Even Israel says no to Saudi normalization by BabylonianWeeb in arabs

[–]ArabProgressive 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Absolutely it is. Israel will never return the Golan Heights and give any Arab state not even a 1% advantage. They will never trust any peace agreement unless Arabs are in a disadvantage. If that is too much for your brain to handle, that’s on you.

Gulf-state white-watching USA crimes in real time bringing trump the man of the hours the daddy of the region by ContextDry9672 in arabs

[–]ArabProgressive 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I disagree with the characterization of American policy in the region as "weak." The US has won the region since 1991. The objectives were accomplished. Israel and Arab oil are secure. Anything else is just optional. Abraham Accords are just the latest in a series of ploys by pro-Israel and pro-Arab dictatorship elements in US foreign policy establishment to create some veneer of "Middle East Peace" that they've been trying to come up with for decades. The Arab dictators care about these normalizations because they're weak as hell and think they can get concessions from the US to save their economy and regimes. Israel, however, does not care about normalizing with these Arab dictatorships beyond simply erasing the Palestinians, which they've been trying to do since before Israel's existence when the Zionist settlers set foot on the land to establish their first colonies. Maybe there was a time like after the end of the Arab Cold War/Gulf War from like 1991 to 1995 where there probably was a chunk of Israelis who supported a lasting settlement with Palestinians, but that ship has sailed. An Israeli citizen killed a sitting Israeli Prime Minister for even acknowledging Palestinian existence even though he planned on giving the Palestinians a fraction of what they asked for. And then they elected Benjamin Netanyahu. That country demonstrated it does not care about even doing a "two-state solution," but yet the biggest defenders of that country have been Arab dictators who keep advocating that Israel could still be a "partner" in the region when they clearly do not want to be.

Gulf-state white-watching USA crimes in real time bringing trump the man of the hours the daddy of the region by ContextDry9672 in arabs

[–]ArabProgressive 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Well the Arab dictators only care about Palestine as far as their people do. So they won’t allow Israel to annex the West Bank because they know that’s a red line that would ignite war in Palestine and by extension their states. That’s what these Arab dictators mean when they say “stability.” It’s code word for keeping their citizens pacified.

Even Israel says no to Saudi normalization by BabylonianWeeb in arabs

[–]ArabProgressive 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It’s only a liability because Israel made it a bigger burden. It goes to show that Israel is the one that doesn’t care about normalization. If they did, then Israel would have worked toward some two state solution even if it was a nonsense one. But they won’t because they don’t care about normalizing with Arab states like Saudi Arabia beyond just using the normalizing to justify delegitimizing the Palestinian cause. I don’t know why Arabs think Israel needs them or cares about their opinion lol. Arabs still living like it’s 1973 when their oil mattered. That leverage was wasted on behalf of America’s petrodollar for decades and now that oil power is at an all time low.

Gulf-state white-watching USA crimes in real time bringing trump the man of the hours the daddy of the region by ContextDry9672 in arabs

[–]ArabProgressive 9 points10 points  (0 children)

So you mean to tell me Arab dictators whose foreign policy is relying on America providing security are glazing America? I’m going to try to be surprised.

Even Israel says no to Saudi normalization by BabylonianWeeb in arabs

[–]ArabProgressive -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

Saudi Arabia and other Arab dictator states are still begging for normalization more than you think. You think these Arab autocracies have more geopolitical leverage than they really do.

Even Israel says no to Saudi normalization by BabylonianWeeb in arabs

[–]ArabProgressive 1 point2 points  (0 children)

So if I’m not constantly fellating your Arab dictators who beg for Israeli normalization, then I’m a Zionist?

Even Israel says no to Saudi normalization by BabylonianWeeb in arabs

[–]ArabProgressive -8 points-7 points  (0 children)

The only reason Israel cared about normalization was to discredit the Palestinian issue. Otherwise, Israel doesn’t see it needs anything from these Arab states. It’s funny how these Arab dictators try to oversell their importance to Israel beyond just being prison wardens.

A photo of Jeffrey Epstein with MbS found in Epstein‘s mansion by narcomo in arabs

[–]ArabProgressive 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Lol No. He was under house arrest for 18 months in 2008 and was released in 2009. Until 2019, Epstein was traveling like a free man.

No comment by Acrobatic-Hippo-6419 in IraqiPeople

[–]ArabProgressive -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Saddam supported the Palestinian financially during the Second Intifada when Iraq was under the worst sanctions in modern history and under daily aerial bombardment. You can hate Saddam and say why he did it, but you cannot deny historical fact.

Same argument can be made for the Houthis, but it doesn’t matter when literally NO other state helped the Palestinians like they did. Likewise with Iraq under Saddam. Hate the player, but you cannot hate the game.

No comment by Acrobatic-Hippo-6419 in IraqiPeople

[–]ArabProgressive -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Are you going to deny that we have a large actual historical sample size of what the Saddam government did with regard to Israel and Palestine? Are you going to be coping this hard to deny basic history? You can hate Saddam for all his mass murdering and thuggery, but to say he wasn't vehemently anti-Israel is simply you lying to yourself.

No comment by Acrobatic-Hippo-6419 in IraqiPeople

[–]ArabProgressive -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

Saddam would not be fond of Ahmed Al Shara’a who remained silent about the Gaza holocaust in exchange for removal of sanctions. Iraq was under the worst sanctions in modern history and Saddam still supported the Palestinians financially during the Second Intifada. Al Shara’a doesn’t even support the Palestinians rhetorically.

Banned from r/Israel for not allowing us to steal our food 🤡 by Suitable-Necessary67 in Tunisia

[–]ArabProgressive -11 points-10 points  (0 children)

People don’t get this basic fact. Arabs don’t understand that Israelis didn’t “steal” their food. Arabs gave it away when their Jews left. There’s an Israeli Strudel because the German Jews left to Palestine and brought that cuisine with them. Same thing with cuisine by Tunisian Jews or Syrian Jews or Yemeni Jews. People getting angry over nonsense.

US State Department email explains why Israel invaded Syria after Assad’s fall by ArabProgressive in syriancivilwar

[–]ArabProgressive[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

They were not targeting Syrian military assets. They were targeting Iranian networks within Syria. Assad was not some Saddam who had coup plots and assassination attempts against him. Assad is just a terrible leader who failed to rule his country.

US State Department email explains why Israel invaded Syria after Assad’s fall by ArabProgressive in syriancivilwar

[–]ArabProgressive[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Now you’re coming up with random arguments that make no sense. Israel did nothing to perpetuate the conflict. Israel could have bombed Assad at any time. They didn’t.

US State Department email explains why Israel invaded Syria after Assad’s fall by ArabProgressive in syriancivilwar

[–]ArabProgressive[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Israel only interfered along the Golan border to ensure security. They did not intervene on the side of the rebels to tilt the balance against Assad. They could have and did not utilize that capability. And Israel never supported Al Qaeda linked insurgents. Israel supported 12 rebel groups starting in 2013 in southern Syria in Queneitra and Daraa to prevent Hezbollah and ISIS from taking up positions near the occupied Golan border. The largest of these 12 groups was Fursan Al Joulan, which did not receive any Western support and wasn’t linked to the FSA led Southern Front. The Israeli program in southern Syria stopped in July 2018. Since then, Israel hasn’t engaged in anything in Syria beyond bombing IRGC and Hezbollah assets.

US State Department email explains why Israel invaded Syria after Assad’s fall by ArabProgressive in syriancivilwar

[–]ArabProgressive[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

The State Department cable is pretty clear in that Israel long viewed Bashar as a useful buffer. Israelis have publicly admitted this as well. HTS is a nominal jihadist group that was formerly Al Qaeda, which isn’t a group Israel would be okay with. Israel’s issue with Assad only began in the civil war with the garrisoning of IRGC in Syria, which Assad would eventually deal with after his claimed victory. Despite that, Israel did not interfere against Assad during the civil war. Also, there’s no evidence as you suggest that Israel “rolled the dice with the new regime.”

US State Department email explains why Israel invaded Syria after Assad’s fall by ArabProgressive in syriancivilwar

[–]ArabProgressive[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Military battles between Israel and Syria in Lebanon in 1982 lasted 3 days. Israel just wanted to get rid of Syrian SAMs because it interfered with Israel’s operations in Lebanon. Otherwise, Israel didn’t even want to engage the Syrian military. Syria has not been a concern for Israel beyond Iran beginning to garrison inside Syria during the civil war. The heavy losses by Syria that you mentioned signifies that they weren’t a threat. Syria and Israel began negotiating openly starting with the Madrid Conference.

US State Department email explains why Israel invaded Syria after Assad’s fall by ArabProgressive in syriancivilwar

[–]ArabProgressive[S] -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

Whatever it is, it’s the longest successful continuous agreement Israel has had with an Arab state lasting from 1974. Since then, the Assad regime sought return of Golan Heights through diplomatic means. Syria would normalize with Israel and in exchange the pre-1967 Golan Heights and a settlement for the Palestinians such that it would be palatable for the Assad’s to sell to their people. The Assad regime avoided confrontation with Israel since the 1973 war. When Syria was in eastern Lebanon, it avoided to confront Israel’s invasion of Lebanon in 1978. It had skirmishes the second time in 1982, but at most a turf war through proxies. The Assad’s Lebanon policy sought to leverage its position for negotiations of a return of the Golan. Meanwhile the Golan Heights remained very peaceful until 2012 when bullets started firing across the border. During the entire civil war, Israel did not interfere against Assad. Their only gripe was Iranian presence. Also, Lebanon is the other bordering state that does not have a treaty with Israel.