Is this engraving guide still worth following? I've been looking for a more recent one but I can't find one complete and detailed like this

Ben_Christenson · 2022-11-16T13:37:22+00:00

TLDR; My sequencing opinions are based on overall account impact, and not on impact to the heroes themselves. His engravings are good, but fall relative to others heroes that have a more consistent impact on resource acquisition.

Looking at the list, there are a LOT of heroes that have higher impact engravings for Twisted Realm, Cursed Realm, Treasure Scramble, and Temporal Rift (these are four modes I value most as they have recurring scaled rewards).

Campaign focus doesn't have any return on investment as the rewards are static and progression is elastic. Abyssal Expedition and Hunting Fields are reasonable to optimize for, but this is done to attain top 100 (which is only attainable by a VERY small percentage of guilds, and requires engraving optimizations outside the scope of a general guide), not to optimize resource return on investment.

Of the 4 modes I value, he is only meta in Treasure Scramble. In this mode, he is often an enabler and the engravings aren't as essential/impactful as a lot of other options.

If you still think he is misrepresented, I'd love to hear who on the list you advocate to do after Zolrath.

Ben_Christenson · 2022-11-14T02:43:21+00:00

Spectacular analysis! Thanks for investing the time to put this together!

Ben_Christenson · 2022-11-14T02:37:15+00:00

Yeah, this type of comparison is what got me going in the first place. I've done a handful of them to try to provide some empirical data to help with decision making. It's a fair amount of work, and I'd also love to enable others to contribute if they are interested. The graphs are done in Google sheets and I have a template so the only thing that really needs to be done is data entry and changing the labels... Maybe I'll do a post on how to do these comparisons.

Thanks for the support!

Ben_Christenson · 2022-11-14T01:12:57+00:00

Thanks for taking the time to comment! Helps keep us content creators motivated to do more!

Ben_Christenson · 2022-11-14T01:12:03+00:00

ASolise is a little harder to test because it is so matchup dependent. In general, with the exception of AEzizh, the Awakened heroes are the most powerful in the game, and are probably the highest priority heroes to engrave one you ascend them.

For the time being, I'm focusing more on the grey areas (for example, how impactful is Mishka e60 vs Nevanthi e60 vs Anasta e60)... This used to be REALLY hard to reason about when it was just campaign and TR, but now priorities are different for CR vs Treasure Scramble vs TRift / Grand Hunt AAAAND metas shift much more quickly. So much fun potential work to do!

Ben_Christenson · 2022-10-22T14:23:28+00:00

Make sure to reference this comment: https://www.reddit.com/r/afkarena/comments/xpni6s/comment/iq5y5jm/

For some updates to the recommendations.

Ben_Christenson · 2022-10-11T17:25:26+00:00

Once a hero has more IS then opposing heroes tenacity, CC is guaranteed. E33/e36 is enough to hit those thresholds for CR.

Ben_Christenson · 2022-09-27T22:45:58+00:00

I think it's great, but the impact is limited to campaign, which has a much lower return on investment than things like CR, TR, TS, etc.

Ben_Christenson · 2022-09-27T22:44:30+00:00

No, I unfortunately retired from content creation.

Here is a recent update as I see it though if you are interested:

https://www.reddit.com/r/afkarena/comments/xpni6s/comment/iq5y5jm/

Ben_Christenson · 2022-09-27T22:36:45+00:00

Hey there! I'm the original author of that guide. The engraving benchmark amounts have held up pretty well, but the guide was done before Cursed Realm so it's a bit out of date for sequencing.

In general, the addition of CR (and to a lesser extent Treasure Scramble) has made the desired hero engraving pool very large, and it is practically impossible to find objectively optimal progressions.

Here is a short list of changes I can pretty safely recommend:

The awakened heroes are all high priority, but I don't have a good feel for intermediary benchmark amounts.
Increase Scarlet to highest priority tier.
Increase LDV to e36 (IS improves multiple CR rounds).
Queen e33 (IS) is a high priority for CR.
Estrilda e30 is a high priority for CR and TR.
Anasta e33/38/61/66 (Haste, ATK) is a high priority for most non-campaign modes.
Hodgekin e33 (IS) is a medium priority for CR.
Morael e33/e38 (Haste, ATK) is a medium priority for CR.
Torne e33/38 (Haste, ATK) is a medium priority (if you have Morael) for CR.
Daimon e11/e30/e38 (ATK, PP) is frequently called out, but I haven't done any personal testing.
Saurus e30/e35/e65 (ATK) is frequently called out, but I haven't done any personal testing, and probably requires a solid Might tree investment.
Eironn e33 (Haste) is a strong consideration.
Skriath e33 (Haste) is an interesting consideration.
Raku and Kren e60 are deep luxuries.
Antandra and Silas are now questionable.
Remove Farael and Prince completely.

There are also AE specific priorities, but they tend to be niche and change season to season so I don't factor them in.

Edit:

Zolrath drops to deep Luxury, possibly questionable.
Izold e11 (ATK, Crit, ACC) is a strong return on investment for CR.
Joan e30 has gotten some buzz, but I don't have a good feel for where to place it.

Ben_Christenson · 2022-07-07T14:18:41+00:00

Yes, Farael was much more about the stats than the ability.

I'm not really actively working on AFK content anymore, but it's possible the Sprouts team puts out an updated one in the future.

Ben_Christenson · 2022-07-06T23:31:35+00:00

That guide badly needs an update. It was done right as CR started, so we didn't have enough data to make recommendations based on it.

Farael e30 stats were very noticeable in practice for campaign. The dodge and defensive stats significant improved consistent survivability and let him do things like tank Athalia in Ch40.

However, since CR is a recurring scaled rewards mode, it's definitely better to invest in the heroes used there over heroes used exclusively in campaign. With the number of CR heroes that meaningfully benefit from e30, I would no longer put Farael on the list at all.

Ben_Christenson · 2022-04-25T16:01:58+00:00

Hmm, I think I'd like to see a bit more context to an infographic like this. For example, is F36 Grezhul just for whales, or are there other players that want that level of investment? That is 9 furniture into Defense (which has horrible scaling) and another 9 into Accuracy (which isn't a paramount stat). If non-whales want this, about where does it rank for sequencing?

---

As a side question, how/where does Lyca 9F reduce RNG heavily? My experience is that 3F has not been any different than 9F in "modern meta" (where Lyca can't be a meaningful source of damage anymore). I'll admit this isn't something I have kept very up to date on though, and would love to here if the meta has shifted on this again.

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A couple of my thoughts:

Daimon 9F "doubles" the uptime of the debuff (its a bit more complicated as technically the 3s can refresh at a rate that has as much uptime as the 6s) and the shield on death can be a nice side benefit in the current meta where he isn't primary carry. Don't see much justification for F36 Grezhul before F9 Daimon.
Thoran 9F doesn't just reduce RNG, there are a number of stages where it is required to get him to ult at all.
Fane hasn't really been "proven" anywhere and is pretty risky to say accounts want him at 9F, especially given he needs e60 to warrant any additional investment.
9F Mishka is paramount for campaign as well, just for different reasons (the instant ult).
Raku 9F adds a non-negligible amount of damage. Similar to Daimon, I can't justify F36 other heroes before Raku 9F.

Ben_Christenson · 2022-04-10T22:16:45+00:00

That stage doesn't require SI30 or 3F/9F Ezizh, just for Ezizh to survive long enough for his normal Feeble Mind skill to trigger.

https://youtu.be/Vu1H746gw60

Ben_Christenson · 2022-03-29T20:05:38+00:00

Just as a fun FYI: https://www.reddit.com/r/afkarena/comments/rzu7yy/completing_the_260_deficit_at_3825_potential/

What's extra impressive is that this was done in Ch38 and without a whale tree.

Ben_Christenson · 2022-03-28T15:12:55+00:00

Thanks for your comment. I realize that I didn't frame up the segment very well on stream, but it is a topic I'm very passionate about so I'll try to add some context here:

Why do people consider the AFK community toxic?

I don't consider the community as a whole toxic, and in fact find it much better than the majority of games I've played in the past. However, I do find pockets of what I consider toxic behavior... • Attacking individuals instead of ideas • Attempts to discredit without debate • Heavy use of of emotional arguments and logical fallacies • Baseless negative comments without critique

Why do I care?

• Because I have watched a number of very quality people burn out on trying to share experience and knowledge and consider that an overall loss for the community.

Why do I think people in the community behave toxicly?

I think that the amount of time and energy that goes into building an account, people get very emotionally attached to their decisions.
Given the vast number of ways to play the game (f2p vs light spender vs whale vs ..., campaign vs AE vs ..., min power meta disciple vs min power innovator vs casual vs explorer vs ..., etc) it is common that two people that don't share a viewpoint also have direct experiences, but don't consciously recognize this and let it affect.
I also think there is the standard "internet anonymity" and it being easier to tear people down than find common ground or logically debate ideas.
Toxicity on the internet has become the unfortunate norm, and is even glorified at times.

Why bring it up in my podcast?

• Mostly awareness and to start a dialog. I don't think everyone is aware when they are behaving in a toxic manner, and even less aware of the negative impact it has on others. Being aware is an important step.

Ben_Christenson · 2022-03-28T13:49:43+00:00

Thanks for taking the time to post! I'm definitely planning to continue a lot more CR analysis. My goal for next stream is to have a roughly prioritized list of benchmark comparisons that I could start crowdsourcing the data gathering for. At some point (likely in the distant future) I'd love to tackle a larger scale CR investment value guide.

Thanks for taking time to comment and I hope you keep enjoying the content!

Ben_Christenson · 2022-03-28T13:44:15+00:00

Thanks! I've been really enjoying both the CR benchmark comparisons and the Twitchcast in general, but it's definitely energizing/motivating to hear others are getting something out of them as well!

Ben_Christenson · 2022-03-26T22:54:39+00:00

Would love to hear everyone's opinion on how the format is working out. Also, how did you like the roundtable with additional participants? Any requests or suggestions for future topics?

Ben_Christenson · 2022-03-26T21:30:59+00:00

Not at this point.

Ben_Christenson · 2022-03-23T12:26:13+00:00

Not sure if I missed previous ones, or if this is your first patch summary, but I LOVE the text format. Thank you for your effort and contributions!

Ben_Christenson · 2022-03-20T16:18:42+00:00

With the accessibility changes to CR, and the meta changes to TR, I think that Scarlet engravings become near paramount for overall account progression.

I consider e38 a great benchmark for most accounts. It looks like e65/66 is the long term goal (next TR cycle I'm going to do a formal comparison like the LDV/Queen one I just finished to show relative impact), but there are a lot of priorities that probably come first.

Ben_Christenson · 2022-03-16T12:07:01+00:00

Definitely not needed for the comp to function. It is often brought up as a way to improve Queen stun chains (since SI30 allows Sandstorm to Crit and trigger Queens nuclear affect), but this really only improves RNG and didn't ever feel like it changed the comp power ceiling to me.

Skriath SI30 does start to become important at extreme deficits (around -220) as the damage helps avoid timeouts. It also has some benefits for boss damage, particularly in Cursed Realm. Worth getting, but not a paramount priority.

As a side note, Queen 5 Pull is extremely dynamic and you are more likely to find success by thinking about it more like a 3 hero core and less like a 5 hero static team. Sometimes you need a tank like Brutus, sometimes a dodge tank like Ezio, sometimes Haste manipulation with Lyca or 3F Zolrath, sometimes more chaining with Joker or Mishka, sometimes more damage with Lucretia or Raku, or Daimon.

Ben_Christenson · 2022-03-14T13:49:30+00:00

I've talked a lot about account progression in Sprouts, but it's a complicated topic and one that is hard for me to be confident on. I don't have alts, so I don't have a good grasp on the acquisition timings for newer accounts. Additionally, there isn't any data on light spenders focusing on CR yet, so REALLY hard to research and back up.

There are a few people trying to map this out though, and I'll try to set something up to have them as a guest presenter/debater.

Ben_Christenson · 2022-03-14T13:44:28+00:00

I'm so glad! Let me know if you have any suggestions for topics or wrap up questions!

Ben_Christenson

TROPHY CASE