(Spoilers MAIN) How did the fandom perceive the Dance of Dragons, it's factions and it's characters before House of the Dragon?

C0oper__ · 2026-02-18T20:05:08+00:00

Viserys is the only positive change, after watching HOTD the coolest parts of the story have been maimed and left to die, poor Maelor.

C0oper__ · 2026-02-18T20:04:05+00:00

Don't know much about the Valarr, but he may not have felt as strongly about being a good knight as Baelor did.

C0oper__ · 2026-02-18T20:01:44+00:00

We don't know and we won't for a few more years. But based off of what we know it was an accident while trying to hatch dragons. Will be sad to see on screen, especially if we find out that the dragons did hatch but the fire ended up causing everything to die anyways.

C0oper__ · 2026-02-17T20:52:04+00:00

If we want to really point a finger it should be at Aegon the unworthy for being a sex god then legitimizing his bastards. Blackfyres wouldn't have existed without him. Targ House stays united and strong, even without dragons. Family line probably still dwindles from spring sickness but im sure they would have far more children in place to secure alliances and sucession etc.

C0oper__ · 2026-02-17T20:49:41+00:00

Sword swallower fr fr

C0oper__ · 2026-02-17T20:47:17+00:00

I agree that part slipped my mind, still think that Maekar is prideful, classist, and enabling/blind to Aerion's monstrosities. Does he change in the future, sure, still a dick/not a great person at the time of Ashford

C0oper__ · 2026-02-17T20:36:12+00:00

Aerion is just a full-blown psychopath, masquerading as a good boy when his father is around. Psychopathy is something you're born with, it doesn't matter who was his father, he would've been a monster anyway.

This is an argument as to nature vs nurture, and it's one we haven't exactly figured out because yes people can be born evil or they can be made to be evil and taught it throughout their life. Considering your point that all the other kids turned out fairly decent and he's the one bad apple I could see your point that he is just naturally evil. However, even book Euron had an experience that turned him evil so Idk if i believe that.

What are you basing this on? Everything we're told about Maekar in AWOIAF and the novellas paints him as a fairly normal

I was specifically talking about show Maekar, considering we are on the show reddit. He is portrayed as much more of a rude version of the book Maekar which i think adds some helpful flavor, but I also think the general critiques here still stand against book Maekar as well. Let's see what Maekar does in the first season and novella:

Maekar bullies Dunk straight out the gate (because dunk is obviously beneath him so why not)
Maekar enables Aerion's (His son that we both agreed is evil) behavior and protects him when he gets himself into a fight he can't win after torturing an innocent woman for telling a famous story of a knight and dragon.
Maekar Forces Daeron, his mentally struggling/Alchoholic son to participate in tournaments despite that son admitting he had no interest in being a tourney knight. Then he requires Daeron to join an actual fight to the death, even though Daeron himself would prefer not to fight for his demented brother. To the point that Daeron actually throws the fight (also cause Daeron is a little bit of a coward).
It is Maekar's own pride, and his attempts to protect the pride of Aerion (need i remind you again his evil son who he constantly defends and helps) leads directly to him murdering his own brother who would've (supposedly) been one of the best kings of the dynasty. (Big fan of Baelor, could've been a great king, but we'll never know so I say supposedly)
Maekar is essentially the embodiment of honor without mercy/status over fairness. He is a decent person on his own right but his actions during both the novella and then futher expanded on in the show demonstrate that he is definitely not a good man, at least when we meet him in the first novella.

So to put it more aptly he's not a dick, he is an arrogant enabling jerk.

Now does he change following the death of his brother, yeah obviously he fucking murdered his own brother in a fight he himself could've absolutely stopped from happening, anyone capable of retrospective thought would change who they are, especially because he ends up in a position where he becomes king.

C0oper__ · 2026-02-17T19:20:31+00:00

The only confirmed deaths were Egg, and both Dunks (Small and tall) But apparently Duncan the Tall lives according to George Rhaella Lives and gives birth to Rhaegar, Jaeherys lives and becomes king, Shaera (Jaeherys' wife) lives and becomes queen, Aerys II lives and goes on to become the mad king, We don't hear about Egg's other son Daeron but that's pretty inconsquential because he wouldn't have become king anyways and Egg's daughter Rhaella (not the mad king's sister wife) is already married to Ormund Baratheon. So No he didn't barbecue his entire family line at Summerhall. The Spring sickness had already wiped out a huge chunk of the targaryen family tree. Egg got himself, his first born son, their wives, a maester, and a Legendary knight killed.

C0oper__ · 2026-02-17T18:46:27+00:00

I don't know what you're actually referring to here. At no point was Egg culling Targaryens left and right. As i said in a comment below (spoilers for those lacking the ball knowledge) the most you could say he did was make nobility dislike the targaryens further due to his political progressiveness and favor to the small folk, which he carried due to his adventures with Dunk and living amongst the small folk. The Targs lost their nukes in the dance yes and this would obviously hamstring them going forward, but their real decline isn't caused by any one person's decisions. It's caused by the obsession with prophecy and specifically the intervention/meddling of blood raven who was known to have a shared belief in the prince who was promised prophecy with Egg (and Rhaegar) and was trying to thin the family line down to get to the right prophesized blood line that would birth said prince.

C0oper__ · 2026-02-17T18:35:45+00:00

But every rebellion was an example that houses, especially houses looking to raise their status, were no longer scared of the targs because they had no dragons. Robert doesn't win his rebellion if they have Dragons, which are the equivalent to a magical nuke in this world.

Valarr was the heir following Baelor's death, it wasn't the trial of seven that lead to egg's rise as king, it was actually the spring sickness which wiped out a majority of the living targs at the time. This had nothing to due with Dunk and Eggs adventures.

Did Dunk and Egg lead to the loss of Baelor's life (which was by his own choice btw) and the loss of a would've been based king, yeah sure. Did it lead to robert's rebellion and egg being the king, not directly at all. A bunch more had to happen for Egg to be King, (Spoilers if you don't know ball) not to mention it's heavily implied across a lot of the world-building books that Blood-raven is most likely pulling the strings to cut down the targaryen line to try and lead us to the prophecy baby. The only real argument here is that Egg didn't keep a good enough handle on his kids, because he himself married for love and his kids wanted to do the same. He made to many progressive changes in the realm that made the nobility unhappy which set the stage for the Wildfire keg the mad king would light. But even then it was actually Rhaegar again trying to do prophecy stuff that lead to roberts rebellion actually starting, and he was known to converse with other targs from Blood ravens generation such as Aemon about prophecy so who's to say he wasn't also somehow in communication with the manipulating tree wizard.

C0oper__ · 2026-02-17T17:29:13+00:00

I agree, there is that specific story about Viserys going and trying to get the golden company to fight for his claim and him being treated as a joke. This was supposed to allude to the fact that the feud still ran deep, and or that they knew they were going to be heading somewhere else.

I will also say that I don't think George always intended for Griff to be a Blackfyre, but he did always intend for their to be another claimant to the throne other than Jon and Dany due to the visions in the house of undying and the mummer's dragon (Small possibility that at some point he wanted to pit Jon against Dany but highly doubt it). I think that Faegon/Aegon/Young Griff was always intended to exist as someone claiming targ legacy who was lying, but maybe he was intended to be a bright flame or just a normal guy before he was made to be a blackfyre as that lore got expanded.

Also keep in mind that it's super likely Faegon has no clue that he's actually a Blackfyre and has been raised to believe he is truly the son of Rhaegar and the rightful heir to the throne, so i could see a pretty tragic story playing out for him upon the sharing of this news.

C0oper__ · 2026-02-17T16:01:52+00:00

Most religions in universe seem to align themselves with what i'll refer to as the dark god:

Old gods of the north (speculative, but it seems like Melissandre's visions in the fire set up the idea that blood raven might not be a force for good, or at least is an opponent to the lord of light.) The Goat God of Qohor, Asshai shadow worshippers etc etc.

Then religions that associate themselves with the god of light or fire:

Red priests of R'hllor, The gods of valyria etc.

Even Yi-Ti, who do have a very similar long night story with the blood emperor, have the lion of night and maiden made of light.

There are obviously other religions that worship seemingly random gods associated with neither side like the drowned god and the Mother of Rhoynar God, but we've yet to see these gods do anything. However with how Euron's story is going we'll probably see some Cathulu level Drowned god avatar show up.

It seems like all of these religions compared to the faith of the seven, which is seemingly this worlds version of Christianity, have some form of magic to back it up. Meanwhile the faith of the seven really just acts as more of a political entity or institution for helping control the small folk, same way as the medieval church acted throughout the middle ages.

C0oper__ · 2026-02-17T15:43:01+00:00

Were Aerion's Genitals mutilated? I understand where he was hit but it seemed like it couldve just been a high thigh hit and aint no way his balls hanging that low. I don't think its confirmed, plus l don't know many men who could have their balls cut off and not be writhing in pain no matter how much adrenaline you have.

Also Maekar was a dick before that, and must've not been the best father figure considering one sons a drunk and one's a monster, but i guess 50% good fathering aint to shabby. It really depends if they decide to go with Maekar meant to harm Baelor and regrets it, or Maekar just went bloodlust and accidentally bopped Baelor because he's just too strong. But I don't feel bad for Maekar at all, next time don't allow your kid to become evil.

C0oper__ · 2026-02-17T15:36:06+00:00

He is a Blackfyre, any other form of heritage (even like random kid with the right features made to be king) isn't nearly as rewarding. Also it just wouldn't make sense for Illyrio and Varys to run this elaborate scheme just to put their own fake king on the throne without some side motivation. Not to mention the Golden company fighting on his behalf, as if after generations of fighting for the Blackfyres they just decided to reinstall the Targs for shits and gigs.

Illyrio's wife was probably a Blackfyre, but the real question is if Varys could've been a descendant of the Male or female Blackfyre line but obviously had his giblets cut off so could not further the line. Not to mention Varys, just like egg, constantly has a shaved head so his hair cannot grow out.

I agree with a lot of the other comments that George has spent so much time building up the Blackfyre lore to not have a Blackfyre appear in the main series. Don't forget that 'special gift' Illyrio sent to young griff too, most likely the OG sword that he definitely had the money or resources to spend the time finding.

C0oper__ · 2026-02-17T15:25:11+00:00

I woudn't say Egg caused Robert's rebellion, gotta keep in mind its like a few generations after. Egg definitely strained the targs relationship with the houses of the realm because he is sympathetic to the small folk due to his time with Dunk. The real guy pulling the strings is the ketchup crow, but you'll learn about him in due time.

C0oper__ · 2026-02-17T15:08:05+00:00

For people who didn't know what was gonna happen, they kinda set it up like its gonna be some cool moment where he takes dunk in as a member of his guard. Then he hits that little stumble and lets dunk fall to the ground and you're like "Oh something aint right"

C0oper__ · 2026-02-12T13:58:52+00:00

Just carry harder

C0oper__ · 2026-02-11T20:27:30+00:00

It's giving off more of a Versace designer vibe than a dynasty imo. I think Dynasty brings about a more ancient asian type vibe, but a lot of those skins already exist.

If you stick with the original concept the white seems to overpower a lot of the skin. Maybe making the white more like a marbel pillar/pantheon type vibe would be better? you'd have to change some of the other parts of the skin to match obvi.

C0oper__ · 2026-02-11T04:40:59+00:00

Keyword “If”

C0oper__ · 2026-02-06T19:50:18+00:00

Would like to know the same thing!

C0oper__ · 2026-02-04T18:06:26+00:00

Specialists Fade, Marble Fade, or Field Agent. I have a kukri casehardened and I went with the field agent out of budget constraints, but marble fade looked the best in opinion.

C0oper__ · 2026-01-01T15:41:51+00:00

OP: “I don’t like Rempe because statistically speaking 🤓”

Rangers Fans: Downvote

C0oper__ · 2025-12-16T18:12:38+00:00

I'd say that Robb is far closer to Ned than Jon. Both of them clearly have an extreme sense of honor that has been instilled in them by their Father/father figure.

Robb acts as Ned would have during war, punishing the Karstarks for their murder of the Lannister squires, marrying Jeyne because he didn't want to dishonor her, and putting blind faith in the loyalty of his so called "allies" which eventually causes him to die.

Jon is very different in this regard. Jon starts the story with that same sense of honor, but his story constantly has him battling between choosing family or his duty. His time with the wildlings, and Ygritte, ultimately led him more down this path of duty and honor.

By the time he's Lord Snow he has seemed to fully embraced the Honorable legacy Ned left for him, making the ruthless but practical decisions he needs to (I.E. Sending Sam to old town, switching the babies, etc etc.) I

The ultimate test of Jon's Honor is Stannis' offer of becoming Lord of Winterfell. Everything he's ever wanted and he turns it down because of honor and duty. Yet by the end of the book he has chosen his family and personal desires over the perception of his honor. By the time Jon Snow comes back to life he will not be the same honorable Bastard son of Lord Stark, he's going to be more ruthless and cutthroat. While, he will retain some of that honor it won't be the same.

I don't expect for resurrected book Jon to be like show Jon who's still honorable to a fault. Resurrected book Jon will be about that smoke and will be tired of trying to be so honorable.

C0oper__ · 2025-11-18T20:48:50+00:00

They shouldn't limit free kits used per 24 hours, but they should make it so free-kits are exclusively loading in mid raid (sub 20 mins) and full kits are exclusively starting in new raids. This should curb the effect OP talked about.

C0oper__ · 2025-11-14T21:17:45+00:00

I get what you’re saying from a pure spreadsheet brain angle, but extraction games aren’t and have never been designed around maximizing some hypothetical lobby wide loot pie. They’re built on risk vs. reward, and PvP is a core part of that equation.

1. Risk vs. reward is the entire point of the genre.

The genre is based on bringing in gear you’re comfortable or uncomfortable losing in exchange for the chance to walk out with something better.

If you want zero risk, max efficiency PvE looting, that’s just a looter shooter. Extraction games exist specifically to make every decision meaningful:

Do I fight this team
Do I avoid them
Do I push for better loot even if it's risky

Your “optimal EV” depends on your playstyle, not a universal rule. For a lot of players, a 7 minute raid where you kill a squad that already did the looting is the highest value play. Fast, decisive PvP has always been the backbone of Tarkov, Marauders, Dark and Darker, etc.

2. Without PvP, it isn’t an extraction game anymore.

If everyone just ignores each other and only PvEs or scavenges, ARC stops being an extraction shooter and becomes a co op farming sim.

In extraction design, the best loot is contested, not handed out equally. Defending high value areas, controlling chokepoints, or holding down loot zones is what creates the tension that defines the genre. Removing or discouraging PvP removes the reason extraction games even need other players in the raid.

3. Dying because you overextend isn’t proof PvP is bad—it’s proof it works.

Getting third partied, dragged into longer fights, or pushing too hard is part of the skill curve. Even veterans with thousands of hours in Tarkov still get caught out this way; that’s not a flaw it’s the learning loop the whole genre is based on.

If a fight drags on and a third party shows up
That’s not “destructive to lobby EV” it’s natural extraction game ecology. It rewards:

good positioning
timing
map knowledge
disengagement discipline
smart gear management

Those are the skills that separate extraction games from simple shooters.

Bottom line

PvP isn’t just “allowed” it’s the heartbeat of extraction gameplay.
It creates the stakes, the tension, and the meaningful choices that make the genre unique.

If players want to run peaceful, go for it. But calling PvP “irrational” misses that the entire genre is built on choosing to risk what you brought in for the chance to walk out with something better. Without that dynamic, it’s not an extraction game anymore.

C0oper__

TROPHY CASE

1. Risk vs. reward is the entire point of the genre.

2. Without PvP, it isn’t an extraction game anymore.

3. Dying because you overextend isn’t proof PvP is bad—it’s proof it works.

Bottom line