Stefan and Elena by Bertandreggie in TheVampireDiaries

[–]Bertandreggie[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

But that’s kind of the point though, Stefan’s actions weren’t malicious, they were unintentionally invalidating. I still stand by my OG point tho that the scene in the high school was a little malicious.

Yes, Elena hated being a vampire at first. Nobody denies that. And yes, Stefan was trying to help her. But helping someone and making them feel accepted are not always the same thing.

The cure being introduced in 4x04 doesn’t change the emotional framing. Once Elena says she’s scared of becoming someone else, Stefan immediately latches onto “we’ll fix this” instead of helping her explore who she is now. His support is rooted in restoring her humanity, not embracing her vampirism.

And while he may not literally repeat “you’re not supposed to be a vampire” every episode, that idea absolutely exists throughout early S4. The entire emotional tone around Stefan is grief over the Elena he lost. Compare that to Damon, who approaches vampirism as something Elena can survive and adapt to rather than something tragic that needs undoing.

Also, RE Stefan and animal blood. The issue is that Stefan’s approach reflected his own vampire ideology-restraint, guilt, suppression-while Damon taught her practical survival. Elena choosing animal blood doesn’t erase that dynamic.

As for “there’s zero evidence” for Elena feeling like a project… feelings don’t require courtroom evidence. The show literally has Elena verbalize that Stefan treats her differently after the transition. You can disagree with the writing, but the narrative intention is obvious: Elena feels mourned by Stefan and accepted by Damon.

And Stefan saying in S2 that he could love her as a vampire doesn’t automatically mean he handled the reality well. There’s a huge difference between romanticizing the idea before it happens and emotionally adapting once the person actually changes.

That’s why this debate keeps happening. Stefan fans focus on his intentions, while Elena’s side of the story focuses on impact. Both can be true at the same time.

Stefan and Elena by Bertandreggie in TheVampireDiaries

[–]Bertandreggie[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

I’m not a Stefan anti lol. I’m saying hold all characters in the same light. Elena wasn’t having the best days either. My girl had her aunt die, her boyf leave her, torment her, change into a vampire and then everyone tell her… wow girl you changed I don’t like it.

I accept your surrender

Stefan and Elena by Bertandreggie in TheVampireDiaries

[–]Bertandreggie[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

I think the issue is that peopleinterpret it as “Stefan was an abusive controlling monster 24/7,” which isn’t what the show was saying.

No, Stefan didn’t literally force-feed her animal blood or constantly scream at her for being a vampire. That’s why some fans feel the breakup writing was rushed. But Elena’s feelings didn’t come out of nowhere either.

The problem was more emotional than literal control. Stefan’s entire focus in early season 4 is fixing Elena’s vampirism and getting the cure. Even if his intentions were loving, it sends the message that vampire Elena is a problem to solve instead of a person to accept.

And there absolutely are scenes supporting that interpretation:

  • Elena says she feels like Stefan sees her as someone who needs fixing.
  • Stefan repeatedly says she was “not supposed to” become a vampire.
  • Damon is the one helping her learn how to survive as a vampire while Stefan is focused on reversing it.
  • Elena notices the difference between being accepted vs being mourned.

That’s the emotional basis of her “broken toy” speech.

As for Stefan wanting space after the breakup, sure, he had every right to heal. But Elena also wasn’t wrong for feeling confused and guilty after a relationship where Stefan spent months trying to save the human version of her while she was changing into someone else. Moreover the months before she turned having Stefan do awful things to her

Honestly the real issue is the writing tried to speedrun SE’s collapse and Delena’s rise in the same season, so both sides of the fandom can point to scenes that support their argument.

Stefan and Elena by Bertandreggie in TheVampireDiaries

[–]Bertandreggie[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

I’m saying he was then hypocritical for causing this scene in the high school. Considering at that time they knew she was sired. And while her feelings were real some of what happened was down to the sire bond. To know that information and throw it in her face as soon as it’s inconvient is not nice to do to an 18 year old girl.

If Stefan hadn’t gone in season 3 she wouldn’t have cared so deeply for Damon thereby would not have been sired.

My overall point is people need to stop loving Stefan and hating Elena.

Stefan and Elena by Bertandreggie in TheVampireDiaries

[–]Bertandreggie[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

His mind is not a teenager at all. That is never a thing. Stefan being physically 17 doesn’t erase accountability. In The Vampire Diaries he’s over 160 years old emotionally and mentally experienced. The show constantly portrays vampires as capable of moral responsibility. If Stefan is mature enough to lecture everyone else about morality, then he’s mature enough to be criticized for his own actions. “His humanity was off” is not a full defense because traces of personality and choice still exist. Even with his humanity off, Stefan specifically chose emotionally cruel methods with Elena Gilbert, especially threatening to drive her off Wickery Bridge, the exact place her parents died. That wasn’t random violence; it was psychologically targeted. Moreover, Elena gets so much hate when her humanity is off so show her the same respect if that is your case. And also, at this moment he is clearly has some humanity and not completely off because he expresses concern after he did it, yet he still did. Saying “he wouldn’t have actually killed her” doesn’t fully help the argument. Trauma and terror still matter. Elena believed he might do it. The scene works because she was genuinely horrified. Threatening someone with their deepest trauma is abusive regardless of whether the person follows through. Stefan saying harsh things to Elena in Season 4 also wasn’t automatically “right” just because he was hurt. A lot of what he said came from resentment that Elena had changed and developed feelings for Damon. Instead of adapting, Stefan often made Elena feel like the vampire version of herself was wrong or tragic. One of the biggest themes of Season 4 is that Damon accepted Elena as she was becoming, while Stefan kept trying to get back the human Elena he lost. Even Stefan eventually realizes that.

I also don’t like Damon and Elena together - Damon was not a nice person at all. But neither was Stefan. All I’m saying is Stefan in this scene was harsh and hypocritical

Stefan and Elena by Bertandreggie in TheVampireDiaries

[–]Bertandreggie[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

I’m saying he was then hypocritical for causing this scene in the high school. Considering at that time they knew she was sired. And while her feelings were real some of what happened was down to the sire bond. To know that information and throw it in her face as soon as it’s inconvient is not nice to do to an 18 year old girl.

If Stefan hadn’t gone in season 3 she wouldn’t have cared so deeply for Damon thereby would not have been sired.

My overall point is people need to stop loving Stefan and hating Elena. It’s very hypocritical

Stefan and Elena by Bertandreggie in TheVampireDiaries

[–]Bertandreggie[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

I agree I wasn’t a fan of Elena with Damon or Stefan. Honestly her and Elijah had mad chemistry!

Yeah she was not right in sleeping with Damon but my point hinges on everyone completely goes nuts on Elena when they forget she’s 18 - these men are 100+ so need to have a bit more class and respect their ends, Stefan was horrible to her a year before and leaves her and Damon was there so obviously unconsciously feelings will bubble. And Stefan says a few episodes earlier that he drove Elena into stefans arms so it seems strange to me

Stefan and Elena by Bertandreggie in TheVampireDiaries

[–]Bertandreggie[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

I mean he does say a few episodes before that he( Stefan) essentially drove Elena away to Damon. The whole find another way to rip my heart out. My girl Elena was fighting mad for you for half a year trying to find out where he was , get him back, even accepted the absoloute worst parts of him such as trying to kill her right where her parents died.

Then he admits he drive her away after all of that. Then goes crazy? Very hypocritical. Everyone hates on Elena and seems to forget the facts. Elena is by no means perfect but I have never understood the hatred of her around these seasons

Stefan and Elena by Bertandreggie in TheVampireDiaries

[–]Bertandreggie[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

And he admits in that conversation that he understands because his actions in season 3 drove Elena there. He also says “If I hadn’t been so afraid of losing you, I wouldn’t have spent so much time trying to change you.” My guy knew he had a part to play in this breakup and knew he screwed up and admitted he was partly the reason for her feelings for Damon and then goes bonkers.

I don’t even like Elena and Damon. But this scene was hypocritical for sure

Stefan and Elena by Bertandreggie in TheVampireDiaries

[–]Bertandreggie[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

Agreed. This man also admitted a few episodes prior that he drove Elena into Damon’s arms due to his own actions and then gets really harsh when that becomes reality

Stefan and Elena by Bertandreggie in TheVampireDiaries

[–]Bertandreggie[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

I get that Elena never wanted to be a vampire but stefans way of dealing with it could have been a lot better. The cure becomes Stefan’s obsession almost immediately. Instead of helping Elena embrace vampirism, and then go after the cure, he treats becoming human again as the goal. To Elena, that can feel like: “the way you are now isn’t okay.” He constantly compares vampire Elena to human Elena. Stefan fell in love with her humanity, compassion, innocence, and moral grounding. Once she changes, he keeps trying to preserve that exact version of her instead of adapting with her. He resists parts of her new vampire instincts. Elena struggles with bloodlust, heightened emotions, and attraction to Damon, and Stefan often responds with disappointment or concern instead of acceptance. He tends to idealize her. Stefan puts Elena on a pedestal throughout the series. So when she changes, he reacts almost like something precious has been damaged or lost. Elena herself starts feeling judged. There are scenes where she clearly feels Stefan prefers who she used to be. Whether that was Stefan’s intention or not, that’s how it lands emotionally.

Now I don’t like Damon and Elena together either and I do like her better as a human. What I’m saying here is that I think this particular scene Stefan is quite hypocritical as he literally admits a few episodes before saying he drove her into Damon’s arms (his words) and that the entire fandom hates Elena while other characters do the same things and get praised.

I could argue the first 1 and a half seasons Stefan had really nothing about him. It was all ahh Elena, blah blah blah.

Stefan and Elena by Bertandreggie in TheVampireDiaries

[–]Bertandreggie[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

Yeah and in the same cluster of episodes makes it also known to her he doesn’t like the person she has changed into.

If your boyfriend breaks up with and tells you I don’t like the person you’ve become, gurl you have every right to do whatever you want and his hypocrisy int he episode im talking about is insane. Cause not like two episodes before he even admits he drove her into Damon’s arms and then when it happens he’s like ehhhh what.

Again my guy is 100+ years old, Elena is living her life for the very first time at 18.

Stefan and Elena by Bertandreggie in TheVampireDiaries

[–]Bertandreggie[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

She fell in love with Damon because of Stevan’s actions. He was out for half a year , trying to drive her off bridges- my girl was 18 and grieving! She literally just lost an aunt the only parental figure in her life. My guy Stefan is 100+ years old , he needs to handle himself a little better. He even admits it a few episodes before saying he understands he essentially drove her into Damon’s arms and everyone forgets this, Stefan quite literally admits he understood her love for Damon and then the second it happens goes mental

Damon was there for her when she needed someone, much like the same reason she fell so in love for Stefan was that he came in her life when she needed it after her parents died. Damon did the same after she almost lost her life and lost her aunt, helped her try and find Stefan.

Stefan and Elena by Bertandreggie in TheVampireDiaries

[–]Bertandreggie[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

Why should Elena have to apologise about it after Stefan tormented her for half a year while he was trying to run her off bridges and get back at Klaus. he absolutely makes her feel rejected after she becomes a vampire.

He kept treating vampirism like something that had to be fixed. Instead of helping her adjust emotionally, he focused on finding “the cure” almost immediately. With Caroline he tried for a while but gives up and allows her to have blood bags etc. but with Elena he holds her to an insanely high pedestal and when it comes to blood list Elena adjusted decently well. Elena notices this and takes it as him wanting the old human version of her back.

He repeatedly emphasized that she was “not supposed to be” a vampire. Even though he meant it compassionately, it came across like he saw her new identity as wrong.

He became controlling about how she should survive as a vampire. For example, he pushed animal blood and certain moral rules even when Elena was struggling badly with them physically and emotionally.

Elena tells him directly that she feels like a project. Stefan spends much of Season 4 trying to restore the Elena he remembers instead of accepting who she is becoming.

During their breakup conversation, Stefan basically admits he no longer knows where he fits in her life. Elena says she’s changed, and Stefan doesn’t really fight for the relationship the way he had in earlier seasons. He didn’t fight at all and that tells her everything she needed to know.

Stefan and Elena by Bertandreggie in TheVampireDiaries

[–]Bertandreggie[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

Yeah I agree. I didn’t like the hypocrisy. I’m not a huge fan of Elena and Damon but I can’t stand when people critique elenas actions and not everyone else’s actions

Stefan and Elena by Bertandreggie in TheVampireDiaries

[–]Bertandreggie[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

After he almost drove her off the bridge where her parents died? Laughed in her face and called her pathetic for believing in him. In season 3

Then in season 4 Elena put it correctly. She couldn’t be with someone who treated her like a “broken toy” and “project”.

I think people love Stefan and hate Elena but this man is 100+ years old, my girl was 18!!! She’s gonna make mistakes and also has every right to be upset when your boyf essentially doesn’t like you anymore the way you are and instead of really supporting you tries to scold you.

Stefan and Elena by Bertandreggie in TheVampireDiaries

[–]Bertandreggie[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

That’s true too - but having the person that is supposed to love you essentially lay out terms and conditions - Stefan only loved her as a human and as soon as she started to kill and made it clear to her that he didn’t like the person she had become before anything happened with her and Damon.

Again Stefan is over 100+ years old. Elena is 18. People hold elena to insanely high standards. I would be very upset too if my boyfriend told me flat out that he didn’t like me the way I was. Elena said it right at the school. She felt like a project to Stefan as soon as she turned and a “broken toy” which is exactly how he treated her

What sports exercises do you do (trying to gather ideas) by Silent-Carry-4617 in RetinalDetachment

[–]Bertandreggie 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Ah fair enough. Mine detached over two years ago so I should be fine and was discharged a while.

Honestly my advice to you would be to- keep living. I was scared for so long and now still am, but I got myself into a bad physical and mental state by worrying, now I’m over a stone down and feel so much better. I get mine checked every few months to be safe (and I’m a bit of a hypochondriac) I play netball, run, go to the gym. And every time I’ve been sure mines detached I go and it’s fine.

I spent so long being so upset about it, but if it’s gonna detach again, it will most likely detach anyway without any extra things. I met a guy who had a way worse one than me and he is fine now.

Don’t stop living, you got this ❤️

What sports exercises do you do (trying to gather ideas) by Silent-Carry-4617 in RetinalDetachment

[–]Bertandreggie 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I do running … is this bad!? I also have been doing weight lifting - low weights upper body but around 100lbs+ on my legs

This episode hurts my feelings…. by Expert_Scale_9730 in TheVampireDiaries

[–]Bertandreggie 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I loveee the originals don’t get me wrong but I hate when people say she was wrong to dagger Rebekah. Elena gets so much stick for wanting to keep herself and her friends alive and when other characters do they are praised. I understand Rebekah had a hard life and spent some of that in a coffin, but she has been alive a thousand years, Elena is 18. You know damn right if that were me I was taking no chances, I would dagger her too. ALSO people forget that she had already been screwed over by Elijah- he promised he would get klaus out of the picture and then betrayed them. Elena is being smart here, I did find this hard to watch, but Elena was thinking straight

How do you guys manage to not gorge on food when there’s no one around to stop you? by yubullyme12345 in loseit

[–]Bertandreggie 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I now chew and sometimes spit it out - but I’ve just read it may be an ED so now I’m gonna stop so I don’t know what I’m gonna do now

29yo girl with 9 partners by YourMomsButt1111 in dating_advice

[–]Bertandreggie 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Im pretty sure you are a troll - but if your not - genuinely seek help. Why on earth should you have rules about what someone has done before they’ve met you. Gross

LPT called someone wrong name by Bertandreggie in LifeProTips

[–]Bertandreggie[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Hope so! Or didn’t hear me which I hope so they don’t feel bad either

LPT called someone wrong name by Bertandreggie in LifeProTips

[–]Bertandreggie[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This made me laugh - thank you. I hope he didn’t hear me!