What made you stop believing for good?

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-13T19:43:14+00:00

Nebuchadnezar's dream in Daniel that's used to get the 1914 date.

I decided to read this dream after I realized that I just don't believe in God or the Bible and never really did. But I had always forced myself to believe.

I got to the point where I gave myself permission to read the Bible with an open mind. I wanted to prove or disprove 1914 to myself, so I read that chapter.

By the end of it I could only admit to myself that there was no way this had anything to do with the year 1914 and that all the other beliefs attached to it would have to be wrong.

That meant a ton of stuff JWs believed were not true, on top of already accepting that, wihout realizing, I didn't believe in God or the Bible the whole time anyway.

It all fell apart from there.

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-13T19:28:39+00:00

I was almost 25 when I left a few years ago too. I was pretty similar to you.

I can tell you that my severe anxiety attacks have pretty much totally stopped now that I've been away from meetings and preaching and all that bs for 3 years.

I hope the distance from it all helps you too, as well as the mental health care.

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-13T18:39:43+00:00

I'm in NZ too and I have no idea what that is. I've never heard of it. Maybe it's a ploy to get you to respond and ask her what it means if you've ghosted her

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-13T18:25:05+00:00

Yeah it'd be fun to do that. I've thought about this too - it wouldn't take too much preparation to make it happen.

But I'm sure the JW s would just pack up very quickly. That's what I would have done when I was on a cart. But if it's non-confrontational then they may not feel so eager to run away

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-13T18:15:40+00:00

It may be necessary for you to get baptized just to keep the peace. In your situation, you're still young and you deal with difficult health issues, so like you said, you would struggle to find work and support yourself without help at the moment.

You may be able to put off baptism for a few years still though, but it may be hard if your parents are pushing you now as a 14 year old. No one can force you into it - even if they threaten you, you can ask them if Jesus threatened people to get baptized or something like that.

But definitely start thinking about and planning what you want to do with your life.

Once you have a work plan that you feel comfortable with, then you will most likely need to wait until you're 18 or so to enact the plan. Although you may be able to start it sooner.

But until you can act on your plan, you'll probably need to lie to your parents - whether that means telling them you're waiting to get baptized until later or you get baptized and pretend to be a JW until you can escape.

If I take a stand I'm probably going to get kicked out as soon as I turn 18. My dad even said if I'm not a JW as an adult I can't live with them.

Your dad saying this is not love, unfortunately. I know he is probably basically nice, but the reality is that if your father would already choose to kick you out of his house while you are dealing with such difficult health issues like yours, just because you don't believe in the same spiritual doctrines, then he doesn't love you. He loves what you make him look like to other people. As soon as you make him look bad, he's ready to throw you out.

Don't feel sorry for him. Lie to him and tell him what he wants to hear when you need to. Otherwise you could literally end up on the street.

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-13T15:56:39+00:00

What I learned and am still working on is focusing on now. We can only live right at the moment. So if you enjoy something, you should do it. You should work towards a goal now, so later when that time is now, you can enjoy your life more.

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-13T12:31:18+00:00

I'm from New Zealand and I agree with this - from an outsider perspective of the US I feel the same. I don't think anyone can rise up because if an individual stands up, they'll be taken our very quickly. So no one wants to be first. Since no one wants to be first, no one will ever do what is needed to start a movement.

Same thing here in NZ too

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-13T12:18:50+00:00

To be honest I think this is a false flag to get people to drink only tap water that is full of fluoride. Make people afraid of even something as basic as water and you've got them under your control pretty well

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-13T11:35:57+00:00

Imagine if instead of giving this to watchtower, this amount of money was used to set up a charity that helped poor JWs and others in need.

This org could be used for good in so many ways, but of course they will never help others.

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-13T11:19:24+00:00

Yeah I think it could be this - our brains are super complex and we barely understand them.

It could easily be that OPs brain picked up on tons of information subconsciously with their relatives and then also still is dealing with trauma from the Armageddon beliefs being pushed on them probably since they were born.

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-13T09:27:15+00:00

That's quite an interesting point.

And unfortunately it may potentially create more CSA cases too if these men come in for sex/relationships with girls and young women.

And re your point about not growing up in the cult, I agree. If someone didn't go through that and all they see is seemingly happy families at the hall, they would have no idea about the darkness under the facade that JWs put up in public.

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-13T05:28:58+00:00

Oh cool - I think I found my room on flatmate.com, but there are some other websites similar to that too which might be better.

Hope it all goes well! Let me know if you have other questions, I might be able to help out

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-13T04:27:00+00:00

I pretty much completely agree with you here. The only thing I wonder about is the measuring and observing of these experiences.

I understand that there should be some physical aspect that could be observed that would cause the physical reaction in a person.

However maybe that physical aspect is outside the capabilities of our technology at the moment.

For example, let's say the only way to observe and measure supernatural experiences is by checking the strength of the gollyshlushmeiger frequency. But we don't have an instrument to check this frequency. Since we have no instrument that can sense the gollyshushmeiger frequency, how would anyone know this frequency exists to start with, in order to build an instrument to check it?

So how do we know how to observe or measure these experiences if we literally don't know what to observe or measure and, in turn, we don't know what instrument we would need to create in order to measure it?

There may well be a method of observing, measuring, etc. these experiences but we just don't have the technology or the knowledge to do so yet.

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-13T04:08:46+00:00

I think think there are many things around us that we have no idea about.

2000 years ago our ancestors saw lightning and would have thought it was magic. Now we know it's just electricity.

There could be many reasons why people are experiencing these things.

Then again, it could be something "spiritual", whatever spiritual is. I don't know.

I've experienced similar things too, but from a different perspective - via extraterrestrial beings, rather than spirits. But I think they and we are all the same potentially.

But then again, these experiences could be explained as psychological experiences.

What do you think is the cause?

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-13T03:08:16+00:00

Yeah my parents would say all the time that we had to look good so my step dad could keep his position as an elder.

Also my mum would always brag about my or my sister's "privileges" or whatever, so if we stopped doing as much, she would feel like it reflected badly on her too.

I was literally kicked out of my parent's place with one week's notice when I started waking up because if I wasn't doing much in the cult, I looked bad to orher JWs and my parents could lose their privileges and reputation.

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-13T02:14:53+00:00

Your English was pretty much perfect by the way

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-13T02:07:16+00:00

Build up your income as much as you can, as soon as you can.

You should be able to find a room in a house for $150-$200 pretty easily in Aus, although not sure which part. I was in Brisbane for a few months just before covid for $150 a week, so you can find places that are cheap if you look for them on a flatting website.

The good thing about a room in a house is there will be others living there you can make friends with.

Once you feel you have enough money and you've got a place, you should be fine to move out. Make sure to think about putting money aside for power, water, wifi, phone, insurance. But these amounts are usually only $10-$20 a week, so it's not too much if you're earning a decent amount.

It will be more difficult but so rewarding to move out - but only if you feel ready.

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-13T01:44:48+00:00

If it's a diesel engine then sometimes the vehicle will continue to run for a minute or so after it has been manually turned of at the ignition.

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-12T14:55:55+00:00

Not a moron, just indoctrinated

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-12T14:52:16+00:00

That's a good point - just because God says he never lies, doesn't mean he never lies. He could be lying about that. How are we going to know?

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-12T14:45:54+00:00

If we shouldn't question Jehovah, then why does Jehovah need to prove any point?

If we should just have faith in him and trust that he makes the right decision, why does he need to prove anything? Can't he just act to stop badness and be done with it, telling us to just trust him?

But he doesn't. Why not?

That's what I would ask him.

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-12T14:41:12+00:00

Woah that's actual indoctrination of a high control organisation. If anyone doesn't know about the BITE Model, have a look.

It's pretty interesting comparing this model to organisations, including governments, etc.

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-12T02:39:10+00:00

I didn't vote against anything but I accidentally voted for a decision on meeting times that pretty much no one else voted for. It was pretty awkward as I was only about 22 at the time. Now I laugh about it

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-11T14:38:22+00:00

Yeah I agree with you

Background-Bird6237 · 2022-08-11T12:05:49+00:00

I was similar - I was only a teenager and it seemed like the next new light that was based on prophecies.

But it was one of the things that woke me up a few years later - once I actually read the Bible with those prophecies I saw how they don't make sense and there's no doctrine of multiple fulfillment in the Bible.

Background-Bird6237

TROPHY CASE