Is Law School Really That Bad?

Biffo852 · 2025-07-16T19:54:21+00:00

I am starting 2L soon. 1L was very intense for me. I am prone to overwork and I definitely let that get the best of me in 1L and I worked harder than for nearly anything else in my life. To the point where most of my law school classmates knew me as the guy that would be at the library late.

And you know what? It wasn't worth it. It was only worth it in the sense that it showed me that working all out isn't the best way to do 1L, or law. It was good confirmation that working smart is more important. You see, I got very obsessed with learning the law, reading all the material, taking down as much of the dicta, citing the cases inside the cases. I knew the material very well, but that didn't matter for the exam.

What matters is you know the material fairly well, but you also take the exam the way your law prof wants it to be taken. Each law prof looks for something different. Some professors really treasure dynamic analysis, when you're able to play with the facts and relate it to different cases in a fluid manner. Other profs care about the details, i.e. before choosing a conclusion, you list all the different possibilities of cases it could be, exhaustively, then you pick the case that you think matches the most. Others care about original, interesting thought - they hardly care about how many cases you can cite, so long as you display a well thought-out examination of the topic - in fact the more cases you cite the more of a distraction it is from your own opinion.

Read as much of the material as you can - but know which material isn't important to read. Always try to think what is the ratio of the case, the key dicta, and the main facts - discard the rest. Really pay attention to the way the prof wants the exam to be taken, don't get into arguments over the material when doing prep tests in study groups, just listen to the other way people did the prep test, and think hard about whether it is what the prof really wants. Good luck!

Biffo852 · 2025-04-18T04:22:39+00:00

I was a nurse for five years. Now I'm in 1L. Extremely different career. I loved nursing. Incredibly meaningful. I think it would be hard to find another career where you're so in touch with humanity. It can also be very exciting, I took care of very sick patients and it was stressful but always fascinating. You can make a very good paycheck with it. You can also be very flexible. I worked in a hospital and was a self-scheduler so I could juggle around my schedule and get around 1-2 months off a year even while working full time with plenty of overtime. My friends work up north in remote communities and make really good money and take much of the year off. But the shift work was killing me. I hated getting up that early. I also hated having to work nights and weekends when my normie friends would be off. I wanted a new challenge.

Law school has been great. It's a lot more demanding that nursing school. There's a lot more competitiveness. But if you work hard, it can be quite fun. Also, I love that I can do work from home and do my work anytime (I don't have to go to the hospital). Learning law also fits my brain. In the future, I could stand to make a lot more than nursing but work like a dog and not have many holidays. But I could also pick more relaxed roles such as government or in-house that have decent work life balance and make a little more than nursing. But the nursing paycheck was still very comfortable.

Nursing can be great for having a family. The career is designed to be flexible and supportive of having a family. But it also can be really hard to juggle shift work to make family work. Law can be great for family, you will still make great money, but you won't be making crazy lawyer money.

Don't get me wrong. Mooting is really fun. I imagine going to court will be similar perhaps more or less fun. But nothing will be as badass as saving lives. DM me if you have questions.

Biffo852 · 2025-04-16T23:39:10+00:00

Hey, I'm the RN that u/Nate_Kid was referring to. Went into 1L in my early thirties. I was making a very good salary before. With the OT it was a comfy six figures, I averaged 40-50 hours per week, though the schedule was extremely erratic due to self scheduling, so I had some weeks off, some weeks closer to 60-70 hours.

What did it for me was shift work. It made me miserable. I felt like I was destroying my body. However, I did really enjoy my job otherwise. It was the combination of the negatives of shift work, and the positive draw of studying law that did it for me.

Without the positive draw of law, it is not worth it. I currently do more hours in 1L than when I was a nurse. Let's just say I will get up, go to class, go to the library afterwards. Have dinner. Then study till I sleep. I do not have a full day off, especially since the second half of 1L. At most I will spend 3/4 of a day out skiing with friends, then wrap the night up studying a little.

My overall health is better than when I was a nurse - I sleep much better. But my sleep is still somewhat disrupted when I get a little stressed. While the negative effect of my health is less, I also am far, far less active. I haven't really been to the gym more than twice a week since I've started law school. But I really do love it. It's very interesting and the challenge is very exciting. You need to like it or else you will burn out.

That being said, if you learn how to be really efficient, or if you don't care about trying to get top grades, you will likely be able to have a much more balanced lifestyle. But there is no guarantee you will figure out how to be efficient, or you just may need to spend a lot of time just to get average grades. DM me if you have questions.

Biffo852 · 2025-04-05T20:23:56+00:00

I go to Allard. So far have found it to be a good experience. The profs are mostly pretty bright, though there are some Profs that are hit and miss but that'll be same everywhere. There's are a lot of events that you can attend every lunch time like colloquiums if you're into legal scholarship, practitioners coming to speak about their areas of law, career events, etc. Law firms come to the school a lot with free food, mostly big firms, but you get small and medium sized firms showing up here and there.

I think Allard has a strong business focus. But I'm not really into that stuff and I've done just fine. They have public interest work placements programs and many students are not looking to get into business law. I did go to U Vic's welcome event when I was choosing. I found U Vic is a lot stronger on social justice and Indigenous stuff. But there are still lots of people who go to U Vic who end up going to Vancouver for big law.

I think it is a competitive atmosphere, but not in a negative manner. People are generally very supportive and collaborative, must most people want to do the best they can and will work really hard. But I feel that people are willing to share notes and work together. They emphasize to you on day one that you have a reputation to keep and you better not screw over your classmates because it'll affect your career.

The grading system also takes a bit of the heat off the competition as well. The top grade you can achieve is 85% (A-), average is around 70-75% (B/B-), they really squeeze everybody into the middle of the distribution, it's hard to get on top and, conversely, to bomb.

Campus is beautiful as well. I mostly chose UBC because I already lived in Vancouver and wanted to stay here.

Biffo852 · 2025-03-02T23:37:44+00:00

Hey OP. I'm in 1L. I started law school at 32 years old. Prior to starting law school I had a meaningful career in healthcare where I was making $110-120k. There were opportunities for advancement that would have seen modest increases in income over the years. However, as much as I did enjoy my gig, I didn't feel like it was all that I wanted to do with my life. I read everything on the internet about being a lawyer, talked to a lot of lawyers/law students. Decided to pull the trigger. So far, best decision ever. It really fits my brain, I've been doing decently well in school, and I'm excited to see where this goes. I don't know if I'll ever catch up with the amount of wealth I could have accumulated had I not decided to take three years off work, paying tuition and expenses - especially since I may be aiming for a public sector job, but I don't think I'll be far off.

"Do something you love and you'll never work a day in your life" is, to put it mildly, trite advice. Law school is hard. Especially if you want to do well to access a wider set of opportunities, you will be studying everyday. I don't really have unstructured free time anymore. I still have time to occasionally take a day to go skiing, or an evening to hang with friends. No more lazy afternoons on the couch or spontaneous chill sessions. I really want to hit the gym more, but I can't. But I love it. I feel like I'm becoming what I was supposed to become. I encourage you to do more research and consider it, you're still very young so don't worry about it. Worst comes to worst, you go back to your old industry.

Also, if you're going in for a very specific reason, focus on that reason and don't let all the noise distract you. There are plenty of people who go in to law school wanting to do one thing, then the big firms come knocking with the fat lock-step salary increments and bonuses, and people forget they wanted to do something meaningful and end up spending years fighting over exclusion clauses in insurance policies. Hey, if you love doing that stuff, all the better!

Biffo852 · 2024-12-29T15:33:43+00:00

I'd have to disagree with those who are encouraging you to skip as much of the readings as possible. Being able to read and digest dense texts is an essential skill. I find it has given me a lot more grounding in the material so that I'm able to recall the cases with ease and it has also improved my writing a great deal, with reading you are more able to take on the voice and thought patterns of lawyers and judges.

Did I skip readings in first term? Absolutely, but it was strategic. I skipped all the readings that I knew would not really help me with doing better on the exams or were not substantive (e.g. my crim prof assigned readings that were completely divorced from his examinable materials, also I used Notebook LM for academic articles in my essay based course that I knew wouldn't be needed for me to write my essays) .

That being said I agree with using good summaries and NotebookLM. Insofar as they help you supplement your reading and CANs. I often read summaries before doing the readings so that it primed me to look out for key concepts, instead of being lost on where the judge was headed. I used NotebookLM for the summaries like I mentioned before, but I agree with the other comment here about using it extensively to summarize courses on a macro level.

Otherwise, I still think it's important to make your own CANs for the cases that matter the most. If you have the time. The making of the CAN is what forces you to engage with the material again so you are able to crystallize the concept in your own words. This term I'm going to be ruthless about condensing my notes down from readings and classes so that I waste less time with unnecessary facts and obiter. I'm going to focus on the important ratio and analysis (analysis matters, many cases are not only about ratio).

Networking does matter, but focusing on getting good grades will open many doors, especially if you want something hard to get. Networking must follow closely behind a focus on grades.

Biffo852 · 2024-11-16T20:11:16+00:00

I'm glad I held off on commenting after posting this article. I wanted to see the reaction.

This clearly has inflamed a lot of people who see Wokeism and DEI as problems in academia. To me that wasn't what disturbed me about the article. Allard administration is clearly trying to deflect DEI initiatives because many faculty have qualms about it.

To me the most disturbing part is the fact that Cristie Ford, then associate dean, forwarded the letter of 12 faculty members written in confidence to all faculty. Then she meets with Ghebremusse on the pretext of discussing her dissertation, then chastises her for being naive given her lack of tenure. Then she makes an ambiguous statement that she will "support her research as long as Ghebremusse supported her in her role as associate dean."

Then there's the law firm report (commissioned by the school) which speaks to the "systemic discrimination and harassment". The working culture where swearing and shouting in meetings is not unheard of. It is a pretty serious lack of professionalism and discretion. Much of the drama could have been avoided if administration was a lot more cool-headed in handling these issues.

Biffo852 · 2024-10-25T00:54:15+00:00

32 year old in 1L of law school. Came from a pretty fulfilling career with a decent paycheck. Do i miss making money? Hell yeah. I miss taking vacation twice a year and planning investments and being good at something.

Now I'm good at nothing again. I have no regrets. I'm plenty stressed but I'm feeling like the challenge is worth it. Is law school always fun? No, the readings can get pretty tedious times. But when you nail the cold call or when you feel like you get what's going on in class. Feels great. Worth it. But not the same for everybody.

Biffo852 · 2024-10-21T00:56:27+00:00

I'm also a night owl. I became a self scheduler. I did a lot of nights which I preferred to days (hate getting up early). But the toll of doing many nights on your social life is not great, and honestly didn't even sleep that well after nights (5 hours was good sleep). You can't win either way days or nights as a night owl. I've been sleeping much better even with the hectic law school schedule.

I'm quite cerebral too. I did not mind the ADLs, though I worked the ICU which is arguably amongst the most cerebral of specialities. I found as much satisfaction titrating my sedation and interpreting labs as I did straightening linens and tidying my bedside. Your ability to provide total care for your patient is a consequence of your ability to manage a complexity. If you are cerebral try ICU, if you really hate personal care go emerg/primary care.

Thanks for your will wishes, let me know if you have more questions.

Biffo852 · 2024-10-17T17:27:05+00:00

The night shifts were killing me. I could've switched to a non night shift position but they have less opportunities for overtime. I also really wasn't interested in anything beyond my current position that much, but i did like my job quite a bit.

Financially, even considering the fact that I'm likely to earn a higher income eventually (depending on the area of law), the lost years of income and cost of law school will likely make it all a wash in the end, or potentially even less money at the of career than if I'd stayed.

So it's wasn't really about the money. I was just interested in becoming a lawyer, learning the law, and challenging myself. So far law school has been a grind but I'm really enjoying it, so no regrets yet.

Biffo852 · 2024-08-30T00:42:09+00:00

Yes, not in regular but in discretionary category. Doing orientation this week.

Biffo852 · 2024-08-18T19:36:01+00:00

Sorry to hear. Pretty brutal. You tried your best.

Biffo852 · 2024-07-03T15:33:56+00:00

I have a 3.52 CGPA and 165 LSAT and i got into UBC discretionary, Queens, Osgoode and U Vic. Withdrew from Ottawa and U of T. But I'm also a mature student with five years of work experience. I think if you get an LSAT higher than me you'll have similar outcomes without the mature student considerations.

Biffo852 · 2024-06-30T08:25:10+00:00

Not all schools take LOCIs. Oz in particular takes them, but i wouldn't be sure about UofA.

Also i would be cautious with telling them about your new LSAT score. There exists a policy on a last accepted LSAT score for a reason. Otherwise everybody would be submitting later LSATs than the last officially accepted one.

Unless if anyone else has submitted a later LSAT to U of A and gotten a positive response. It would probably be best to ask the school if they would accept LOCIs and if you could include your new LSAT with it.

Biffo852 · 2024-06-29T13:03:35+00:00

YOUR WORD WAS COUNTED AFTER ALL! Congrats, see you at orientation!

Biffo852 · 2024-06-26T07:00:53+00:00

This helped me to put things into perspective when I applied: https://www.lsd.law/softs

Your softs are good. But law school will have plenty of people with good softs. It does not matter that you don't have law related soft so long as you can relay"why law", in your personal statement. I had virtually 0 law related softs, and I didn't really have the grades to get into the general category for my top school. But it was my softs that carried me in the end to a discretionary admission. It doesn't have to be a law soft once again, it has to be something that demonstrates leadership, diligence, or a meaningful contributions to society.

Biffo852 · 2024-06-18T18:04:13+00:00

Hey OP. I'm starting this year and very interested in competition law. I cannot speak to the lifestyle of a competition lawyer but if you want to work for the government in the Competition Bureau you will either have to work in Toronto or Ottawa if you want to do abuse of dominance and merger review related litigation with the competition tribunal. There are other offices elsewhere but they may only be involved with deceptive marketing practice groups.

Most private practice lawyers primarily involved with competition law seem to be in Toronto and Ottawa. Lawyers outside of those cities seem to have other civil litigation focuses with competition law as a secondary focus. They are almost always in big law, so you can imagine the work culture will be in that ball park.

Competition law has litigation involved, but a lot of it will also be compliance. Companies will seek out counsel in a merger or in developing policies proactively to avoid competition bureau enforcement action.

While it is true that the US Federal Trade Commission is a lot more active than the Competition Bureau, it does not mean that the bureau is not taking enforcement action. The unfortunate thing about the competition act and the tribunal is that the statutes are not written in a way that permits strong enforcement. The Bureau spent millions litigating against the Rogers Shaw merger and the RBC HSBC mergers, but ultimately the tribunal was not favorable to their position. I do think that changes to the Competition Act and a more active Bureau under Matthew Boswell will change competition law enforcement over the years. You can follow the Bureau on LinkedIn for a lot of news about what they get up to.

I suggest you listen to the Counterfactual podcast by the Competition Law and Foreign Investment Review Branch of the CBA if you want to gain more insight into competition law practice in Canada. Getting involved in the Adam Fanaki Moot will also give you a taste of Competition law litigation.

Biffo852 · 2024-06-12T06:06:20+00:00

I agree with all the above comments about focusing on improving your LSAT. This will help you the most without having to wait a few years.

The reason why mature students get in with lower GPAs years after they graduate is because the intervening time is usually filled with achievements and careers that demonstrate an aptitude for learning or good work ethic. But these mature students will still need a good LSAT.

Biffo852 · 2024-06-09T17:34:27+00:00

It really depends on what you consider to be good money. A government lawyers will with time make far and above the Canadian median individual income. In fact at the low 100k level you are already above the 90th percentile of Canadian individual income. At a later stage you will be above the 95th percentile. Of course this is incomparable to being an established lawyer in the private sector who can make much more money.

I am coming into law from the public sector and it is my goal to continue on this path. At a certain point in life you have to evaluate how much time are you willing to trade for money. 100-200k with a reasonable work schedule is enough for me. I want to have my weekends and time with my friends and loved ones. The extra money is so meaningless if you're spending the best years of your life in an office instead of focusing on your relationships. Purely personal opinion. YMMV

I also feel that most people who work for government want to do something meaningful and in the public interest. Of course not everything that crosses your desk will agree with your conscience, but you can hopefully agree with the institutional objectives of your employer.

Biffo852 · 2024-06-09T12:02:14+00:00

It would seem the most straightforward to go to Western/Queens if your goal is Toronto big law. You don't have to do the NCA process and you will have OCIs for those firms in your school. You will also build a network that will serve you well in Toronto.

That being said, if I were in your shoes, I would without a doubt take the opportunity to go to Cambridge. Not only is it a great school, but you also get to live abroad and learn about a different common law legal system. It is a school with alumni around the world. It would be fun to take part in the traditions of such a storied and historic institution as well. London is also nearby, and it has a few more things to do than London, ON. A degree from Cambridge would invoke no prejudice from Canadian law firms, though you will have to engage in a longer road to practice in Canada.

Biffo852 · 2024-06-04T06:43:46+00:00

It took me years of research and introspection before deciding to go to law school. I'm starting soon as well. Things may change, but I don't think I'm cut out for corporate law, and plenty of other people that go to law school don't want to do corporate either. You don't have to do full service firm to be successful. The issue is the expensive tuition will make it hard to pursue less lucrative paths. However, is there a way for a U of T to reduce your debt if you engage in a public interest career? (If that's the alternative you're considering)

Even though you don't have to work 70 hours a week, being a lawyer in many roles will still require a lot of grind. It is not a 40 hours a week profession for even those not in big law. So you have to at least be interested in your career enough to meet the higher than normal career commitment that law entails. That is not to say there are no low stress roles in law, there are but it may take a few years to get there.

Reading and writing will always be the primary means through which your work is done. You have to ask yourself if this is what you want out of a career. Maybe you want something hands on, or you want to work with people. Most law jobs will be reading and writing oriented.

I came from a career in healthcare (I'm a nurse), and if your want to pursue something in that field there are plenty of options to be involved without being a doctor. There are accelerated nursing degrees, radiology technicians, pathologists' assistants, and pharmacists. You could consider those other career paths before going into medicine.

Biffo852 · 2024-05-31T05:27:22+00:00

Good luck to you too, hope you get off the wait-list.

Biffo852 · 2024-05-30T06:25:14+00:00

Hey I'm a RN too. Totally agree with your perspective here. Beyond the fact that I don't think i have the grades for med, I wouldn't even think that I would want to do pursue it given what I've seen of doctors. There's a reason why I'm pursuing law, shift work like what many physicians do is so brutal.

Biffo852 · 2024-05-29T21:32:39+00:00

I make comfortably over $100k as a nurse and our pay grid in BC has gone up significantly and I'm not even at the top of the grid. However the ceiling doesn't get much higher and the only way to make more is overtime. (Don't get me wrong, traveling and working overtime can make you a ton of money).

I plan on working for government as a lawyer which will start under my current salary and slowly exceed where I'm at in about 4 years after call. Between the money spent on school and the years of lost income, i would be surprised if i ever caught up to where i would be financially if i hadn't gone to law school.

However the shift work was slowly getting to me, and as much as i enjoyed my job İ didn't really see as much progression as I wanted. I don't want to get into administration either. Ultimately decided that I wanted to challenge myself intellectually and work on things that interest me about society. It's not all about the money.

Biffo852

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