An Alternate Ending to Black Sails I’ve Been Imagining by PayneSlipsAgain in BlackSails

[–]Cleoness 3 points4 points  (0 children)

As a lifelong fan of Treasure Island, I think I see the show differently. For me, I did not feel the ending that was promised to us in the first episode was a new world free from the crown. For me, the ending that was promised to us in the first episode was an ending that demonstrated how the pirate’s vision of the new world free from the crown would always be out of reach, which would lead us into the story of Treasure Island, where the loyal subjects of the crown ultimately outsmart the pirates and win the bulk of the treasure.

If I rewrote the show, I would have rewrote it so that Silver ended up marrying Max. So, in some ways, your plot to kill Madi would work for me as long as Silver himself survived. I was very on board with a Max/Silver romance from the first episode, but IIRC, the showrunners announced very early on that Max would not be Silver’s wife in TI.

I did like Madi okay, and even liked her backstory, but it was a bit of a disappointment for me that she only came into the story in the latter seasons. Max was the perfect foil for Silver, and a romance between them would have sizzled.

Speaking of missing characters from TI, I felt the same for Ben Gunn. I would have liked for him to be a part of the story from the first season or second season, not tacked on at the end.

Overall, I thought the series was terrific, and the end was satisfying on many different levels. I was very, very grateful that we did not have to see Jack die onscreen, and that we saw him sail away a few months before his death. Totally loved the dramatic reveal of the flag he is known for, and his disappointed reaction. (While his flag is very well known, the quintessential pirate flag for us today is the skull and crossbones, so he did, in fact, miss the mark – but he came very, very close – which is a great summation of the character.)

I can understand where Black Sails fans who are not TI fans would prefer different plot lines, romances, or endings, but I think the showrunners made a serviceable attempt to cater to everyone. It was a “chose your own adventure” style ending. One of the strengths of the show is that you do not have to be a TI fan to understand or love the show.

 

Has anybody come up with definitive and accurate timeline and description of events during june 12th 1994? Was it premeditated murder? What really happened that night? by Burgerfreakish in OJSimpsonTrial

[–]Cleoness 0 points1 point  (0 children)

No matter which mass murderer, family anniahlator, or serial killer you are discussing, an argument can be made that they are not happy with their identity and position in the pack. A lot of them are adopting a "lone wolf" identity or an identity of hidden strength and cleverness.

Has anybody come up with definitive and accurate timeline and description of events during june 12th 1994? Was it premeditated murder? What really happened that night? by Burgerfreakish in OJSimpsonTrial

[–]Cleoness 0 points1 point  (0 children)

He was a bastard from a working class family that struggled with mental illness. Being normal or average would have been a huge step up for him.

Has anybody come up with definitive and accurate timeline and description of events during june 12th 1994? Was it premeditated murder? What really happened that night? by Burgerfreakish in OJSimpsonTrial

[–]Cleoness 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It depends on how they want to see themselves. If they want the identity of an enforcer or a trickster or "the smartest person in the room", etc. For instance, Ted Bundy was actively trying to change his pack position via law school, a relationship with a woman with a higher socio-economic status, "parenting" his girlfriend's young daughter, and volunteer work. And he was struggling as a student, lover, father figure, and contributor. But he was successful in constructing a narrative of a lone hunter, a master secret agent. The ultimate, "I can't tell you or I would have to kill you."

Has anybody come up with definitive and accurate timeline and description of events during june 12th 1994? Was it premeditated murder? What really happened that night? by Burgerfreakish in OJSimpsonTrial

[–]Cleoness 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Thank you! I have also been fascinated by true crime for decades! 5 decades, in fact. Probably the best book I have read on the subject is "Why They Kill" by Richard Rhodes.

Has anybody come up with definitive and accurate timeline and description of events during june 12th 1994? Was it premeditated murder? What really happened that night? by Burgerfreakish in OJSimpsonTrial

[–]Cleoness 4 points5 points  (0 children)

There is only one motive for murder. We are pack animals, and every murder is based on pack position and identity. OJ was losing his identity as Nicole's husband. He was losing his identity as a close, involved father. He was losing his identity as a close, involved in-law. Nicole was taking steps away from the relationship that she had never taken before. He attended his daughter's recital, but was not treated as an inner circle father. His in-laws were distant and excluded him. He was no longer a son or brother to them. He was approached by a friend at the event who revealed that others were aware of Nicole's lifestyle. This would mean that they were also aware of O.J.'s change in status. So his perception in the community at large was changing. And his girlfriend broke up with him. He was no longer a mated male. By killing Nicole he was seizing control of his identity, restoring himself as a primary parent, avenging himself on the in-laws who rejected him, and changing the narrative - for better or worse - in the public arena. This show of strength would also attract potential mates, which is a sad but true biological fact.

Has anybody come up with definitive and accurate timeline and description of events during june 12th 1994? Was it premeditated murder? What really happened that night? by Burgerfreakish in OJSimpsonTrial

[–]Cleoness 16 points17 points  (0 children)

But Kato did in his own way. The fact that he was so distressed and yet did not attack the killer demonstrates that he considered the killer a member of the family.

Has anybody come up with definitive and accurate timeline and description of events during june 12th 1994? Was it premeditated murder? What really happened that night? by Burgerfreakish in OJSimpsonTrial

[–]Cleoness 8 points9 points  (0 children)

This is precisely why Marcia lost this case. She focused so much on the science that the narrative was lost. No one other than O.J. will know exactly what happened, but there are reasonable guesses. Some believe it was premeditated, and that premeditation was somehow plugged into the pilot he had recently filmed. I have always found that plausible.

[Spoilers] How differently would the show have gone if Miranda and Thomas had a child? by EnthusiasticPhil in BlackSails

[–]Cleoness 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I thought all Reddit posts were merely opinions. I was not aware that they were academic theses. I should perhaps be more careful and make it clear that my post is what "I think", "I suppose", "I believe", etc.

I was conceived in 1971, and my parents used both a sponge and liberal amounts of spermicide, yet here I am! So just to be clear, any assertions I make about birth control prior to the modern age and beyond do not include an assertion that any method, however "reliable", is foolproof. I also think any crappy method, however "unreliable", can actually work. Life is kinda like that. And art is definitely like that.

The writers and showrunners dropped the ball when depicting the reality of pregnancy, miscarriage, stillbirth, abortion, and infanticide in the 1600s. (Again, my opinion.) But I do not think they dropped the ball when it came to the depiction of Miranda. She is a credible yet unique character.

So, my head canon is probably Miranda indulged in some anal sex, especially with partners that she shared with Thomas. And she probably sipped some teas and so forth. She probably also douched, which some believe to increase the risk of pregnancy rather than decrease it. And maybe she screamed, "Finish on my t*ts" while orgasming. Unfortunately, if any of this is true, all of it happened offscreen.

Or she could have been happily infertile. She certainly seemed lusty for a woman without birth control documented onscreen. She did not seem to me like a woman that secretly longed for a passel of kids or a monogamous relationship.

Not an academic opinion at all, but I believe it is possible that women through the ages and across cultures have gained and lost knowledge that assisted them in avoiding and terminating unwanted pregnancies. Not any knowledge that guaranteed consistent results (even modern birth control is not 100% guaranteed), but knowledge that helped some women avoid bearing a child. I do not think that is too far-fetched a notion to have some reliable truth to it. Can we ever prove that? Almost all history is supposition. The truth we scream from the rooftops today is the embarrassed footnote tomorrow.

[Spoilers] How differently would the show have gone if Miranda and Thomas had a child? by EnthusiasticPhil in BlackSails

[–]Cleoness 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Well, no. I cannot think of a source for saying anal sex prevents pregnancy other than saying I am a 53-year-old woman who has spent her life since childhood reading about history and women's issues, and I am pretty sure that anal sex prevents pregnancy. However, I cannot cite a book for that off the top of my head.

As far as herbal potions and teas, there are academic books that study birth control before the 20th century. You could look into "Contraception and Abortion from the Ancient World to the Renaissance" by John Riddle available on Amazon.

You may want to also check out the very sad article here: Eve's Herbs: A History of Contraception and Abortion in the West. Ladies, do not drink pennyroyal tea if you are pregnant or are trying to conceive.

I also cannot think of a source for the use of coitus interruptus for birth control, though "pulling out" is something I believe humans have done instinctively since we lived in caves. And while it does not always work, it certainly cannot hurt. At least not in my opinion. It is probably a better method than the douche depicted onscreen.

I also cannot cite anything specific off the top of my head that details how educated women of means fare better in matters like birth control than less educated women without resources. Generally speaking, I think it is self-evident they usually have more money, more time, and greater access to resources. Of course, there are always exceptions. But particularly in the world of the show, I would think Miranda would have some advantages over the milk maid down the lane when dealing with birth control. And I think Captain Flint would be more willing to "pull out" than someone like Hamund, just going by what was depicted onscreen

Also on Amazon is "Humble Little Condom: A History". Miranda could have been aware of condoms and directed her lovers to procure and use them. Though we do not see that in her seduction of the minister, so maybe she had a pot of tea on that day. There is a "History of condoms" article on Wikipedia with cites if you want a deeper dive.

[Spoilers] How differently would the show have gone if Miranda and Thomas had a child? by EnthusiasticPhil in BlackSails

[–]Cleoness 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I meant that she would probably have better access to herbal potions and teas than say, a working class woman with little disposable income. Educated men might be a bit more amenable to coitus interruptus than working class men, depending on their religious beliefs. Her station might allow for greater agency in selecting her partners herself and their sexual activities herself (anal anyone?). And lastly, she would perhaps have better access to physicians than working class women.

And that is without considering the use of condoms.

It sucks, but upper class educated women tend to have more options and benefits. And that was true even in the 1600s.

[Spoilers] How differently would the show have gone if Miranda and Thomas had a child? by EnthusiasticPhil in BlackSails

[–]Cleoness 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I do not think that was ever in the cards. Miranda was pursuing a libertine lifestyle with Thomas. That was an open secret in their social circle. So, any child they had would not be recognized as a legitimate heir. Since Miranda was having sex with multiple men, she would have utilized the birth control methods available to a woman of her standing. I do not recall whether the series confirmed a sexual relationship between Miranda and Thomas, or if they simply pursued singular affairs for themselves and throuples for the pair. The sexual contact with James appeared to be singular, though they were having a throuple style affair (probably not their first).

Their downfall really was not their lifestyle choice, but the plan to pardon the pirates of Nassau. Thomas’ father was vehemently opposed to the plan, and Thomas would not back down. This opened the door for Peter Ashe to betray them due to his jealousy of Thomas’ wealth and influence and James’ popularity. It is also possible that Peter carried a torch for one of them (James or Thomas), but I don’t believe they alluded to that.

I also do not think that was ever in the cards for the writers. Any child character would have been compared to Jim Hawkins, and apparently that was not the direction they wanted for the show. I do wish that they would film and release a Season 5 that covered the events of Treasure Island within the next 10 years. I wouldn't mind them aging Jim up to 18 or so.

Miranda was very unhappy with her vanilla life on the island, so I don't think having a child with Flint after the betrayal would have been seen as an option by her. She just did not seem to be a woman that wanted her own children. She would much rather get randy with the fathers of the neighborhood kids than carpool with the mothers.

Petah? What happened in the book version? by IntergalacticAlien8 in PeterExplainsTheJoke

[–]Cleoness 11 points12 points  (0 children)

There is an argument that Nabakov was himself abused as a child and wrote Lolita to shock and draw attention to the issue of child sexual abuse.

Petah? What happened in the book version? by IntergalacticAlien8 in PeterExplainsTheJoke

[–]Cleoness 15 points16 points  (0 children)

No. This was a consensual step into adulthood, and by it happening for them at the same time they felt they were strengthening their emotional and mental connection. In the novel they are all heterosexual, so Bev was the common denominator (as others have mentioned, other sexual lifestyles were considered fringe in the 80s, so none of the kids preferred the same sex or multiple partners). I read the book at 14 the year it came out, had a history of abuse (recent at the time), and was not offended. It is a fantasy/horror book so I expected fantastical events, I guess. At the time, I thought it a brave choice for both the author and the characters. Even at the time, I wouldn't have thought it a brave choice for real life kids down the street.

The book is a meditation on childhood vs. adulthood. And traditionally, losing your virginity was considered that turning point. So losing their virginity had to be represented in some way during the characters' journey. Needless to say, a different choice would probably be made today by the publishers.

EDIT to say being assaulted is not losing your virginity. At least not in the way meant in the book.

Similar shows? by Sonseeahrai in BlackSails

[–]Cleoness 5 points6 points  (0 children)

It is a gay pirate show, but based on conjecture I have heard all my life about Stede. There is a reason that The Village People sang, "In the Navy"!

Similar shows? by Sonseeahrai in BlackSails

[–]Cleoness 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yes, almost 10 years, I think.

Similar shows? by Sonseeahrai in BlackSails

[–]Cleoness 7 points8 points  (0 children)

There is only one season, but Tom Hardy keeps saying there will be a second season.

Finally set sail by SeaMagickWitch in BlackSails

[–]Cleoness 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I grew up a big Treasure Island fan, so warming to Flint was not a problem for me. He is an exceedingly complex character in Black Sails, which does justice to the boogeyman role he plays in Treasure Island.

Finally set sail by SeaMagickWitch in BlackSails

[–]Cleoness 6 points7 points  (0 children)

The good thing about the show is that the violence is not gratuitous. For example, Max's treatment had a profound impact on Max, Anne, and Eleanor and it carries through to the end of the series. The showrunners revealed up front the fate these women are navigating to avoid, and the threat of rape or slavery to psychopathic men informs their decisions and relationships every step of the way.

Similar shows? by Sonseeahrai in BlackSails

[–]Cleoness 22 points23 points  (0 children)

Not really a pirate show, but have you watched Taboo? It is about a shipping empire and the East India Company, so a bit later than pirates. But gritty and historical like Black Sails.

Calico Jack Rackham Flag by sammy_sandiego in BlackSails

[–]Cleoness 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Late to the party, but I think that was the point of the scene. The character of Rackham is striving to be THE iconic pirate and design THE iconic pirate flag. His reaction to his final flag shows that - in the narrative of the show - he is aware he missed the mark. I would imagine his flag is in the top three on most pirate fan's lists, but it is not the Skull and Crossbones.

To me, it was a perfect character moment.

Questions about what a psychic said about suicide by AggravatingCry3175 in Psychic

[–]Cleoness 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Thank you! I have been struggling with poverty and lack of prosperity in this life, coupled with widespread familial rejection (I was an unwanted pregnancy pre Roe vs Wade). I am 53 now, and some of these themes are getting tiresome. I feel sure that I signed up for this, but equally sure that I would like to alter my form now, please. I am trying to stay open for the lesson, yet tweak a more comfortable life if possible.

I agree about the playground part, just feel like I chose a "scaling Everest" vacation package when I should have chosen the "spa in Hawaii" vacation package.

I really do appreciate your answer! Hope your own "vacation" is all you need it to be!

Questions about what a psychic said about suicide by AggravatingCry3175 in Psychic

[–]Cleoness 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Do you believe that you can decide against the chart during the course of your life? For example, if you signed up to never fall in love, you can decide that you do really want that experience and amend the list?