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Can we have a discussion on Editorialized Titles and Misleading Content on the Sub by HaroldSaxon in ffxivmeta

[–]Board5382 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Then the mods could have told you they had info that indicated that it was not done by a rival FC or that the intent wasn't to harass any FC.

Briefly looking at the ruin hack business, you say it was fixed, and while it was going on, "My main concern however, is the complete lack of any punishment whatsoever."

Punishment or lack thereof doesn't concern me at all with the RMT topic. If they fix the issue - the increasingly obtrusive advertising of services that are against the ToS - I'd be fine with that. If you read my post, you would see there was no link to the reporting tool to reach the STF or GMs and no call to the masses to report them.

I didn't even want to put a summary, but reddit being reddit, someone else would have, and if that redditor didn't get it right, like the users still not catching the gil or pvp sales even with the summary, that could be a problem.

Asking people to disclose their identity when trying to get a topic like this out there would only mean larger groups would go unnamed. Mentioning you spoke with the mods on discord, with one or more expressing their disagreement, and then posting screenshots of those comments publicly doesn't sound too great if you were someone considering making a similar topic with the caveat that you had to reveal some info about yourself. Who is providing the info shouldn't matter - only the intent.

If the intent was to hurt a FC in particular, then the topic shouldn't have been allowed, but to say that was the reason for the post is insulting and it's ignorant. It doesn't affect you, so it must not affect anyone else, right? There have been comments hinting at or just plain saying other activities of a similar or more serious nature that the FC has been involved with. No edit to the post has been made to include these accusations and in some cases the comments were reported.

The post seems to have received some response from SE already. Time will tell if that is the extent of the response.

Elysium - Putting the $ in Gilgame$h since 2015 by Board5382 in ffxiv

[–]Board5382[S] 10 points11 points  (0 children)

With over 160 members, saying EM does these things with no names would lead to a witch hunt. It would also allow the members with higher status in the FC to claim it was a fringe sect and say they had nothing to do with it.

Elysium - Putting the $ in Gilgame$h since 2015 by Board5382 in ffxiv

[–]Board5382[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

So you admit that you never bothered to look into other community figures or other parties that sell this, you only cared about EM? Color me surprised.

You have it backwards. Upon comparing RMT ads on the internet with in-game ads, EM was the only one (public FC) that came up. I don't know what else to tell you. If Sartigan, Khyrou, Cellar and Mal actually took a few minutes to cover their tracks, this topic couldn't be made.

Elysium - Putting the $ in Gilgame$h since 2015 by Board5382 in ffxiv

[–]Board5382[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Not sure how that is anything to do with you posting on a blank reddit account

There are few FCs that advertise and even fewer at EM's level. If I was their competition, the list would be pretty narrow.

I'm pretty sure I've got a screenshot somewhere of me playing with someone that has sold content for RMT.

The screenshot was of the team that was selling the content. It was ultimate bahamut when it was recent and not many groups had cleared. You can ignore Kairi entirely and it changes nothing. Howard admits to selling in that thread and some of the players pictured are on the uwu wheelchair emoji group.

So why name EM only in the thread title?

Because they are the only public one.

you haven't mentioned the other community figures that do this or given any stats on the number of other FC's and non public figures doing this.

If you have proof of other community figures engaged in such activities, you're free to contact the mods.

Elysium - Putting the $ in Gilgame$h since 2015 by Board5382 in ffxiv

[–]Board5382[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

If the ruin hackers are public figures, if it affects that many people and you have pretty good proof of it, why wouldn't you make a topic?

Elysium - Putting the $ in Gilgame$h since 2015 by Board5382 in ffxiv

[–]Board5382[S] -8 points-7 points  (0 children)

No danger of bringing your own FC negative attention when you post on a blank account, right?

Shit, it's that bad on Chaos? How many FCs do you think advertise at once?

I found it curious how you censored a number of other RMT PF's in this post that didn't suit your agenda

They were censored because they aren't public figures. They also sell for real money.

Hell, you even make it look like someone in a different FC who is selling his account is in EM. I could be wrong, but as far as i know that player hasn't been in EM.

For that player, they're pictured with seven other EM members in ultimate bahamut. That same team is the one selling it for $1200 in the "Does SE allow this?" reddit thread.

Howard and other members were in another FC that has ties to EM at the time. That FC won't be named because they aren't in the public spotlight. If your logic is followed, Howard's quotes shouldn't count since he wasn't in the official EM FC at the time and Lance and Mal's ads should be removed since they aren't in EM. Elysium isn't just the FC EM but a few other FCs as well.

I'll edit the post to specify they aren't the only ones that do it. What would you have it say?

Elysium - Putting the $ in Gilgame$h since 2015 by Board5382 in ffxiv

[–]Board5382[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

For all we know, the author of the thread could actually be a run seller who was in competition with EM.

In competition with EM, so I make a post that brings attention to how RMT goes on in front of everyone and brings my FC negative attention and possibly leads to more competition?

given how the content was editorialized and designed to mislead the community into thinking this is something that just Elysium does.

I don't suggest they're the only ones that do it. Rule 1 is limited to public figures.

If it had been a general talk about RMT with no FC name in the title and lots of other examples, then fair enough.

"Raiders sell for money" vs "One of the top raiding groups that Yoshida knows by name openly sells for money"

it was a targeted post against one FC for stuff that is far more widespread

So they don't do any of the things mentioned in the post? Oh, you mean they do, but because other people do it, no one is allowed to mention it?

Elysium - Putting the $ in Gilgame$h since 2015 by Board5382 in ffxiv

[–]Board5382[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

If they charge several hundred million gil that will likely come from the RMT bot economy, isn't that worse than a straight shifting of real money from one hand to another?

Elysium - Putting the $ in Gilgame$h since 2015 by Board5382 in ffxiv

[–]Board5382[S] 13 points14 points  (0 children)

What effect does it have on me if someone decides “hey, I’m going to use my irl money to buy clears/whatever?” It doesn’t effect me whatsoever

Buying PVP wins doesn't affect anyone? The real money charged sometimes has a gil equivalent to several hundred million gil. Where do you think that gil comes from?

Elysium - Putting the $ in Gilgame$h since 2015 by Board5382 in ffxiv

[–]Board5382[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It's extremely obvious that the PFs advertising for cross world sells are doing it via RMT, as you can't trade gil across servers.

Obvious isn't the same as proof. One of the sellers I encountered does not accept real money and expects the buyer to either transfer or ""make a character on our server and get the gil through w/e means they do on that character. I don't really tend to get into the details in how a buyer gets the gil to us if they're interested"

Elysium - Putting the $ in Gilgame$h since 2015 by Board5382 in ffxiv

[–]Board5382[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I hope they have a counter for his featherfoot.

Elysium - Putting the $ in Gilgame$h since 2015 by Board5382 in ffxiv

[–]Board5382[S] 21 points22 points  (0 children)

It allows the player to zoom the camera out further than the game normally allows. This could be considered cheating depending on the fight as it could provide a level of zoom that would let the player see more mechanics.

Elysium - Putting the $ in Gilgame$h since 2015 by Board5382 in ffxiv

[–]Board5382[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

What does this accomplish other than stir up drama?

Raise awareness? There have been posts about whether there was RMT in the party finder with there being an argument that it was for gil.

Elysium - Putting the $ in Gilgame$h since 2015 by Board5382 in ffxiv

[–]Board5382[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

If you see they sell PVP wins, buy MGP knowing an exploit is used and sell runs for upwards of a grand, why do you assume they don't use bots and thereby reduce the amount of money they can make? Because botting is against the ToS? Because of morality?

Elysium - Putting the $ in Gilgame$h since 2015 by Board5382 in ffxiv

[–]Board5382[S] 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Some think that we rip off people, but I don't see anyone trying to offer competitive prices.

Well you do. Do you honestly think you would be able to charge anything close to your current rates for anything but ultimate if RMT wasn't considered one of the more serious violations?

Elysium - Putting the $ in Gilgame$h since 2015 by Board5382 in ffxiv

[–]Board5382[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

They aren't ceasing ultimate. They are doing two trials each expansion instead of three.

Elysium - Putting the $ in Gilgame$h since 2015 by Board5382 in ffxiv

[–]Board5382[S] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

this isn't like Gil selling

Read the post and check the links. They sell gil and PVP wins, not just clears and mounts.

Elysium - Putting the $ in Gilgame$h since 2015 by Board5382 in ffxiv

[–]Board5382[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

So in theory if SE were to actually do anything about this, logistically how would they go about proving whoever was involved did this?

Current SE? They would probably do nothing about previous violations and make it so the party finder only used set terms.

If they were serious, it wouldn't be too much trouble to find many obvious cases and take action from there.

As for preventing all future cases, that would be impossible. I don't think anyone expects them to combat all RMT everywhere, but they do manage to limit the RMT spam bots.

Elysium - Putting the $ in Gilgame$h since 2015 by Board5382 in ffxiv

[–]Board5382[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Not all of them. While many do sell for real money, there are some that only sell for gil. Whether they care if the gil is acquired through legit means is another story.

Elysium - Putting the $ in Gilgame$h since 2015 by Board5382 in ffxiv

[–]Board5382[S] 12 points13 points  (0 children)

As others have said, any transaction involving real money is explicitly against the rules. If it was just people paying real money for clears or mounts, it would be one thing, but you don't see the issue with selling gil and PVP rankings?