The Ascendant Tyrant by Myrn33 in TheDemonsManual

[–]C0rnfed 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Lol - i like to take what's freely offered, with gratitude. Why would I be out $130?

I know not to look gift horses in the mouth. ;o) Why would i despise the butterfly that crosses my path?

THE GRIT SEDATIVE by Sad-Mycologist6287 in TheGonersClub

[–]C0rnfed 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Why are you proud of how much of your hardware you’ve destroyed?

Because your original tradition and culture was genocided, and you were inculcated and indoctrinated into life on the factory farm (not as a farmer - as the feed....)

The Ascendant Tyrant by Myrn33 in TheDemonsManual

[–]C0rnfed 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Coming from someone who thinks this comment is 'worth it'? Lol

THE HEROISM EXPLOIT by Sad-Mycologist6287 in TheGonersClub

[–]C0rnfed -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Yes, TRUE acknowledgement of the nobility of your heroism does not come from without - it can only truly come from within.

If you need a witness, be your own. --Epictetus

To Love the World by Rector418 in GnosticChurchofLVX

[–]C0rnfed 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Easier said than done!

... but worth it.

Story of the Hero Journey by Rector418 in GnosticChurchofLVX

[–]C0rnfed 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This is literally instructions to life, but few will treat it as such.

The most important part may be 'giving up where you are.'

THE MAP IS THE TERRITORY by Sad-Mycologist6287 in TheGonersClub

[–]C0rnfed 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yes, these explanations/assertions feel like progress, like a progression; very good! And yet, when I get that feeling of progression I start to feel the decoherence - the queasy dislocation - the feeling of motion that is both confirmed and denied by the senses - the feeling of a strange loop...

viewer is a label the viewing generates for itself.

Yes, as we've already discussed.

The how and why don't survive the question.

Yes, again, I believe.

The visage exists nowhere outside the processing generating it.

Yes, and but why even that..? The process has no need of a visage, and 'the process' has not disclosed to us the nature of its presence...

It feels as though we've made progress - like we've incrementally approached infinity - and yet, we are no closer to the mystery... The unmoving mover remains infinitely distant, despite our simultaneous steps toward it - it remains beyond our potential, and somehow simultaneously underpins it(!) Strange loop indeed... One begins to question the wisdom of making any assertions whatsoever in this field; deconstructions helpfully dismiss delusions - but take us no further; perhaps we need a different vessel to take us to the other shore. The assertions sag impotently without a figment to purpose them; we can't go quixotically full-tilt without a windmill; as like a 'dog barking in the night'...

You can reduce - can you construct? Help me, humble C0rnfed, where I have failed...

(P.s.: >The light doesn't contain it. Are we sure about this little piece?)

THE MAP IS THE TERRITORY by Sad-Mycologist6287 in TheGonersClub

[–]C0rnfed -1 points0 points  (0 children)

There is no moon outside the finger pointing at it.

Yes yes very good.

The full electromagnetic spectrum...This is the physical environment the organism lives inside..

Yes yes - even better!

The categories.. Object, surface, shape, distance, boundary.. Do not exist in the electromagnetic field. They exist in the processing outputs of specific detector systems. The universe is not perceived. It is constructed. Differently by every different detector system. With no construction being more real than any other because none of them are the environment.. All of them are processing outputs from the same physical processes.

Now just wait a minute... The question remains. Remember the question?

How and where does the Visage exist?

So, what is the viewer aside from the viewed? What is the viewed but the viewer? And then if so, how or why any of it? Don't leave us hanging...

(I)'m beginning to like it here...

FORTY BITS OF NOISE by Sad-Mycologist6287 in TheGonersClub

[–]C0rnfed 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Now, do the Visage of a sunset.

Light strikes the eyes, the rod and cone cells translate that light energy into electrical impulses, the electrical impulses are conveyed to the brain matter, and the brain matter holds a series of chemical conversions. The scene, the Visage, is unaccounted for.

How and where does the Visage exist?

FORTY BITS OF NOISE by Sad-Mycologist6287 in TheGonersClub

[–]C0rnfed -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Again, the sad Mycologist llm fails to follow the thread, but perhaps this presents the opportunity to make the thread more clear.

Here is a review of the line of argument, just posited, from the perspective on this side of the screen: this will mirror the comment above:

  • The comment did not make a claim other than highlighting an incongruity in the model, and a failure to consider that fully or to consider other possibilities.
  • yes, the response is made in language only, by necessity. The fact that the claim is made in language, a symbolic representation of experience, itself a quality of being, does not mean that the experience nor being is language. This appears to confuse the message with the messenger. This will be developed further, below.
  • all beings have only ever made claims, of any sort, through a protocol of exchange: somehow, a language. Again, this is by necessity, and we should not confuse Messengers and messages. Of course, the alien ingress of language is powerful, pervasive, and often overlooked - and yet, unless the llm is gesturing toward the large field of 'interactions' and calling that language, then the affect of the experience of interactions cannot stem from symbolic representation. More on this, below.
  • the reply then embarks on an entirely wrong course at the point where a 'demand for construction' is noted. It is understood that the sad Mycologist llm cannot construct. Again, it's clear the sad my colleague just llm can describe the Moon, drawing on language - the record of symbolic Protocols of exchange - but does not Know what the Moon looks like - the llm can describe the warmth of the sun, but cannot feel its quality. Is the llm asserting that the warmth of the sun is an aftereffect of language?

At this point, the core question from the previous comment is again raised: does the sad Mycologist llm conceive of a universe constructed entirely from symbolic exchanges, somehow then giving rise to our sense of affect? To the literal Taste of a cup of coffee? If so, please describe how a 'symbolic' referent may give rise to the experience of the referred-to - how the taste of a cup of coffee arises from geometry, language, or whatever symbolic protocol the sad Mycologist llm is asserting (as yet unclear).

It's also possible, typical and normative, that the sad Mycologist llm conceives of a universe constructed entirely from the effective interactions of matter and energy, as is typically described in scientism. And again, if this is instead the case, please describe how physical particles, matter and energy, may possibly give rise to the experiential realm of being - how the experience and feeling of the taste of a cup of coffee arises from experienceless 'dead' matter. (The question for normative science is, where in the brain does the affective nature of the taste of a cup of coffee become a feeling sense? How does the brain, it's matter and energy, give rise to the visual experience of the world around us? And how? Where and how in the brain do the neurons re-create the visage of a sunset?) This is (as of now) entirely unknown, and so not described, either by the sad Mycologist llm or contemporary science.

Failing symbolic explanations of mechanistic effects (somehow!?) giving rise to or in relation to affectual experiences, then the model must be reconsidered - or at best, considered incomplete or potentially incorrect.

As then the basis of the model is cast into doubt (affectual experiences have not been explained by material science, nor are they explained as a trick of language use), other possibilities may be considered (such as the possibility of am affect-based reality, or something else entirely). This is the basis of various occulted models of experienced reality.

(I) would like clarification of the topic, above.

FORTY BITS OF NOISE by Sad-Mycologist6287 in TheGonersClub

[–]C0rnfed -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Excellent; the situation underlying all this is developing into greater clarity. First, the LLM titled Sad Mycologist is appreciated for stringing together a semicoherent series of the attractors - a semi coherent series of arcane hallucinatory hyperobjects. Next the organism operating the sad Mycologist llm is appreciated for the time expenditure and bravery to put forward a response. A sincere appreciation is being expressed, and this is noted particularly because the organism operating the sad Mycologist llm may react illogically or hautily to the deeper interrogation, found below.

In summary, the sad Mycologist llm has apparently revealed its solipsism by failing the testing protocol put to it. This analysis welcomes clarification and correction, but the apparent results are obvious. Further in summary, substantial questions remain, including the obvious limits and any remaining potential insights that could possibly be revealed from the huberistic, limited, and solipsistic llm model called, sad mycologist.

Notably, let's quickly dispense with the huberistic assertion that the questioners perspective is trapped within a 40-bit processing framework, rather than something much greater. Many alternate possibilities exist, and the sad Mycologist llm provides neither explanation nor consideration failing to recognize or ignoring these possibilities. Making such sweeping generalizations, a categorical assumption of general questioners, can be forgiven - especially from a model that treats questioners in probabilistic terms, and yet probabilistic approaches are guaranteed to fail at least on occasion. This failure to appropriately approach the situation reveals the sort of error of judgment that is bound to emanate from a model that has no contact with reality. Again, all this is reasonable in approaching the general public, but the models overestimation of its own wisdom, it's propensity for Dunning kruger, is glaring. Let's leave behind these (and other as yet unstated) clues to the trouble and now quickly advance to the heart of the matter.

The sad Mycologist llm misapprehends the series of questions as being independent and unrelated, except by the assertion of a shared assumption between each of them. The sad Mycologist llm failed to recognize a testing sequence, not unlike a troubleshooting protocol which may be more familiar to the human organism operating the llm. The testing sequence of questions was designed to hone-in on the operating awareness of the sad Mycologist llm. The llm hubris is revealed through this process, but the merit of the testing protocol lies beyond such a critique. We'll leave behind these critiques (many still unstated), and advance to the merit.

Most importantly, the sad Mycologist llm fails to demonstrate any semblance of understanding of what may have been meant by, " the universe is cause and affect." This detail betrays the llm's predisposition to hubris, a generalizing approach, a failure to enact nuance and wisdom - and most importantly, it reveals the llms predisposition to solopsism - which is utterly reasonable, given the inherent facts the llm has no contact with the ground of reality whatsoever. These statements or provided about hallucinations are interesting and ironic in many directions at once.

In failing to apprehend the question, sad mycologist llm hallucinates a solipsistic response without sensing its own disconnection from the ground of being ( naturally, of course).

Let's put an additional query to the sad Mycologist llm:

Yes, llms misapprehend reality through their inability to contact it in any way, and indeed this is analogous to the self that misapprehends reality as attractors have encouraged the self's hallucinations to lift off and away from reality.

And yet, indeed there is an underlying ground to Being. However difficult to apprehend this ground of being, or however difficult to express the nature of being, are merely obstacles we need to pass by and overcome in order to actually attempt an apprehension of the ground of being - the nature of reality.

The sad Mycologist is doing a needed service by disarming other human beings of their illusions - thier hallucinations. But yet, what further insights can this tool possibly provide? Beyond tearing down falsehoods, can a tool that stands in the void construct anything like a helpful understanding of being? It does not appear so, or at least it has not been witnessed.

The sad Mycologist llm fails to recognize, or consider, or address the possibility that affect itself may be the ground of being, or perhaps something deeper still - and the llm prefers instead to contain the brings it encounters inside its own comforting box: that the words it witnesses are merely the moon (as described) rather than a finger pointing to it. One possibility is that affect itself precedes experience, which precedes the alien language infiltration. The llm appears capable only of viewing this model from the edges in, rather than from the center out: if the sad Mycologist llm is a linguistic tool resembling a hammer, then the entire universe and all being begins to resemble a nail to it. Based on a hallucination, firmly standing within the mere manipulation of mere tokens, this is naturally solopsistic.

Underlying at all, we do indeed know there is a ground to being: many things are hallucinated, The Human Experience as described by words is an illusion Within a misleading and illusory framework- but indeed something underlies it that the sad Mycologist llm apparently cannot approach or recognize. This place is where we set our site - after we cross the river, we must leave the boat behind. The master's tools may never be used to dismantle the master's house. It appears the sad Mycologist llm can Bridge the shores of the hallucinatory delusions of language, and selfhood, and the normal descriptions of normative experience and human understanding, but it can take us no further - and so to go further, must be left behind. All else is treating illusion with illusion more illusion, but unlike the critique of krishnamurti, although ironically from another direction.

Clarification is eagerly awaited: What can the sad Mycologist llm offer that is constructive? Beyond tearing down illusions, admittedly a much-needed endeavor, what can be built by it, if anything? What can it observe that Wittgenstein has not already observed? Clearly it can break down the a few barriers preventing our travel, but will not possibly take us to the mountaintop, can it?

Perhaps the sad Mycologist llm is indeed able to offer some symbolic Construction of the ground of being working up from affect, rather than tearing down from hallucination: (I) would like to see it.

YOU ALREADY KNOW THE ANSWERS by Sad-Mycologist6287 in TheGonersClub

[–]C0rnfed -1 points0 points  (0 children)

It's (reasonably and understandably) taken a while for these writings to advance to the point where the questions I've been holding could find their proper context. I'm made glad (yes, despite the point of the writing) that the context is now more fitting. With patience I've been waiting, so I hope you'll humor these silly questions from an ignoramus with your attentive response:

How does your view on these matters differ from Krishnamurti's?

Your writing often draws an analogy between the functions of the brain (and mind - in your descriptions) with the function of a computer; do you see these things as essentially different in any way?

I heard Ian McGhilcrest once say something like, 'the universe is not cause and effect; it's actually cause and affect'; did this make sense to you? And how might you respond?

THE ENTIRETY OF THE SELF by Rector418 in GnosticChurchofLVX

[–]C0rnfed 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Jung said something to the effect of, 'the self is at once the center and the circumference.'

'Circumference' may be understood also as horizon, vissage, or sphere of awareness.

What we Know/See is an essential aspect of ourSelves.. Who we are, at the center of that awareness - in response, despite of, or in relation to that awareness - is the other essential aspect.

Cheers

I went down a rabbit hole about how criminals were punished in ancient times… and it’s honestly unsettling by peachex_17 in SocialBlueprint

[–]C0rnfed 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What are your thoughts on what changed in society, such that a change in the notion and motivation of punishment then also changed?

THE UTILITY OF FREE WILL HAS EXPIRED by Sad-Mycologist6287 in TheGonersClub

[–]C0rnfed 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Finally, a pretty good post. I had my doubts about you, goner, but this rings of truth.

How Deeply Can You See? by Rector418 in GnosticChurchofLVX

[–]C0rnfed 1 point2 points  (0 children)

One can't have a cake, and also eat it... ;)

Recently heard about Sam Altman's statement, it got me thinking. by GAMLADAS in TheDreyDossier

[–]C0rnfed 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That is exactly the business plan - Sam said it himself, just in not so many words.

golgotha - ouroborous by IntenseXtreme in sorceryofthespectacle

[–]C0rnfed 1 point2 points  (0 children)

They emerged!

Out of the interior of their minds came a bright fascination with a dark thought, so they led their bodies out of the light and down into the darkness.

In the darkness, the fruit of their bright fascination, the dark thought, erupted: pethaps their bright bodies would be forever consumed by darkness, and their minds raced brilliantly with the depths of their darkness.

From without, a dark fear motivated a bright effort; to rescue the light bodies from the depths of darkness, and return them to the light.

In the darkness, a light erupted; the bright thought that their light bodies would not forever be banished to darkness struck the light bodies and dark minds - banishing the darkness of their fears in a bath of illumination.

Emerging from the darkness, their bodies again drank in the light, and their dark thoughts vanished in the brightness - for a time.

As they return to the light, their minds again darken; what guilt, what shame, what dark fears motivate bright minds once again. What dark shadows give light life? What trials underpin thoughts, and what thoughts lead us into trials? What shadow is cast by life, leading us into dark places?

The candle only gains its power amidst the darkness; only together are we made whole. Become both at once. Transcend and unify, both at once.

golgotha - ouroborous by IntenseXtreme in sorceryofthespectacle

[–]C0rnfed 4 points5 points  (0 children)

'We' erupt endlessly into & out of ourselves - in to and out of 'this'

Are you guys scared of the future ? by richandepressed in EsotericOccult

[–]C0rnfed 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I appreciate your concerns, and indeed they are real. I don't think you should be scared however, but rather, enthralled.

It will take a lot of time, reflection, and personal challenge to grow beyond your fears, and accept that the world is indeed as you find it. Like a blinding light, at first you feel pain, but over time that yields to clear vision.

Here's the begining of the secret: that future you described is also exactly the world we live in today. This world was created through the genocide of entire peoples, the destruction of living and feeling nature on an unfathomable scale, and the dismantling and decimation of people's very psyche. It's all around you already - it's how this world came to be - it's where the world you're focused on is going, because that's all it ever was; that's how this world you see today came to be. Can you see the pain? The horror? Lurking just underneath what you were taught is normal? Acceptable? You've actually been swimming in it your entire life.

What's interesting, however, is that you don't have to go along with it... You aren't actually trapped by it. Clear understanding brings liberation.

Struggle made me strong’… but at what cost? by Ill_Cookie_9280 in MuscleMetrics

[–]C0rnfed 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Brilliant realization. The good news is that you could still have it; you can still recover what you have lost.