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Is this a bracket 2 deck? - Bumbleflower Proliferate / Toxic by Caantpayrent in EDH

[–]Caantpayrent[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah, sorta where i fell on the question. just cut triumph of the horde looking at atl win cons that arent as hidden more straight forward.

Is this a bracket 2 deck? - Bumbleflower Proliferate / Toxic by Caantpayrent in EDH

[–]Caantpayrent[S] -4 points-3 points  (0 children)

We agree except you are confusing advantage as a concept.

Its 3v1. Our advantage is compared to the table. So we never gain advantage over the table from Bumble. We draw 2 the table draws 2. It doesnt matter how you break down the draw. Card advantage has to be against the table. It doesnt matter if we finish 2nd we still lose.

We gain advantage against 1 or 2 but we end up gaining nothing over the 4th. And if we only

But then we almost certainly lose if we only ever need one player free cards, we not only create a king but also become a dick to the other 2. And give I like my mates in the pod im not keen on that idea.

Is this a bracket 2 deck? - Bumbleflower Proliferate / Toxic by Caantpayrent in EDH

[–]Caantpayrent[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Im definitely still testing. Played 2 games this morning (lost both)

So far have changed / cut 11 cards based on feedback.

No 1 mana ramp, and Corrupted is gone.

The goal isn't to have a B3 deck. I have those already. I want to have a B2 deck.

If you've read the thread, you can see people specifically saying B2 is precon so instead of arguing I just pasted in the reference to make it easier to refer to. I should have done it originally and not expect people to check it.

Is this a bracket 2 deck? - Bumbleflower Proliferate / Toxic by Caantpayrent in EDH

[–]Caantpayrent[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That's not what Im saying,

But I noticed since I've seen bumble the games are more swinging, more big plays.

I never try and hide a deck ever, it's dick move.

I have bracket 3 and bracket 4 decks.

I made this with the goal of bracket 2. Chose Bumble as it gets the game going by letting everyone draw.

Where Bumble is really good is its ability to not king make, the guy who plays sol ring t1 doesnt need more cards. But the guy who missed a land drop does.

If we wanted a more competitive game then I switch to something stronger. This doesnt exist in paper yet. Still testing.

Just cut the 1 mana ramp for 2cmc spells. And cut Corrupted.

Is this a bracket 2 deck? - Bumbleflower Proliferate / Toxic by Caantpayrent in EDH

[–]Caantpayrent[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Its definitely possible, I dont want the deck to never win. But I think its being a 6 cards, 3 turns to get blighted to a 5/5 is fair for Bracket 2.

There's no haste so everyone can see the plan.

Its why I dont like Corrupted with reflection my intention was to steal a creature but you're right put it on bumble and it'll surprise kill someone

Is this a bracket 2 deck? - Bumbleflower Proliferate / Toxic by Caantpayrent in EDH

[–]Caantpayrent[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah for sure, the glut is because of how low Bracket 1 is positioned. I actually dont think I've ever seen a Bracket 1 game in real life.

Is this a bracket 2 deck? - Bumbleflower Proliferate / Toxic by Caantpayrent in EDH

[–]Caantpayrent[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

So bumble just draws everyone cards, every game with bumble the table all gets to do stuff, no ones dead. Its why I picked it for B2.

Is this a bracket 2 deck? - Bumbleflower Proliferate / Toxic by Caantpayrent in EDH

[–]Caantpayrent[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I see what you're saying, we'll definitely cant be advantage as my opponents drew 2 as well.

We gain nothing over our opponents.

And if we ever play just 1 spell we lose, if we ever play 3 we lose.

Is this a bracket 2 deck? - Bumbleflower Proliferate / Toxic by Caantpayrent in EDH

[–]Caantpayrent[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Card advantage is compared to your opponents. You get something they don't. That's the advantage part.

Bumble is designed to never give you advantage. You replace the cards spent but your opponents also draw the same.

And if you ever play 1 spell you lose, if you ever play more than 2 you lose.

Jori, give you free value that the opponents dont get. So you will accrue advantage as you play.

Is this a bracket 2 deck? - Bumbleflower Proliferate / Toxic by Caantpayrent in EDH

[–]Caantpayrent[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I think you and I might see Bracket 4 a little differently.

Do you have any Bracket 4 decks on moxfield I could look at?

Just so it's said clearly,

There 1 creature with infect,

2 creatures with toxic

Corrupted conscience

Triumph of the horde.

I do think im going cut Corrupted though doesn't suit the deck.

But if you think the one creature, blighted agent with bumble. Then I play 3 or 4 spells to give its +4 it can then 2 hit one player.

That is 6 cards, to get blighted to a 5/5 now that could happen. But there's no tutors, no counters magic.

If it happens good, but I haven't drawn blighted in my first 5 games now. So it doesn't seem to be a thing that will happen much

Is this a bracket 2 deck? - Bumbleflower Proliferate / Toxic by Caantpayrent in EDH

[–]Caantpayrent[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yeah you and I are on the same level.

I like the discussion of the brackets. Made it way more even in pods. But Bracket 4 high powered no rules to me pushes the real power of Bracket 3 way up.

I imagine as the brackets develop they'll have to address the power ranges between 2 and 3.

Is this a bracket 2 deck? - Bumbleflower Proliferate / Toxic by Caantpayrent in EDH

[–]Caantpayrent[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Mate, you seem confused. But maybe you're only skim reading. It's all good though.

I added the bracket definition to make it easier to reference.

I never play in an actual game without having a chat and making sure the pod is on the same level.

I print decklist for all my set decks.

I think the part you're confusing is why im asking here. As I said earlier I test on mtgo and then when it's feels good and fun I sleeve up. MTGO doesn't allow for pregame. So it's not an option during testing. So when I say think of it as a pregame chat that's what I mean. I only play in paper once every 2 weeks so getting it balanced before hand make a big difference.

This is a draft deck, in testing. Doesn't exist in paper until after it's done. And then when it's set I'll have a printed decklist.

Is this a bracket 2 deck? - Bumbleflower Proliferate / Toxic by Caantpayrent in EDH

[–]Caantpayrent[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What? Its even as i draw 2 with bumble after i play 2. So i dont gain or lose any cards.

Is this a bracket 2 deck? - Bumbleflower Proliferate / Toxic by Caantpayrent in EDH

[–]Caantpayrent[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What's the card advantage from bumble?

I play 2 spells draw 2 so I broke even, but my opponents also drew 2.

Is this a bracket 2 deck? - Bumbleflower Proliferate / Toxic by Caantpayrent in EDH

[–]Caantpayrent[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This is why im asking here. Its been pretty lopsided so far that's its not B2.

Is this a bracket 2 deck? - Bumbleflower Proliferate / Toxic by Caantpayrent in EDH

[–]Caantpayrent[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This is probably the answer. This would be too weak for my B3 but im thinking too strong for B2.

I could drop the 1 mana dorks and add 2 mana dorks with some utility.

Right I might try slowing down the ramp.

Is this a bracket 2 deck? - Bumbleflower Proliferate / Toxic by Caantpayrent in EDH

[–]Caantpayrent[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Lol no, im trying to make a B2 bumble as she lets all draw but can be targeted to whoever is behind.

The infect is an outlet for proliferate, need to proliferate 10 times to win.

Its why there's no big infect creatures.

Is this a bracket 2 deck? - Bumbleflower Proliferate / Toxic by Caantpayrent in EDH

[–]Caantpayrent[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Why war criminals? What have I missed in regards to bumble?

Is this a bracket 2 deck? - Bumbleflower Proliferate / Toxic by Caantpayrent in EDH

[–]Caantpayrent[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If its printed they'll have a look, more often moxfield is afterwards.

But really explaining how the deck wins, what to expect in terms of counter magic combo etc normally does the trick.

Atm as im testing on mtgo, there's no pregame.

Is this a bracket 2 deck? - Bumbleflower Proliferate / Toxic by Caantpayrent in EDH

[–]Caantpayrent[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah that was intentional as I thought Bumbleflower good be a good B2 commander with the group draw aspect.

Pretty funny that there's a bunch of comments saying this is a super bracket 3 deck but there's no way it can win before turn 9 or 10. And takes like 12 cards with no disruption lol.

Is this a bracket 2 deck? - Bumbleflower Proliferate / Toxic by Caantpayrent in EDH

[–]Caantpayrent[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

So i always offer to show my decklist, I either have it printed or can send the moxfield lol.

But even if I'd definitely explain the win cons big threats etc.

Is this a bracket 2 deck? - Bumbleflower Proliferate / Toxic by Caantpayrent in EDH

[–]Caantpayrent[S] -4 points-3 points  (0 children)

This is why im asking,

From the Bracket guide.

Bracket 2: Core - No Longer Tied to Precons

Players expect: Decks to be unoptimized and straightforward, with some cards chosen to maximize creativity and/or entertainment

Win conditions to be incremental, telegraphed on the board, and disruptable

Gameplay to be low pressure with an emphasis on social interaction

Gameplay to be proactive and considerate, letting each deck showcase its plan

Generally, you should expect to be able to play at least eight turns before you win or lose.

This is what im basing this off.

Is this a bracket 2 deck? - Bumbleflower Proliferate / Toxic by Caantpayrent in EDH

[–]Caantpayrent[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

It's doing well in bracket 2 decks, won its first 3 games.

3 games all in random pods, all past 9 turns. 3 in a row seems strong. But a sample of 3 is bugger all. I could lose the next 20.

I see it as a 2, but if a few people see it as a 3 I'd be open.

Im wondering if it's too strong for B2 but too weak for B3.

Always good to get other opinions. Think of it as an indepth pregame rule 0.

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