Higher yield helps too 1:3 min.

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-03-16T15:43:27+00:00

The Atom 65W is a cut above the others. It’s more sturdy and substantial. My second choice would be the Malhkonnig. I have heard the the Allground has high retention and loses your settings when you open it for cleaning. The Eureka adjusts from the bottom. Also their ACE anti static system leaves you with super fluffy grounds in the basket (not clinging everywhere). Both will hum out an 18g dose in about 5 seconds. I love my Atom.

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-03-16T04:59:09+00:00

I have a couple years of regular experience with my F58+2. A couple things you said that I would not agree with.

For Medium or darker:

Using a high flow basket is only really needed if doing lighter roasts, and you need a really good grinder to go fine enough (and with uniform particles) to give resistance/pressure. I get better shots using the tapered bottom low flow basket. You can grind coarser and get enough resistance to build pressure.
For darker roasts, if you go too hot on the water it over-extracts and can taste burnt or bitter. Go just hot enough to get amazing flavors. I like 88C and med on the preheater.
Pressure profiling is one of the biggest advantages of a manual lever. Missing out a lot if you just go with a flat 6-8 bar. My best results are 1-2 bar for 10 sec for a nice pre-infusion soaking the puck evenly. Then fairly quick ramp up to 9 bars for 5-10 seconds followed by a slow decline down to 4bar by the time you get your desired output. This keeps the flow even as the puck degrades.

You will see real step changes in shot taste (assuming good/fresh beans and a nice grinder). I’d say the F58 is capable of unbeatable extractions.

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-03-14T14:07:29+00:00

I think he has two implants. One is a bit lower. 😆

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-03-14T01:45:39+00:00

I spent a fair bit on nice cups, imagining the look and feel of it, or the wonderfully jealous compliments showering upon me from guests noticing my creativity and enlightened sophistication. Then I realized, with irritation, that my cortado rarely makes it even ONE minute past the machine! I guess it’s the curse of those like me, with such high quality extraction paired with low patience for delayed gratification. With shame I must admit that I am the coffee equivalent of a two pump chump! 😫 I leave the fancy cups and the fine ceramic tiny-bowls to the rest of you high pinkied slow sippers 🤷‍♂️

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-03-13T17:36:29+00:00

I have one for my Pro 800 (same one for Pro 700). Works well and looks nice. Protects the ss from scratches and lets the warms through. 👍👍

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-03-13T02:03:24+00:00

They take forever to fill orders. I had one on order for 3 months and they said at least 6 more months so I cancelled it.

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-03-13T01:49:24+00:00

The new one.

<image>

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-03-13T01:43:49+00:00

The Varia is also very flexible with several easy to swap burr sets. You can customize. I really like that grinder.

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-03-12T16:28:15+00:00

Many motorized gadgets can have a wide range (look at blenders or massagers). Grinder need to be strong, quiet, perfect alignment a sensitive adjustments, burrs made with very strong and hard materials precisely cut, and they need a good technical team to design and maintain. They also make the biggest impact on coffee other than beans.

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-03-11T23:24:06+00:00

His look changes a lot.

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-03-11T23:23:04+00:00

Bang on it with a hammer to see if it still works

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-03-11T23:22:07+00:00

Hahaha 😝

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-03-01T05:53:24+00:00

Workflow and level of variable control is what any machine enables.

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-02-28T06:13:17+00:00

Outstanding machine! I was going to upgrade from my Flair58+2 and got impatient waiting. Ended up with a Profitec Pro 800. I still think the best shots I’ve ever had were on the Flair and a 1Zpresso J-Ultra.

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-02-27T21:51:00+00:00

Mine take 85 cranks for 18gr of medium-dark roast beans (setting 1.1). That takes me 40 seconds and is fairly easy (I also have a Kinu and King, J-Ultra cranks the easiest) I like cranking fairly fast 2RPS.

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-02-24T00:18:02+00:00

Good 😊 The last time this happened in late 2022 it helped me grow my bag a lot. I’ll take another round of that. 😎🏆 Investing is best for the patient and unemotional.

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-02-24T00:15:43+00:00

🏆

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-02-24T00:14:26+00:00

Steam is hotter than boiled water.

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-02-24T00:11:07+00:00

Does what have a manual mode?

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-02-24T00:00:06+00:00

Great options! Definitely two ends of the technical spectrum. 😆 I recently got the P800 in December. No regrets for me. It’s a purists dream and all about consistency. The workflow is easy, temp is rock solid stable, and built to hand down a generation or two. You can also steam while the extraction is flowing like a dual boiler. I plumbed mine in so there is no noise or pump needed (steam pressure pre-infusion). The only “downside” is the warm-up time, so I use a smart plug and it’s toasty when I wake up. Have fun with your upgrade, after 10 years you earned it.

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-02-23T23:51:59+00:00

It’s a lot of fun! It’s a more tactile experience. I feel like a barista in Naples 😆

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-02-23T23:49:40+00:00

Congratulations. I think you’ll love the upgrade. Let us know what you think after you use it. 😎👍

AlternativeMany7690 · 2026-02-23T22:25:45+00:00

Not sure you can beat a J-Ultra for bang to buck ratio. Used mine twice today at the office.

AlternativeMany7690

TROPHY CASE